I have to admit I can now see the reasons why the mod's closed this sort of thread in the first place. It has already started to descend into personal attacks.
The real shame here is that when places like AAM can't discuss the matter in a balanced light people head to forums like the propertypin and only get their very one sided view on the market.
You tell me.
The Irish Times is a national newspaper.
Do you think that, for example, the Irish Independent or Sunday Tribune follow completely different financial models to the Irish Times, and don't rely on property advertising for a substantial portion of their revenue?
Certainly, the Tribune takes it property advertising seriously enough to sack its Business Editor. Richard Delevan, when he remarked negatively on the housing market, linking it to the fact that Ken MacDonald couldn't sell his house:
[broken link removed]
Are you suggesting that postings to internet forums are more widely read than the property supplements of national newspapers?
Are you suggesting that VIs such as estate agents no longer have influence with the media, and that's we're some kind of whole new socialist paradigm where advertising has no influence on editorial?
Why would a ban be needed and not individual bans or slaps on the wrist? Isn't that what all the other threads have happen? It will only benefit people when we start making reasoned arguments based on fact or calculated estimates rather than simply indulging in smearing the reputation of those you disagree with.
To be honest most EA's that I know believe its better to be open and honest about the state of things otherwise you lose credibility and you won't sell anything just by saying alls well in the world.
You're having a laugh surely? Gangsters the lot of them!
The times is a national paper but most counties outside of dublin will go with local papers because they are cheaper and target their specific audience.
In Limerick it is the Limerick leader and they run a property supplement that is financed seperately from the paper and having read the editorials for the last 12 months they haven't papered over the cracks.
I would read internet forums before I would go through a supplement.
Regarding your assertion that EA's influence the media, i would say that there is very little influence if any.
I think it is closer to 55,000 but thats not the point, the point is that there are so many sub sections outside of Dublin to also consider when making statements about the 'market'.Good on the Leader, if so, but with a circulation of 23,000, it's a blip taken in the context of the failure of Irish newspapers on behalf of the consumer.
Presumably most estate agents don't see it that way. Otherise, they would not be handing over millions of euro to newspapers in order to print nice fluffy property supplement in which hard-bitten hacks such as, er, Isabel Morton, complain about first-time buyers having the audacity to ask tough questions to estate agents. (http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/....html) Instead, they would be giving those millions of euro to anonymous posters on internet forums.
There was a time where property was no.1 and everyone got behind it, the papers went with what was going on and reaped huge rewards in the ad revenues that were coming in. If any of them breached their codes of ethics and allowed themselves to be influenced that is an accusation they can stand up to themselves, if any EA company flexed their muscles and earned better deals for their company and clients then they were very smart and used their acumen.Do you really believe that the single industry responsible for funding a huge proportion of newspaper revenue has no influence on them? That property supplements - which are not marked as funded or commerical or advertorials, but actual news - just happen to be completely positive about property by sheer coincidence? That a newspaper would sack a senior editor for a wisecrack at any Joe Blogg?
You are delightfully innocent.
Surely you can see that the mood has changed and the level of gloom being printed can mean only that there is no current influence there from EA's.
When did i say anything about no not being a good time to buy. Now is a time when buyers hold the cards, they can try for a bargain or walk away and wait for another one. Your mixing up being open and honest with telling things exactly as you see them.I'm willing to offer €50 to the charity of your choice if you can show me either a press release or a newspaper article by any of the major estate agents that said, at any point, "now" is not a good time to buy.
Surely you can see that the mood has changed and the level of gloom being printed can mean only that there is no current influence there from EA's.
When did i say anything about no not being a good time to buy. Now is a time when buyers hold the cards, they can try for a bargain or walk away and wait for another one. Your mixing up being open and honest with telling things exactly as you see them.
Its very like the Public v private sector debates really.
There are many people that believe you have to think one way or the other and take it very personally when you disagree with their opinions.
I thought this would be a great debate to have at the moment. It started out as a discussion and then turned into an attack on estate agents and mortgage advisors.
I regret responding like with like, to the verbal insults questioning my motives for posting positive opinions on the industry, but its difficult when you have people who wont actually properly discuss or expand on their views, instead they prefer to simply throw mud at your suggestions . . .
Ah, the "level of gloom" as indicated by what appear to be weekly urgings by the newspapers to tell us that we've hit the bottom of the market - all together now, children, NOW IS THE TIME TO BUY!
The only thing this indicates is that newspapers, while happy enough to hype up the market for their financiers during the bubble, are not about to make themselves appear completely ludicrous by doing a Chemical Ali (Property Tom?) and tell people that prices are still going up while they're actually going down. But you seem to think that this indicates not merely a new reality on their part, but active pessismism, working away at the nation's vital bodily fluids...
Ah, right - it's always a good time to buy, it's never a bad time to buy, there's no such thing as objective reality, and matter is simply energy condensed to a slow vibration.
Well talk about spitting out the dummy!!!!
Do you all think you could take it down a tone and try and play nice? Please, gentlemen.
The nasty personal comments are really more a reflection of the posters making them than the people they are directed at. And the word trolling adequately describes a lot of the posts in recent times.
In the end of the day, it is for responsible adults to make their own responsible decisions as to whether or not they buy now. This country has such a well developed sense of victimhood and blame gaming that that very simple concept seems to have been lost.
Vested interests or no vested interests, it does boil down to personal responsibility.
mf
Mrman has there ever been a time not to buy?
To be honest most EA's that I know believe its better to be open and honest about the state of things otherwise you lose credibility and you won't sell anything just by saying alls well in the world.
Do you think that in a property market with rapidly dropping values one should wait?There can't be a general answer to this because nobody is the same.
Do you think that in a property market with rapidly dropping values one should wait?
That neatly sums up property buying. Which going back to the OP's question is the perfect answer.I have clients who are very specific about where they want to live. If they see the property that they particularly want, at a price they are willing to pay, they should and will buy it.
That neatly sums up property buying. Which going back to the OP's question is the perfect answer.
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