What's positive about this? People have less to spend - therefore, they will purchase less goods, which will have a knock-on effect on retail, which in turn puts people out of work, who will then have less to spend... Being positive about this is a bit like thinking "I've had my legs cut off - never mind, I'll spend less on trousers".
"Prudent" = "terrified to lend money to even reputable and worthwhile businesses, because, oops, we gave it all to developers while not encouraging people to save in deposits because, ooops, they were spending all their money on mortgages/rent".
We haven't a hope of this happening unless rents and mortgages come down even more. Do you know how far salaries and mortages/rent will have to come down before we can compete with, say, Eastern Europe?
Pull the other one. Name _one_ person who so far has been punished for taking part in the bubble debacle.
Was the slump in bank shares "improbable"? If so, then why do you think two inprobably events in a row will not happen?
Also, house prices in Dublin have dropped 40% already, with no levelling off in sight. Is this not a "collapse"? If not, then what percentage drop will you admit is a collapse?
It amazing how people even now, with 30,000 on the dole every month, are still drinking the kool aid.
Try understanding my point before ranting off . .
I love this whole "you think this is ok" waffle. Ah, the glass is half empty. Another one of those . . . All the signals points to armageddon. Really, there is no point in discussing anything rationally with your kind.
Im not saying things are great and everything is going to be fine. Im saying the markets have factored in some of the bad news and some of the things to come down the road. The very fact that we have high figures of unemployment predicted has given some level of reality to markets and prices alike.
And Charlie, dont annoy me with the "whats positive about" . . . . Its just the usual "lets take the bad out of everything" negative Joe view, where you just DONT WANT TO VIEW ANYTHING POSITIVELY. Its the reason why RTE and the media in this country find it so easily to depress the hell out of so many. Its also the reason why they get so many viewers, so many people in this country want to read about all the bad things happening to our economy (but pretend that its simply to keep themselves informed!). As I said, anybody using Irish Mediums to "keep themselves Informed" on the state of our economy, is only getting half the picture (if that). Im not naieve, Im a realist, but trying to find the good out of the bad is far more productive then trying to find more bad out of the bad.
So you think that people having to learn to save and be prudent with their money is bad long term . . . This seems to suggest you think there is some quick fix solution to all our woes, please do tell . . Oh we should go down the Obama route, yes, of course, shame we dont have access to the same levels (even in Irish Terms) of funds to bring out such a package.
Banks had to readjust their lending criteria, last year has been a knightmare but we are hopefully coming out of that moment. Like I said, its easy to look at the last year, look at Expected unemployment increase and forget that these things have already contributed significantly to decreases in house prices.
We dont have to necessarily be as competitive as Eastern European countries, if it was that simple we wouldnt have any foreign investment in this country (and wouldnt of been able to get it when our wages and salaries were spiralling out of control during boom).
Nobody has been held accountable yet, but at the moment they are very uncomfortable. I have to believe that something will be done and they are being investigated, they are certainly not as comfortable as they were same time last year. Your not suggesting that the most important thing right now is to hang these guys by the football, do you think that will solve our economic woes, or perhaps just make you feel a little bit better. Here is a suggestion, when this thing eventually levels off, then protest on the streets about all these fatcats who have gotten away with x , y , z. That is when you will get things done, after the most important factors of economies in a recession are taken care of. Im not saying they shouldnt be arrested right now but its not the most important thing that needs to be done right now.
Im not talking about what will happen, I am talking about what is probobley likely given the figures we have at hand. Much of this has been expected (much of it not) and I believe the markets have factored in alot of what we will see in the next year (if there are no more surprises). There is as much a likelyhood of things declining at this stage as there is of things levelling off. The blind panic so many people are showing is simply because nobody really knows whats going to happen. Everything is speculation based on the rapidly ever changing environment.
You can continue to assume the worst and see everything pointing towards the four horses, or you can accept that people are still buying houses, people still need houses, demand will increase over the next couple of years and we will eventually get over this crisis.
The gospel according to the Armageddon Brigade.
- hang the bankers, this is the main way of solving our countries problems, at the very least it will get us back on track
- if this doesnt solve the problems revert to Panic, throw out every negative stat you can get your hands on. Positive thoughts of any kind are unacceptable and should make you ashamed of yourself.
- then accept that we are all screwed and lets just talk about the impending disaster (dismissing any positive talk as crazy!).
- Since its going to happen, we might aswell embrace the IMF (Who will of course run out of money), then embrace farming in our back gardens (as we will have no money for anything) and then it will be down to raping and pillaging . . .
- A new Ireland will be born, everybody will follow the same code of negativity and depression, anybody who speaks positively gets burned at the stake . . . .
