Loki said:ivuernis
The point I was making is peopledesires are only a sign of their desires not good or bad. You are dead right in saying an investor is equally useless to use just becasue of their desires. The points of fact are all that should be used. Speculation on these facts is fine as speculation.
keth said:.
As for the doom mungerers. either buy up or shut up please, and let the rest of us who had the courage and wherewithall to buy either way back in the late 1990's or more recently, to enjoy our fruits.
keth said:Do these same people really think that as soon as the ballon starts leaking (even with the SSIA's coming on stream, and a strong economy abounding) that everyone will run screaming begging that their house be bought at a fraction of the cost paid for it.
If any type of downturn occurs, most people will hang onto what they have and wait for the next inexorable rise as is the longtime nature of natural inflation. The doom mungerers scenario of property ripe for the picking is naive to say the least and a fitting vision for anyone who's never held down a mortgage or anytype of responsibility.
The qualification for it being good was that somebody wants it. Not a valid qualification just opinion dressed up. FIne to state your opinion but that is waht it is not fact. FOr exampl you think it is a good thing if prices drop but you are saying "People wanting property prices to rise is not a good thing though. " as fact state it as opinion.ivuernis said:You said that just because somebody wants something does not make it good. Sometimes it does though... I would argue that people wanting affordable property is a good thing. People wanting property prices to rise is not a good thing though.
Granted, for the former to be satisfied NOW would require current property owners to lose money... this is the bind we find ourselves in 21st Century Ireland.
im not talking about you im talking about all the people you are talking about enjoying their fruits. im sure the most recent purchase you made was higher than your first purchase and had increased at similar rate to the first purchase did.keth said:Bearishbull,
Paper profits???
You are talking bull! I've bought and sold sveral times on paper profit and my current property is anything but paper. Obviously you are still living in your bedroom.
keth said:I'm surprised no one has a placard naming the day the world ends. It's ironic, but most people waiting for the collapse are those without a roof of their own above their heads. These are the doom mungerers and professors of the bubble bursting.
Do these same people really think that as soon as the ballon starts leaking (even with the SSIA's coming on stream, and a strong economy abounding) that everyone will run screaming begging that their house be bought at a fraction of the cost paid for it.
If any type of downturn occurs, most people will hang onto what they have and wait for the next inexorable rise as is the longtime nature of natural inflation. The doom mungerers scenario of property ripe for the picking is naive to say the least and a fitting vision for anyone who's never held down a mortgage or anytype of responsibility.
As for the doom mungerers. either buy up or shut up please, and let the rest of us who had the courage and wherewithall to buy either way back in the late 1990's or more recently, to enjoy our fruits.
keth said:I guess by Trotski-ite I mean those who are almost 'unwilling' to take the chance that most other hard working people have. These same people are adamant about their stance almost believing that a low cost house is their right. Did we forget that we're living in a free market (almost) and that the persuit of dreams via money and profit is permitted, neigh, encouraged
How many people out there have made massive amounts of money on their house or houses. And why shouldn't they? More power to them, and to those that havn't, that is a pity, but come on?
We are not living in a communist society where all are equal weather we like it or not. Everyone has the right to speculate, appreciate and recooperate.
If you feel so strongly, join the socialist party.
Keth.
And national borders, particularly in the middle eastDuplex said:Nothing endures but change.
- Heraclitus
keth said:I guess by Trotski-ite I mean those who are almost 'unwilling' to take the chance that most other hard working people have. These same people are adamant about their stance almost believing that a low cost house is their right. Did we forget that we're living in a free market (almost) and that the persuit of dreams via money and profit is permitted, neigh, encouraged
How many people out there have made massive amounts of money on their house or houses. And why shouldn't they? More power to them, and to those that havn't, that is a pity, but come on?
We are not living in a communist society where all are equal weather we like it or not. Everyone has the right to speculate, appreciate and recooperate.
If you feel so strongly, join the socialist party.
Keth.
soma said:Keth, I don't know where to start man, that's alot of vitriol you've been throwing around.
If you think the typical property bear in Ireland some kind of student hippie type then you are falling into a stereotype yourself, that of someone who has something nice but is paranoid that 'the proles' are out to get them & take what they have.
Also, if you think the concern re:the property market is solely about house prices or affordability you are sorely mistaken. Some people like myself, who hope to further establish & expand businesses, see a massive opportunity going a begging at the moment.
Instead of a strong economy here we're building a paper tiger by fooling ourselves into thinking we're producing real things in our economy. We're not, we're playing around with WWII-level cheap monopoly money on credit and somehow convincing ourselves that the economy is driving forward.
It's not that "cheap houses" are good for the economy, it's that when people have a 'reasonable' amount of money left in their pockets after paying their mortgage - then there's a better chance of that person ploughing some of that cash into a new business, thus helping the economy in the long run. The guy who is commuting four hours to work to live in ballyno-where and struggling to make ends meet and is exhausted all the time is never going to establish anything.
The reason why property bears cant just 'pay up or shut up' is that alot of us see a direct correlation between an inflated asset bubble [if you are honest with yourself - it's inflated - no one in their right minds could value a house in a frankly dangerous area of dublin (we all know the areas I mean) at a quarter of a million euros, yet this happens) and a tanked economy.
ivuernis said:
It's a [broken link removed] in one of the most desirable areas in Dublin, but still at [broken link removed] (plus another €0.34m for stamp duty alone!) at the end of the day it is still a just a 4-bed semi-d with a converted garage.
</SPAN>Orange County New York, €4,500,000
Stately "Georgian" mansion perched on 3 acres with lake frontage to Tuxedo Lake. Incredible estate built in 1920 for John Harris of Smith, Barney, Harris Co. boasts all the original detail of the period. Beautiful moldings, 13 firep laces, grand scale rooms. Historic District, private gated community, 2,000 acres with 3 private lakes only 38 miles to NYC. Additional 3.1 lake front lot also available MLS # 386343.
Duplex said:A little perspective; 12 bedroom mansion in Orange County New York.
</SPAN>
http://www.weichert.com/search/realestate/PropertyListing.aspx?P=5568666&countyid=34514http://www.weichert.com/search/realestate/PropertyListing.aspx?P=5568666&countyid=34514http://www.weichert.com/search/realestate/PropertyListing.aspx?P=5568666&countyid=34514
Neffa said:Hey, Duplex, you know this board doesn't like international comparisons - Ireland is different, after all
How about this six bed period house in the heart of Notting Hill in London for the same amount?
http://www.findaproperty.com/agent.aspx?agentid=1410&opt=prop&pid=008293&photo=2#photo
If you'd clicked the other link you'd have noticed the property in fact sold for €3.75 million, well over the guide of €2.5 million.Laurie said:Hey, Neffa, you know some people on this board can't do currency conversions!l
Since when is €2,500,000 = £2,650,000?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?