Future price of Irish properties
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Neffa
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Laurie said:Hey, Neffa, you know some people on this board can't do currency conversions!l
Since when is €2,500,000 = £2,650,000?
Errr...when the property sold for €3.75m, or really €4.09m with stamp
duty @ 9%.
The London house is £2.65m, or €4.01m with stamp duty @ 4%.
So pretty much the same. And yes, in response to the other post it does depend on where you'd like to live but both houses are in the very high end of the international executive market and the Dublin example looks poor value by comparison. And getting back to the thread topic, I think provides further evidence that the market here is very, very expensive indeed.
An intersting article on the 'investment' market in Arizona; might shed some light on the future of the Irish market.
http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive/2006/03/20/8371785/index.htm
http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive/2006/03/20/8371785/index.htm
I really don't think much of the comparisons people are using. First off the most exclusicve residency in any country should be compared with like. THe arizona desert is not exactely the same as the capital city of a European country. A house in the outer suburbs of New York is not tha same as a house in the most exclusive area in the Capital of Ireland during a record low level of unemployment. Before somebody puts in the smug "well everybody thinks Ireland is different" What you are comparing is not close. What can you buy in the west of Ireland For €3.75mil? I think you can buy a former mansion estate.
All this talk of comparing is really pointless as you aren't comparing you are just showing what can be bought for the same money in other countries. There is no comparison in the properties and the location. You need show like with like.
All this talk of comparing is really pointless as you aren't comparing you are just showing what can be bought for the same money in other countries. There is no comparison in the properties and the location. You need show like with like.
You convieniently left out the London property in your complaint about not comparing like for like, or would such a comparison really highlight the preposterious levels Irish property has reached.Loki said:
When some media reporting has been on the edge in the last few months i've finally seen the first of what will doubtless will an increasing number of very negative articles with regard to property investment in Ireland.
Kathleen Barrington is the first journalist to have the balls (how ironic) to print "When the sums in housing don't add up" in yesterdays SBP. While focusing on a particular property amongst the quotes used were "The only basis on which this investment makes sense is if rental income grows at a truely phenomenal pace, if there is development potential for another property or if the investor flogs the property to an even bigger mug down the line."
Lets face it... Ireland is not that 'different' to any other market and there's not point kidding ourselves that it is. €4 million for that property (inc stamp) is nothing short of sheer insanity, it's well past 'irrational exuberance' at this stage.
Eurofan said:
How well do you know London? I don't know it that well (lived there for 6 months) the only reason I did mentioned it. I don't know the area to compare. I know Orange County New York Is not New York, New York. I know Las vegas is in the desert.
I noticed you just brushed off my comments yet never actually defended an obvious bias in the comparisons.
Supply and demand. The exclusive property in each country has the highest prices becasue of the social status. Go to the monopoly board in each capital city and find a house for sale on each of the top property roads. Compare them and you might be closer.Eurofan said:
I really was glad to see someone take that brutal "worth the investment?" Irish Times Column to heel. I'd love to see the stats on the go/no-go ratio of verdicts they have given on properties - anytime I have taken a look at the column everything reviewed has been given the green light as a good long term 'investment' even though the majority are 'junk' properties (rent doesnt cover monthly outlay).Eurofan said:
ivuernis said:
Well written article, not too sure if many of these investors will take notice of it though. Interest rates will have to go to 3.5% before anything changes in this market IMO. I know people who are happy to supplement their rental income as property will always go up.
It would be interesting to see what sort of yields these new apartments on the quays are making. Looking at daft it looks like some of them are finding it hard to get tenants
beattie said:
Vaguely well written if you ask me. The premise that somebody would buy a house on this road to rent it out at average house rental prices seems to be flawed to start with. THe arguement is valid but bad examples and sensationalised. It is about investemnt that nobody in their right mind would make. It is not the same as an investment in a 2 bed appartment or even close. Very poor example if you ask me
beattie said:
Agreed, I think the example given was an extreme one. It's the people who are down at the lower end of the rental sector who are taking a hit of maybe 10-20% a month on the difference between the mortgage and rent who will suffer most if things go sour.
Loki said:
Absolutely.
Still, I don't think many first time investors (fti's?) are actually doing the Maths and maybe extreme examples are required to drill home the message, after all it's the extreme positive examples that have got them on board in the first place (10-20% yoy increases).
Yeah I mean who would invest in something with a negative yield.. oh wait.. roughly 35% of Irish property "investors".redo said:
Personally I don't see the example as extreme - I know someone currently purchasing a place for 1.3m, planning to rent it for one year (obviously at a negative yield) and fully intends to flip it for 1.9m after that year. This type of activity is covered by her comment "or if the investor flogs the property to an even bigger mug down the line."
In the current market, I think there's every chance this guy will find that mug in 12 months time.
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