Sit In at the Passport Office

[StevieC]

Fair play to the people who did a sit in protest at the passport office. It about time the general public stood up to the unreasonable unions trying to hold the country to ransom.

 

[Purple]

Well said and well done to them.

 

[Deiseblue]

Everybody is absolutely entitled to protest at something they perceive to be unjust

The same entitlement of course applies to Trade Unions.

 

[RMCF]

I thought they were going on a 'work to rule' strike?

If so, surely dealing with customers and answering phones is part of your daily job description?

 

[Deiseblue]

Not at the taxpayer's expense they're not. These people are effectively on strike but still on full pay. They appear to be getting away with holding the country to ransom.

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I think you will find that the unions are entitled to take industrial action if mandated to do so by their members.

 

[z107]

Am I entitled to go on tax strike?
If the public sector aren't going to provide the service I'm paying them to provide, then does it not follow that I should withhold tax?

 

[Deiseblue]

Am I entitled to go on tax strike?
If the public sector aren't going to provide the service I'm paying them to provide, then does it not follow that I should withhold tax?

Witholding properly payable tax is an offense unlike legally mandated trade union industrial action.

 

[z107]

If there is a mass protest, will everyone get arrested then?
That would be interesting.

After all, what other way do the private, non-unionised workers have to protest?

 

[becky]

So,bear with me on this, public servants are entitled to get paid when not performing their duties provided they have provided their union with a legal mandate to do so?

The employer can decide to deduct wages by a percentage for the non performance of certain duties. This was on the cards when nurses were not answering phones a few years ago as part of their campaign for a 35 hour week. I can't remember the percentage but it was something like 13%.

The employer hasn't gone down this road yet as talks are ongoing but it is an option they may pursue.

 

[becky]

If there is a mass protest, will everyone get arrested then?
That would be interesting.

After all, what other way do the private, non-unionised workers have to protest?

In theory they could arrested but it rarely happens.

A few years ago a number of builders were protesting about the fact that their employer (as they thought0 considered them self employed contractors and when work dried up they were not entitled to JSA.

They were not members of a union and therefore did not have protection under the Industrial Relations Act, so were removed by the Gardai.

 

[mathepac]

,,, If so, surely dealing with customers and answering phones is part of your daily job description?

In certain parts of the public service, almost certainly in the civil service, job descriptions are the exception rather than the rule. I wouldn't know what the split is in the passport office concerned.

 

[Bill Struth]

I thought they were going on a 'work to rule' strike?

If so, surely dealing with customers and answering phones is part of your daily job description?

As a civil servant I don't have a job description, or terms and conditions of employment. Apparently I'm employed 'at the pleasure of the Finance Minister.' That is why it was not a breach of the payment of wages act when my pay was cut without my consent.

 

[Purple]

As a civil servant I don't have a job description, or terms and conditions of employment. Apparently I'm employed 'at the pleasure of the Finance Minister.' That is why it was not a breach of the payment of wages act when my pay was cut without my consent.

Does that not also mean that a work to rule is impossible?

 

[StevieC]

It doesnt really matter about peoples right to strike or work to rule, in my opinion what matters is whether there is an achievable end to it (which there doesnt seem to be). Leaving aside the fairness and public/private sector arguments, the government has no money. The unions are trying to rob a beggar. The private sector have been hit much harder than the public sector but the public sector unions expect the private sector to give them a bailout (in essence to subsidise their pensions when their own have gone through the floor due to markets collapse), the money borrowed to give them pay rises will ultimately be paid for by the private sector. Unions plan is to annoy the very people who pay their wages, not the government but the private sector tax payer.

The only ones hurting are the kids that didnt get to go to Disneyland because someone wouldnt do their job and give them a passport. Like I said fair play to the general public who made a stand against this stupid industrial action.

If the government was like a company making lots of profit but trying to screw its staff I would have sympathy, but this isnt the case.

 

[z107]

I fully agree StevieC.
When I see industrial action like this I get angry for two reasons, first is that in effect what they are looking for is yet more private sector money. They want me to give them more of my money. This money isn't going to come from anywhere else, because the government is too busy pouring that into the failed banks.

The second reason it makes me angry is that they're targetting the wrong people. Look at the 'I can't get a passport' thread. This is terrible. If they don't like their jobs, why not just leave and let someone else have it?

 

[Latrade]

The only ones hurting are the kids that didnt get to go to Disneyland because someone wouldnt do their job and give them a passport. Like I said fair play to the general public who made a stand against this stupid industrial action.

I don't agree with the industrial action in any way shape or form and the response this morning from the unions claiming the Department were to blame for Friday was stretching it. However, I think this is a bit too emotive a statement.

My only comment on this and those at the sit in is just how many people have left this to the last minute to get their passports? We've had threads on here with people in situations where there passport is nearing expiration date and other passport related issues and the individuals have been vilified for not planning ahead enough. Given the WTR has been well publicised for a while, just how many of those there on friday had left it late to sort it out?

Granted not all will have easy access to the office, but if it were me and there was industrial action, would I leave it to the day before my precious family trip to disney land to organise passports?

 

[Complainer]

When I see industrial action like this I get angry for two reasons, first is that in effect what they are looking for is yet more private sector money. They want me to give them more of my money. This money isn't going to come from anywhere else, because the government is too busy pouring that into the failed banks.

This is nonsense, of course. The 'private sector' does not have a monopololy of Govt funding. It is not just the private sector that pays taxes or pays for public services.

 

[liaconn]

In certain parts of the public service, almost certainly in the civil service, job descriptions are the exception rather than the rule. I wouldn't know what the split is in the passport office concerned.

Not true. Civil Servants have job descriptions called 'role profiles' which are reviewed twice a year.

 

[carpedeum]

I know this has been voiced before, but, civil servants need to take a reality check. In the good times, many of them benefitted from bench marking against similar positions in the private sector. Many people in those positions in the private sector have now lost their jobs or taken large pay cuts. Reverse bench marking to realign the two sectors should probably have happened anyway, but, similar decreases in civil servants pay have happened and will continue to happen. They have a cushion of job protection in the civil service and have not experienced the redundancies of the private sector. Yes, it is difficult, but, at least they are getting a paycheck.

I have no sympathy for people (arrogant fools) who leave the renewal of passports to the last minute or until after booking holidays. Genuine emergencies should be separated and passports issued within 24 hours.

 

[Complainer]

Fundamentally it is just the private sector that pays taxes and pays for public services;The public sector could not exist without private sector funding. The private sector enables the public sector employee to pay taxes by funding their job and these taxes are just a partial rebate on the cost of providing a public sector job.

Face it, regardless of how essential the service being provided is, public sector employees are the antithesis of wealth creation: a financial drain.

This is exactly the kind of nonsense that drives public sector staff into direct action, such as that being seen at the passport office. On the off-chance that this is not wild trolling, let's just look at the factual errors in your post.

The private sector enables the public sector employee to pay taxes by funding their job

Everybody with income or captial gains (above threshold levels) and everybody who spends money pays taxes, regardless of whether they are public or private sector employees. As stated above, private sector employees do not have a monopoly on paying taxes.

these taxes are just a partial rebate on the cost of providing a public sector job.

No-one gets a 'partial rebate'. Public servants get paid a wage or salary for doing their job.

Face it, regardless of how essential the service being provided is, public sector employees are the antithesis of wealth creation: a financial drain.

Public services are about serving the public. The teacher who is teaching our children this morning is not a 'financial drain'. He or she is providing a service for a salary. The Garda who is giving evidence in court this morning is not a 'financial drain'. The local authority official who is processing motor tax payments or processing housing applications is not a 'financial drain'.

Public services matter.