This flies in the face of taxi-driver wisdom (which we must respect of course..) - dyah see all dem young wans pushin da prams, doin it for the social they are, gerrin a flah from the corpo, everything paid for um.
I'm not sure this discussion is headed anywhere - soon we'll be on to truthseeker with "dont you know pregnancy can really dry out your hair" and a chorus of us going, "yah, I know, tis tough, but I still wouldnt kill the baby over it".
I am pro choice and I wouldn't kill a baby. Until it's born, it is either an embryo or a foetus. However, I would not wish to give birth to a child with severe illness or disability. You may think of it as selfish or murderous but I'd get over preventing it a lot easier than having a child, putting it, myself and the rest of the family through needless suffering and then losing it.
.
And perhaps we should re-invent the wheel while we are at it. The vast majority of people do not live in fear pregnancy or indeed stretch marks. I suspect that you will be in a very tiny minority who view pregnancy as their body being hijacked.
I'm not sure this discussion is headed anywhere - soon we'll be on to truthseeker with "dont you know pregnancy can really dry out your hair" and a chorus of us going, "yah, I know, tis tough, but I still wouldnt kill the baby over it".
I like your quotation from the Nun yesterday, she is I think some kind of theologian. So far I don't understand why McGibney was upset by it, he might clarify?
Forgive me if I'm not surprised that you join truthseeker (which, I'm afraid, given some of the posts in this thread has proved as much a antonym as a pseudonym) in that regard. Despite being merely a man, I have been through the process end to end on quite a few occasions (granted, I've not had to push), and while the first time can be unnerving I found it to very much be a positive experience . . not as scary or dramatic as the picture you paint . . but then you have a flair for the dramatic having recently described expectant mothers in Ireland as "lambs to the slaughter".so to answer your question, my body was most definitely hijacked
A friend of mine considered it to be a parasite. Much wanted babies by the way, horrendous pregnancy, and difficult birth. But one is not allowed to say that one's body is hijacked or that it is like a parasite. People would think you were nuts.
What's to like about pregnancy when you think about it. The getting pregnant part is a bit of fun, the finding out your pregnant is yippee, the first 3 months no bother (for me anyway), the last 3 months are no joy, no sleep, walking around in the dark for hours on end in the middle of the night, going back to bed, going to the toilet all the time, not being able to lie in any position that would be considered comfortable, one pregnancy I had from the second trimester a pain so severe in my leg that I couldn't go any long distance in a car, so bad that on holiday my husband had to drop me and the first child to a train station as I could not physically stay in the car, and you cannot be taking medication when you're pregnant. Then all the scans and hospital visits and hanging around. I personally didn't find the scan wondrous. Never asked my OH to accompany me (unless he wanted to and he did for the first proper scan of course), there is no woman I know that likes getting examined internally, and my gyny was female but I had to endure some young males too. It's bloody embarrassing and I'm quite cool about my body. I hated being frumpy, feeling frumpy and looking frumpy. Then finally the day has come, I was being induced as the baby had stopped growing, trainee doctors having a go at getting the needle for the drip into my wrist I seem to remember as being a particularly bad moment, I refused all trainees after that. Then they come with the oedema (I've to find the word and will come back) the first of many indignities, and the contractions, oh my what a shock. The epidural being inserted into your back and one is aware that you must not move so the anythestist gets it right because otherwise it can have long term consequences, the trying to push when you cannot feel anything, then an episiotomy, I'll spare everyone on here those details, but I now know why you're not allowed to have sex for 6 weeks after that, finally the baby, blood and guts and all that gore, those details you'll have to ask my other half about, but I don't think he'd be willing to speak about what he saw. He was happy that the baby looked at him on the way out though, I reckon he tries to forget the circumstances of the birth, and you know what some people even film this, like are they for real or what. Not sure if my OH considers natural birth or a caesarean worse, I was awake but could see nothing. He won't talk about that either, typical tough Irish male eh? (One of my brother in laws nearly fainted and had to be seen to) . And it was me that had to go though it not the men. And when the milk comes in, oh my gawd, today I cannot remember what was worse, the milk or the pain from the caesarean. For sure after the first pregnancy I had all myths dispelled and no never looked forward to being pregnant again. I could wear a bikini because my scar is so neat, only 3 inches etc., but my tummy will never be the same again, how does Victoria Beckham do it is what I'd like to know. And so to answer your question, my body was most definitely hijacked and will never be the same again. But I'm happy to be a mother. Sometimes not (insert smilie, cannot currently find that option). And would never hand them back.
. . not as scary or dramatic as the picture as you paint . ..
Firstly, this is a highly emotive & complex area, and I think, should the personal attacks continue, this thread will & should be locked.
. It turned out to be a lovely parasite in the end and I wouldn't give him for the world but I am able to be honest about it.
Upset? No, as I said, I just found her comments disgusting. They are positively dripping with condescencion and betray, to my ears anyway, a rather obnoxious superiority complex. If a Priest or Bishop tells their congregation next Sunday that "I THINK IN MANY CASES YOUR MORALITY IS DEEPLY LACKING" (shouted in capitals too) I think many people would consider them likewise.
Thanks for the reply Tommy, I'm not saying I still understand your reply though, but let that lie. I'm wondering what if your priest or bishop thought that the congregations morals were lacking but didn't speak it.
Are you referring to yourself in the third person again.The only personal attacks are coming from quarters who would prefer to see the thread locked to suit their own agenda. They would prefer that none of this is discussed at all. Its a typical response.
This is indefensible bile.You can spout as much disrespectful rubbish as you like, refusing to answer direct questions or explain any of your views, in this thread, in the other thread, in the thread you linked to, and, getting personally abusive, kind of makes anything you post on the issue redundant.
Are you referring to yourself in the third person again.This is indefensible bile.
Yes. That hasn't changed. Obviously this is a very emotive issue. I'm happy to argue the case from pro-life view point . . and have done so many times over a number of years on AAM. My posts on the subject have always been consistent, concise, clear and unapologetic. I appreciate that some (many perhaps) vehemently disagree with my view point. That is not an issue for me. I think that any fair reading of this thread and the one I linked to previously would show the misrepresentation and false allegations levelled repeatedly at me by one poster in particular. Unfortunate methinks.And only yesterday you were feeling sorry for Truthseeker?
The only personal attacks are coming from quarters who would prefer to see the thread locked to suit their own agenda. They would prefer that none of this is discussed at all. Its a typical response.
And I hope you didnt interpret the bit of slagging (dry hair) as a personal attack.
Truthseeker is pro choice in any circumstances if I understand her correctly, but would have time limits I think. That it's a woman's body and her choice.
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