Tenants leaving well before 56-day legal notice period. Can I keep their deposit?

[Sarenco]

Wouldn't a demand for rent imply that a tenancy is still in place?

You don't need to make a demand for rent.

Rent remains due until the end of the statutory notice period. Whether the tenants have vacated the property or not is irrelevant.

So the sequence I would recommend, if you are intent on retaining the security deposit, is as follows:

1. Carry out your final inspection of the property and receive the keys.
2. Wait until the end of October and then notify your tenants in writing that you will be retaining their security deposit to cover the unpaid rent.
3. Ready yourself to respond to a complaint to the RTB (if it hasn't already been made at that point)!

 

[DeeKie]

Personally, I would look to get the property re-let as soon as possible. If it ended up not being vacant, I’d let it go. But if the property ended up being vacant during the notice period, I’d enforce by withholding the deposit. The landlord/tenant relationship is already tilted too far in favour of the tenant without landlords lying down like patsies when they’re entitled to claim something.

This is a very reasonable approach.

 

[Sarenco]

You may hold the deposit for unpaid utilities, damage to the property, missing items, rubbish removal, cleaning, etc.

You can indeed but that's all irrelevant in the context of this thread.

 

[Sarenco]

The rules weren't necessarily the the first thing to resort to here - getting the property re-let was.

Agree 100%.

 

[Arnie Hammer]

The issue here is that the OP is an amateur landlord, does not have an agenT

Yes I'm an amateur but so are most landlords. I plan to use an agent for the letting and have one lined up. The problem is that taking pictures and viewings aren't feasible for the last week as tenants are packing up and moving out. The week before that I had work commitments.

What could have been done is that the quid pro quo could have been that the tenants in-situ would cooperate fully with the OP in re-letting the accommodation. The property would be marketed immediately on Sep 15 with viewings to be accommodated flexibly by the current tenants.

This is right. I would have worked with this. I am not trying to screw anyone over. I will be out of pocket because they haven't done what they were legally supposed to.

 

[SCA911]

Similar position a few years ago. This might be of help: https://askaboutmoney.com/threads/tenant-leaving-without-giving-much-notice.203887/

 

[Sarenco]

Hi @wab0607

As a matter of curiosity, do you think the substantial time and effort that you spent on successfully defending your position with the RTB was worth it in the end?

Would you do it again?

 

[Arnie Hammer]

Similar position a few years ago. This might be of help: https://askaboutmoney.com/threads/tenant-leaving-without-giving-much-notice.203887/

Thanks for the link. I was surprised at the RTB staff encouraging people to settle to keep their names off the website.

Personally I am not bothered by this. I can imagine my tenants might be though.

 

[Leo]

I was surprised at the RTB staff encouraging people to settle to keep their names off the website.

Every landlord should check that register prior to accepting new tenants!

 

[SCA911]

Hi @wab0607

As a matter of curiosity, do you think the substantial time and effort that you spent on successfully defending your position with the RTB was worth it in the end?

Would you do it again?

Yes and yes.

I'm sick of all landlords being painted as greedy and lacking integrity. I take my responsibilities as a landlord seriously and ensure the property is in good condition, repairs made in a timely manner, etc. However I am not looking for a pat on the back for this. This is the path I chose and do not expect credit for doing what I am supposed to do. That approach has to go both ways though and these tenants were taking the mick. It annoyed me that they attempted to portray me and our relationship as anything but fair and professional. In their complaint they stated we had treated them like "animals" once they told us they were leaving and while I do not let emotion get involved in transactions with a tenant, this got my back up. At the end of the day our response to their complaint involved a bit of photocopying and typing and a morning at the hearing but as I keep records of everything relating to the property this was not a big deal. I was just glad that my approach to being a landlord paid off because if it had not I think I would have just thrown in the towel and sold it.

 

[imalwayshappy]

Every landlord should check that register prior to accepting new tenants!

How can you search the RTB register by name? I thought you can only search by address?

 

[Gordon Gekko]

Can we please debunk the myth of the “substantial time and effort” required to defend a baseless RTB claim?

I’d happily write a letter and show up at a hearing for a couple of grand.

And the flipside applies; why would a tenant bother wasting his or her time on a frivolous claim that’s doomed to fail based on the pretty clear rules?

 

[Arnie Hammer]

Update: tenants have left and there isn't really anything by way of damage.

I have an agent in and the place should be advertised next week. Probably won't have tenants before middle of month.

At end-October I'll write to them to say I am keeping two weeks' deposit in lieu of unpaid rent for their notice period. Although they'll probably be in touch before then.....

I will write an update when all of this is resolved. Advice all really useful

How can you search the RTB register by name? I thought you can only search by address?

I looked and you can search by name.

 

[Sarenco]

I’d happily write a letter and show up at a hearing for a couple of grand.

That's fair enough Gordon but plenty of folks might logically conclude that it's not worth their while to take a morning off work to secure a month's, taxable, rent.

 

[Gordon Gekko]

That's fair enough Gordon but plenty of folks might logically conclude that it's not worth their while to take a morning off work to secure a month's, taxable, rent.

“logically conclude”?

Who exactly would logically conclude that a it’s not worth a half a day of annual leave to collect €2,000 gross/€1,000 net?

(average rent in Dublin, for example, is €2k a month)

I’m not aware of many roles where one can earn €1,000 in a morning, net of tax; €4,000 a day gross is over €1,000,000 a year.

Hedge-fund manager pay for a morning sitting around, assuming the tenants are stupid enough to waste their own precious time on a case which they’ve no hope of winning; I’ll take that, thanks!

 

[Arnie Hammer]

Someone told me that RTB are doing remote hearings as well due to Covid.

If this is the case I can probably balance it with work/home life.

After tax it's not four figures but I think it's worth my time.

 

[Sarenco]

The national standardised average rent is currently €1,226 (per the RTB).

Would I take a morning off work to secure €1,226, which would be worth less than €600 to me after tax?

Probably not.

I certainly wouldn't if I had pressing work or childcare commitments elsewhere.

 

[Gordon Gekko]

The national standardised average rent is currently €1,226 (per the RTB).

Would I take a morning off work to secure €1,226, which would be worth less than €600 to me after tax?

Probably not.

I certainly wouldn't if I had pressing work or childcare commitments elsewhere.

You wouldn’t take a morning off work to collect €600?

Wow.

But here’s the thing, we’re not talking about you. We’re talking about the OP.

 

[Leo]

How can you search the RTB register by name? I thought you can only search by address?

They publish the outcome of all cases they adjudicate on, you can search that by name.

 

[Sarenco]

You wouldn’t take a morning off work to collect €600?

I probably wouldn't use up my valuable free time to have a row over €600.