Problem with income tax calculation in online Form 11

cally1990 said:
My colleagues attended an Irish tax institute conference today joined by revenue and one of the points mentioned was


"Revenue are aware of Form 11 issues and are currently working on or have already resolved same. Eg DIRT was being charged at 40% and this is now corrected to 33%.
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So having gone back into ROS and the Form 11, it now seems that its change calculations (again).
No DIRT is no being calculated for me, whereas it had done so at 40%. Income continuance was not attracting a credit, but is now.

@Mathematician if you get a chance can i trouble you to check if your return is still showing a DIRT amount @40% please? ...or anybody else who is in process of preparing a return.
 
daheff said:
So having gone back into ROS and the Form 11, it now seems that its change calculations (again).
No DIRT is no being calculated for me, whereas it had done so at 40%. Income continuance was not attracting a credit, but is now.

@Mathematician if you get a chance can i trouble you to check if your return is still showing a DIRT amount @40% please? ...or anybody else who is in process of preparing a return.
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Ah yes, there has been a change. Things are improving, for me, the only thing wrong now is that the interest is not shown sparately at 33% as it should be, it is lumped in at 40%.
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Check it against their previous calculations.
They now appear to be adding in the DIRT into the higher rate figure. So still taxed at 40%, but the fact is hidden. I have a pdf with revised assessment generated last night where they did this. The original had the DIRT as a separate entry at 33%.
 
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Towger said:
Check it against their previous calculations.
They now appear to be adding in the DIRT into the higher rate figure. So still taxed at 40%, but the fact is hidden. I have a pdf with revised assessment generated last night where they did this. The original had the DIRT as a separate entry at 33%.
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Ah -I didn't notice it was thrown in with the 40% line. Likewise I had it detailed separately (albeit at 40%). Almost like Revenue are now trying to hide that its 40%. Gets murkier and murkier.

@Mathematician appreciate you checking also!
 
Also if somebody can explain to me why having entered 980 under "Foreign Income from securities/possessions" it becomes 947 on the summary income, that would be appreciated. I guess its something to do with tax already charged of 260 EUR? Works out about 12.7% reduction of the income amount.

Edit- I reckon this is a rounded 12.5%.
 
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daheff said:
Also if somebody can explain to me why having entered 980 under "Foreign Income from securities/possessions" it becomes 947 on the summary income, that would be appreciated. I guess its something to do with tax already charged of 260 EUR? Works out about 12.7% reduction of the income amount.

Edit- I reckon this is a rounded 12.5%.
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It's probably part of double taxation relief. If the effective rate of foreign tax is higher than the effective rate of Irish tax, you can get some of the relief as a deduction against the income and some as a credit.
 
daheff said:
Also if somebody can explain to me why having entered 980 under "Foreign Income from securities/possessions" it becomes 947 on the summary income, that would be appreciated. I guess its something to do with tax already charged of 260 EUR? Works out about 12.7% reduction of the income amount.

Edit- I reckon this is a rounded 12.5%.
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The 12.5% reduction you've talked about is likely due to the upfront withholding of foreign tax on your investment income.
 
I had raised some queries with Revenue about issues with Form 11. They told me there are some issues being updated and to check it again in about a week.

Not sure why there can't be a pop up announcement on the ROS site to advise this rather than people submit incorrect forms.
 
Ciru75 said:
It's probably part of double taxation relief. If the effective rate of foreign tax is higher than the effective rate of Irish tax, you can get some of the relief as a deduction against the income and some as a credit.
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This is 12.5% of the tax paid. should it not be 12.5% of the income?
 

ROS form 11 issues
Jul 01, 2024
Revenue has informed us that it has released a number of fixes to Form 11 2023 following the report of a number of issues with its processing and computation systems. However, several items are still to be resolved:

Issues where ROS is taxing deposit interest at 40 percent,

Issues where ROS is not applying the 3 percent USC rate on non-PAYE income exceeding €100,000.

Revenue plans a further release by 15 July 2024 to apply the correct treatment to both of these areas.

The issue with Department of Social Protection (DSP) income pre-population on Form 11 2023 was fixed on 2 April 2024 and is working correctly for DSP pension payments. However, a further fix is being worked on for other DSP incomes (Jobseekers, Illness benefit, etc.).

The issue with DSP pre-population on Form 11 2022 has been incorrect since 2 April 2024, and affects late filers from that date. It is due to be fixed on 15 July.

Furthermore, the Institute has been made aware of unannounced changes to Form 11 2023 which may impact taxpayers and their agents, in particular those using third party software. We have requested that Revenue clarify the changes being made and will continue to update members via Tax News.
 
cally1990 said:

ROS form 11 issues
Jul 01, 2024
Revenue has informed us that it has released a number of fixes to Form 11 2023 following the report of a number of issues with its processing and computation systems. However, several items are still to be resolved:

Issues where ROS is taxing deposit interest at 40 percent,

Issues where ROS is not applying the 3 percent USC rate on non-PAYE income exceeding €100,000.

Revenue plans a further release by 15 July 2024 to apply the correct treatment to both of these areas.

The issue with Department of Social Protection (DSP) income pre-population on Form 11 2023 was fixed on 2 April 2024 and is working correctly for DSP pension payments. However, a further fix is being worked on for other DSP incomes (Jobseekers, Illness benefit, etc.).

The issue with DSP pre-population on Form 11 2022 has been incorrect since 2 April 2024, and affects late filers from that date. It is due to be fixed on 15 July.

Furthermore, the Institute has been made aware of unannounced changes to Form 11 2023 which may impact taxpayers and their agents, in particular those using third party software. We have requested that Revenue clarify the changes being made and will continue to update members via Tax News.
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And yet I was told that 'interest earned is exactly income'
cally1990 said:

ROS form 11 issues
Jul 01, 2024
Revenue has informed us that it has released a number of fixes to Form 11 2023 following the report of a number of issues with its processing and computation systems. However, several items are still to be resolved:

Issues where ROS is taxing deposit interest at 40 percent,

Issues where ROS is not applying the 3 percent USC rate on non-PAYE income exceeding €100,000.

Revenue plans a further release by 15 July 2024 to apply the correct treatment to both of these areas.

The issue with Department of Social Protection (DSP) income pre-population on Form 11 2023 was fixed on 2 April 2024 and is working correctly for DSP pension payments. However, a further fix is being worked on for other DSP incomes (Jobseekers, Illness benefit, etc.).

The issue with DSP pre-population on Form 11 2022 has been incorrect since 2 April 2024, and affects late filers from that date. It is due to be fixed on 15 July.

Furthermore, the Institute has been made aware of unannounced changes to Form 11 2023 which may impact taxpayers and their agents, in particular those using third party software. We have requested that Revenue clarify the changes being made and will continue to update members via Tax News.
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Long time coming... And EU interest was charged both the top rate of tax and also USC....
 

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Despite not returning any deposit interest, I am still being shown on PAYE balancing statement, deposit interest earned and it being taxed.

This has been going on for years. The same amount is shown every year on my balancing statement. I phoned them about 6 years ago and they did not know what it was and said they would look in to it. Nothing happened. I phoned again two years later and I was told that they would sort it. Nothing happened. I got my 2023 balancing statement this week and there it is again.

I also submitted an amount for medical costs for both myself and my wife. She was given a tax refund for hers, I received "nil" for mine.
 
PoundMan said:
So does this mean that Revenue is now taxing 'EU Deposit Interest' at 33% instead of incorrectly classing it as 'Other Foreign Income' at 40%?
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Yes .. that appears so. I'm so thankful to all who pointed this out in the first place as I would not have known. You may have to ring revenue, or send a my enquiries, to get the figures to change back for you. Good luck.
 
Towger said:
Revenue have changed back to showing the DIRT taxed at 40%, but calculating it at 33%

View attachment 9107
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You really couldn’t make it up, talk about making what is an already complicated return more complicated.

With regards to DIRT, I do wonder what % of people actually do declare it for Revenue purposes? Never heard yet of a prosecution for not paying DIRT.
Am sure a lot of new workers to these shores don’t declare it. Really is a clumsy tax system we have, built on fear of prosecution.
 
Nordkapp said:
You really couldn’t make it up, talk about making what is an already complicated return more complicated.

With regards to DIRT, I do wonder what % of people actually do declare it for Revenue purposes? Never heard yet of a prosecution for not paying DIRT.
Am sure a lot of new workers to these shores don’t declare it. Really is a clumsy tax system we have, built on fear of prosecution.
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The banks are required to send data on DIRT collected into Revenue via ROS. AFAIK, this is a relatively recent requirement. I was told about it a year or so ago. The bank was not amused at having to fulfill this requirement :). This is probably the option now on ROS for 'Large file upload Service'.

I expect Revenue will probably collect the data for a few years and then take 'Compliance Actions'.
 
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