Phoenix Park Racecourse

Lappy,one question if you don't mind.How the hell does a 24 year old get a mortgage for an apartment costing E415,000 ?
 
I didn't buy on my own.. I bought with my girlfriend. We qualified for €462,000 together using the Irish Mortgage Corp and then PTSB but decided not to use it all.

We both have good jobs.. that's it really.
 
hhhhhhhhhh said:
1:
2:
The sheer number of properties being built will mean that it will be extremely difficult to resell the property, as they will be selling the racecourse from the next 5 years+ and you will have to compete for buyers with new stamp duty exempt appartments and developmers who can drop the price and still make money.

3:
There are a hugh number of investors in the racecourse, who will also have more flexibilty when it comes to selling a property.
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Thats what i always think whenever i pass them. Had a good gawk on my way past yesterday and as far as i can see is all they have going for them is the name 'CastleKnock'. I would think that up to 70% are investors so its going to have a very transcient tenancy.

And they are quite a distance from the City. If you are not within walking distance then you are not in the city. Simple rule.

I would have thought that a 1 or 2 bed terrace in phibs would have been much better value. Even with the added stamp duty you get better value when you can park ur own car outside the front door.
 
phoenix_n said:
And they are quite a distance from the City. If you are not within walking distance then you are not in the city. Simple rule.
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That's a fair enough point but to me (who doesn't walk or use public transport) it's out the gate, into the park and there's the quays in front of you.

Look at people paying the same money to live in Portmarnock for example...

Phoenix with all due respect you can't just come up with a figure and say 70% of people in them are renting them!

I'm assuming neither of you have seen the insides of them. The fitted kitchen with black granite work tops, tiled floor, huge balconies with at least two rooms having access to it, 900 sq/ft for my one, completely tiled bathrooms, hidden toilet cisterns, radio tuner built behind the plastering in the en suite with only two speakers on show.. they're not the norm in Dublin.
 
Lappy said:
That's a fair enough point but to me (who doesn't walk or use public transport) it's out the gate, into the park and there's the quays in front of you.

Look at people paying the same money to live in Portmarnock for example...

Phoenix with all due respect you can't just come up with a figure and say 70% of people in them are renting them!

I'm assuming neither of you have seen the insides of them. The fitted kitchen with black granite work tops, tiled floor, huge balconies with at least two rooms having access to it, 900 sq/ft for my one, completely tiled bathrooms, hidden toilet cisterns, radio tuner built behind the plastering in the en suite with only two speakers on show.. they're not the norm in Dublin.
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Appreciate your debate as i am not trying to nullify your purchase but just 'wondering' aloud their potential.

I forgot about the gate but its still a long walk. I just would be wary of the number of properties on the site. Cant help thinking that the funding for the place came about from released equity from the neighbours. As regards furnishing i appreciate what you are saying but they are incidental. You can fit out an alfa156 with as much equipment as you like but i'd still not buy.

They seem then quite large and well fitted which is great but when you are nearly spending 1/2 million on an apartment they should be.

I would also predict that this time next year you will be able to rent a 2 bed there for circa 900euros. I'd even think i could get this penthouse for 1200
 
phoenix_n said:
You can fit out an alfa156 with as much equipment as you like but i'd still not buy.
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A bit OTT perhaps. We're not talking about a penthouse in Cavan town. ;)

900 rent seems a bit low but who knows what the market will be like in 12 months time. At the moment they seem to be commanding 1400 quid a month.

If the only drawback from the place is size then I think it's places across the road in Ashtown, Finglas and Blanchardstown that would have a lot more to worry about in the future... if the bubble burts, they'll be the places that drop first.

BTW, you're not from 'old' Castleknock are you?
 
Lappy said:
If the only drawback from the place is size then I think it's places across the road in Ashtown, Finglas and Blanchardstown that would have a lot more to worry about in the future... if the bubble burts, they'll be the places that drop first.
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Agreed.(prospect hill is likely to go first) But PPR by mere association with the area will suffer aswell.

Lappy said:
BTW, you're not from 'old' Castleknock are you?
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Nope :) . I have no vested interest at all.
 
I didn't go for a 100% mortgage for many reasons along with the 'not knowing' factor. I'm relying (as are a lot of other FTBs I'm sure) on that being one of the saving graces (along with location...location...!).
 
phoenix_n said:
I would also predict that this time next year you will be able to rent a 2 bed there for circa 900euros. I'd even think i could get this penthouse for 1200
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I would tend to agree that rental prices in developments like this will start to tumble over the next 12 months. I wonder will the investors stick around then if there is no more cap appreciation
 
At 24 you will be fine no matter what way the property market moves,
these are just logical points on the development, don't take them to heart

Lappy said:
All apartments in the phases sold out.. quickly.
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I live in the college grounds, when I bought my appartment
so did all my mates from castleknock and their parents.
Then it stopped, because people from castleknock where
the only people buying them.

The same will happen in the racecourse, after the first
wave of castleknock people, buyers will dry up.


23 minutes to ballsbridge is a lie
even if your bought on the parkside of the racecourse
it is still a 30 minute drive, but from the navan road
side it is another 5 mins+.

Lappy said:
not to mention the QBC AND the train.
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where is the nearest bus stop or train station to PPR

Lappy said:
Show me ANY apartment complex in Dublin of a large-ish size which does not have builders on the site for quite a few years to come... that's the way it is.
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two points on this one,
first I forget you will be living on a building site for the next 5 years.

even after the builders are long gone, without a drop in price they
will be selling these appartments for years.

Lappy said:
I'm assuming neither of you have seen the insides of them.
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I have been in a few of the appartments, the fitout is top quality,
but this is only 3-5K cost per unit to the developer, not worth the
high price for an appartment in the suburbs.

There are hugh number of castleknock people who bought 2+ of these
as an investment, they are struggling to rent them, rents are
only 1200 and if you are looking to rent one, I'd say you could
push them even lower.
 
Howitzer said:
Doesn't look like PPR to me.
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Thats because its not. !

Its only an indication of prevailing rents in the area and when you are renting you are always more price sensitive rather than development sensitive (to a certain degree).

But yes,point taken, this thread is on PPR only .
 
hhhhhhhhhh said:
23 minutes to ballsbridge is a lie

where is the nearest bus stop or train station to PPR
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Listen, make your points and everything but don't start accusing me of being a liar.

If I said it took me that time then it did. I'm not going to write up my entire route from Ballsbridge to the place but when not travelling in peak times and leaving BB at 4pm that's the time I made it in.

The nearest bus stop is across the road then there's one station done and another being built across the road. I thought you said you knew the area but you need to be told where the nearest bus stop is??!

I have no intention of paying stamp duty to rent the place out, I plan on being there for a few years. The only reason I could see to move out would be to have kids and at 24, they're nearly a decade off!! :eek:
 
Is your terrace/balcony included in the square footage? If not then the price is 461 a square foot, very good value so close to the city. Also at this size you could stay there for quite some time, riding out any potential storms in the market.

I live in Ballsbridge and have occasion to go to Phoenix Park. Your timing is accurate Lappy, in fact, it often takes less time.

I seriously doubt that anyone would rent such an apartment for 900 a month!
 
liteweight said:
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I seriously doubt that anyone would rent such an apartment for 900 a month!
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Not at the moment but in about 12 months time I would think you could bargain some landlords down out there. There is absolutely no shortage of stock to come on stream in the general C'nock area so unless a landlord is happy with long vacancy periods there will be downward pressure on rents in C'nock.
 
beattie said:
Not at the moment but in about 12 months time I would think you could bargain some landlords down out there. There is absolutely no shortage of stock to come on stream in the general C'nock area so unless a landlord is happy with long vacancy periods there will be downward pressure on rents in C'nock.
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I don't think you'd bargain them down by 500 a month! They'd be crazy!! If I were in that position and did not want to sell, then I'd rather let family stay in it, or rent it at the reduction to friends or their children! Take the loss and make a tax gain.

Anyway, it's a moot point in this case. Lappy has bought a PPR in a very good location, for IMO a good price, with great interior...all at the age of 24. Well done I say and the best of luck with it. :)
 
liteweight said:
I don't think you'd bargain them down by 500 a month! They'd be crazy!! If I were in that position and did not want to sell, then I'd rather let family stay in it, or rent it at the reduction to friends or their children! Take the loss and make a tax gain.
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Simple Demand versus Supply economics.

If the supply is greater than demand then prices will fall.

And whilst i can't say for sure prices are falling i can say for certain that supply is increasing.
 
phoenix_n said:
Simple Demand versus Supply economics.

If the supply is greater than demand then prices will fall.

And whilst i can't say for sure prices are falling i can say for certain that supply is increasing.
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Of course, it's supply and demand. I just pointed out that there are other options for landlords out there.

On this particular thread, it seemed to me that OPs were saying the demand would only come from natives of Castleknock...this apartment is within a stones throw of the city with very good transport links. The demand will not only be from local residents but from anybody wanting access to the city, plus there are a lot of immigrants in Dublin who also boost the demand. That's my view on it anyway, but as I said this is a PPR so a whole different ballgame.
 
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