Over 8 years of non payment and no repossession

Brendan Burgess said:
It's a good question but I think that barristers are supposed to put their clients' cases forward as best they can. They don't have to believe in their client's case and they don't have to like the client.

I would have thought that this issue of whether or not a Protective Certificate trumps a Circuit Court order for possession is worth airing in the High Court.

The High Court judge "reluctantly" granted a stay so that it could be appealed to the High Court.

The Barrister is doing his job.

The guy has lived rent-free for 9 years. He probably has plenty of money to pay legal fees.

If we as a Society allow a system where someone can live in their home for years without paying and without being repossessed, don't blame the barristers who advocate on behalf of their clients.

Brendan
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Fair points but I would imagine that it taints New Beginning's reputation in the eyes of some people whether that's fair or not.
On the other hand there's probably a significant cohort that thinks that this is *exactly* what organisations such as NB should be doing... :(
 
Conan said:
We regularly hear complaints about the mortgage interest rates in Ireland and how much higher they are compared to the rest of the EU. However the two recent high profile cases demonstrate the difficult of enforcing mortgage contracts even when a client pays nothing for 9 years. Re-possessions seem like an alien concept to the Courts even in clear cut cases. The concept that borrowers are expected to repay borrowings seems now to be questionable. How much more cost does that impose on compliant mortgage payers if rates are inflated to cover those who are non-compliant?
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Brendan was making this very point on the radio yesterday while discussing the McNamara case with Michael Dowling, a mortgage broker AND a PIP!
Michael had very weak comebacks to the points being made
 
Delboy which show was that?

I love the judge ordering them to make the mortgage payment. I wonder will they, like what would be the point. Might as well be hung for a sheep as a lamb.
 
Bronte said:
Delboy which show was that?

I love the judge ordering them to make the mortgage payment. I wonder will they, like what would be the point. Might as well be hung for a sheep as a lamb.
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Well failing to obey a judge's order can have you jailed for contempt.

Ignoring your responsibilities under a contract seems to be penalty free, but judges look on your obligations to the court in a very different light, maybe.
 
Bronte said:
Delboy which show was that?

I love the judge ordering them to make the mortgage payment. I wonder will they, like what would be the point. Might as well be hung for a sheep as a lamb.
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The Last Word if I recall correctly. Around 5.30pm
 
cremeegg said:
Well failing to obey a judge's order can have you jailed for contempt.

Ignoring your responsibilities under a contract seems to be penalty free, but judges look on your obligations to the court in a very different light, maybe.
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You think he’ll be jailed if he doesn’t make the repayment. LOL I think that’s highly unlikely. Me, I’ve the popcorn in for the 2nd Sept. because I can’t even begin to imagine what new level of insanity in our courts will prevail.

Maybe one of them will be sick and there will be a further extension. Watch this space.
 
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This thread should be made a sticky and re-named "How to live in a nice house for a decade, for free"

Simply following the steps taken by Ronan and his good lady has to be the best money saving advice on this website !

I'm furious to see this nonsense continuing through the courts. Ronan should be in prison (cooking for his fellow inmates) :mad:
 
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Well now Creme Egg an extension yesterday until 7th October. What will happen then !

www.independent.ie

Restaurateur Ronan Ryan: ‘I had agreement not to repay €1.2m mortgage debt to bank’

High-profile restaurateur Ronan Ryan has said the reason he did not make repayments for several years on his €1.2m mortgage debt was that none were required under an agreement he entered into to sell the home that he shares with his wife, former Miss Ireland Pamela Flood.
www.independent.ie www.independent.ie

After hearing from both sides, Mr Justice Garrett Simons said he would give judgment on the appeal on October 7. He continued a stay on Tanager executing the possession order until then.

“This is a difficult case. I need time to consider the submissions of both parties,” he said.
 
Ronan Ryan appears to be a victim of the professions

He also said Mr Ryan had never heard of the personal insolvency regime when he consented to the possession order. “He had never heard of personal insolvency. His accountant hadn’t told him. His [then] solicitors, his legal advisors, hadn’t told him. And he didn’t know it was an option,” said Mr Farry.

And his Personal Insolvency Practitioner who applied for the Protective Cert did not know that this client had consented to an order for possession.

It's a mad world out there.

Brendan
 
Brendan Burgess said:
Ronan Ryan appears to be a victim of the professions

He also said Mr Ryan had never heard of the personal insolvency regime when he consented to the possession order. “He had never heard of personal insolvency. His accountant hadn’t told him. His [then] solicitors, his legal advisors, hadn’t told him. And he didn’t know it was an option,” said Mr Farry.

And his Personal Insolvency Practitioner who applied for the Protective Cert did not know that this client had consented to an order for possession.

It's a mad world out there.

Brendan
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I presume you're not believing this rouse for a second?! He's a smart man. And has played every card in the deck so far. Why not this one
 
Brendan Burgess said:
It's a mad world out there.
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None of this was before March of this year, when he suddently started repaying the mortgage monthly. AFTER Tanager said in court he had not paid anything in 9 years in order to justify them getting a possession order.

Personally I don't understand why the judge wants to know what Tanager paid for Ryan's loan. Why is that in any way relevant. And I'd have thought it was commercially sensitive. That Tanager do not want to reveal how much they are willing to pay.
 
luckystar said:
I presume you're not believing this rouse for a second?!
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Hi lucky

It's actually plausible. I discussed this case with a PIP some time ago and he said that Ryan had been very badly advised.

A good PIP would have applied for a PIA as soon as the legislation which gave the courts the power to impose them on people came in.

He would have had his mortgage written down to the value of the property just as the Macnamaras had.

The McNamara/Lowe case shows that the courts are imposing too lenient PIAs on lenders

Warning: This is a very long thread. I have long argued that we have the best protected borrowers in the World. And I have also argued that we should protect genuine borrowers who are in arrears. I have found some of the reports on the PIAs imposed by the court disturbing in that they seem...
www.askaboutmoney.com

I am not excusing the Ryan's behaviour. I think it's disgraceful that the lender can't get the property and I think it's disgraceful that the courts can write down the value of a mortgage and leave the person in a very valuable home. But I live in a democracy and the government we elected passed this legislation.

Brendan
 
noproblem said:
Is this happening with lesser known people and far cheaper properties as well?
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Absolutely.

There has been some suggestion that people are getting deals because they are well known. The only reason we hear about these particular deals is because the people are "celebrities". Most people are not interested in Joe Bloggs getting a write down from €500k to €300k.

Brendan
 
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