Opinion and Discussion: Household Charge.

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NANA01 said:
Ok lets get some facts straight.

This money goes to Dublin. You get your application form from the County Council but it goes straight to Dublin with money enclosed. Not receipted or taken in by County Councils. The County Councils will take your form and money and post to Dublin for you if you want.
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Dublin City Council does not receive all this money. I assume you mean that the money goes to central government? And if the truth is told, Dublin residents get less money per capita that rural councils thus it would be more correct to say that Dublin money goes to other councils.
 
csirl said:
Dublin City Council does not receive all this money. I assume you mean that the money goes to central government?
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No need to assume anything. The poster already said
NANA01 said:
This money is NOT going to local authorities as advertised they are just getting the money they are allocated anyway yearly from our taxes.... just getting less.
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Joe McHugh TD has announced that government is planning to allow payment in post offices.
 
Gross or net value? I.e I own a property valued at 150K with a mortgage of 200K. My neighbour owns a property valued at 150K with no mortgage. Is a property tax fair if we are both taxed on 150K asset ownership? It doesn't seem fair to me!
 
Or maybe acknowledgement that not everybody is online, and that the PO network is comprehesive and convenient.
 
Protocol said:
Or maybe acknowledgement that not everybody is online, and that the PO network is comprehesive and convenient.
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Exactly, it makes a lot of sense, my FIL has the internet but has no online banking facilities - ie, no credit card or paypal account etc...

I just checked the website, and there has always been a non online option - 2 of them actually:

Online - www.householdcharge.ie - by credit card/debit card or by Direct Debit. Instalment option is only available by Direct Debit until the 1st March 2012.

By Post: Registration forms are available online; from City/County Councils; Libraries; Citizen Information Centres or Lo Call 1890 357357.

Payment can be made by cheque/postal order/bank draft made payable to “Household Charge". Send form with payment to: Household Charge, P.O Box12168, Dublin 1.


NOTE: Direct Debit mandates submitted by post must be received by 1st March 2012

Local Authority: In your City/County Council offices before 31st March (no administration fee applies).
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I still havent received any official communication, leaflet etc.. so if I didnt have internet access I wouldnt know the above (unless its been advertised and I havent noticed as I dont watch telly or read newspapers).
 
There have been three payment options since the start:


online

by post to Dublin

at your local LA office
 
Truthseeker, you don't read newspapers or watch TV???

I simply can't imagine anybody like that.

How will you ever find the truth unless you investigate.................
 
Protocol said:
I simply can't imagine anybody like that.
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We exist.

TV bores me. I read.

Newspapers cost money and make your hands dirty and are full of bits Ive no interest in like ad's and the sports sections so I check out news websites and just read the bits that interest me.
 
michaelm said:
Are they fiendishly smart enough to doctor the figures? I'm not so sure; I think that they have just made a conservative estimate which won't be far off.
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That is exactly what they are doing. The 1.6 million figure is underestimating by about 200,000 of the number being required to register.

And it is not being made clear that numbers been announced are for those that have registered. Many of whom have exemptions. Numbers who have paid are far less.
 
Independent.ie article about the household charge.

A substantial platform was afforded on RTE's 'Six One News' on Tuesday to a senior local government official, who gave a convincing impression of a tax collector. And Environment Minister Phil Hogan has been sighted, warning that unpaid charges, plus penalties, will be seized from the proceeds of property sales.

As soon as he delivered that pearl, I knew we really were listening to Mr Silly's Nonsense Land Band. Sell a house in a falling market? Dream on. Most of us are stuck with any property we bought. If that's Plan B, then the Government will wait a long, long time for its pound of flesh.
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Also I noticed on Six One earlier this week some representative (can't remember which agency he worked for) mentioned that they would be matching up addresses received from ESB networks (via the MPRN number unique to each house meter) with the household charge data to find out which households had not paid the charge. Sounded like more bluster to me as when asked how they could possibly cope with the volumes if 50% of the people don't pay he completely avoided answering that.
 
The question is ...what alternative tax will the government introduce when the Household charge fails ... perhaps they will now realise that the only way to collect tax is via a third party ie employers extra paye / prsi / USC.
 
Ceist Beag said:
Also I noticed on Six One earlier this week some representative (can't remember which agency he worked for) mentioned that they would be matching up addresses received from ESB networks (via the MPRN number unique to each house meter) with the household charge data to find out which households had not paid the charge. Sounded like more bluster to me as when asked how they could possibly cope with the volumes if 50% of the people don't pay he completely avoided answering that.
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I dont see how this is feasible myself, the home owner is not always the name on the ESB bill, the numbers will be too high, and its surely a breach of data privacy? Scare tactics imo.
 
Do people really think that the government don't have a list of the majority of homes in Ireland? How do we get voting cards, tax statements etc? If the government want to contact me, they know where to come!
 
Its not that they can't contact each individual that does not pay the charge ...its simply that they cannot raise a judgement mortgage against 1million propertys or 1million summons or 1 million court appearances or any combination of the above , its not possible to take any action against that number of people our courts can't handle even a fraction of the necessary workload. The Government know this ...that is why you have Phil Hogan on the tv and radio trying to bluff people into registering he knows its doomed to failure if the majority simply refuse to comply.
 
Taxes must be perceived as fair and thus acceptable to the population.
This tax is unfair as it is not part of an overall reform or adjustment of the tax system in Ireland and is instead an imposition by outside forces on many who have not benefited from the excesses of the boom.
The tipping point in taxes being unacceptable is I think is 50%, so add this to all the taxes imposed, ask yourself is this fair?
If you are in massive negative equity, you actually owe more than house that you paid massive Stamp Duty on, ask yourself is this fair?

Services should be paid for, but not twice, once to central gov and then again to local gov..............thats the issue..................
 
If this tax was so necessary fit and fair why wasn't it introduced during the good times? why wasnt it imposed when there was equity on our property because its just a desperation tax.. The timing is as others have said appalling to bring this in during a property crash when things are so desperate, when we have already had new taxes imposed on us over the last few years is just ignorance on our governments behalf..
We paid massive stamp duty on our home not so many years ago and on top of that our home is in massive negative equity. Its bad enough worrying about interest rates on our home loans. If this property tax was so right then it would have been there during the good times..
 
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