Electric Car Value Trade In. Please Help

[AlbacoreA]

Anything can be done. Depends if people want to make it work for the benefits of an EV. If they have no interest that's a valid decision for them.

The OP was always going to get hammered trying to trade in a new car after 3 months. But they did it as VW cut it's new prices by up to 15k. Tesla has also been priced cutting last year.

 

[Gordon Gekko]

A while ago I came across this forum. Here's a guy documenting his journey from Dublin to Athens in a Taycan, back in 2022. Last years trip was to Artic Norway. The car has a real range of 295- 580km avg. of 410km. A little bit of work and it can be done.

Further nonsense. The point is it shouldn’t require any work or something approaching a military plan to get from A to B.

 

[joe sod]

As more players have entered the market competition has forced reductions in the margins to reduce towards the motor industry standards. As battery technology develops further and a few more manufacturers catch up, prices and margins will drop further.

In the 1920s automobile boom that's indeed what happened, the prices fell as technology improved and cost of production reduced. However with electric cars it's different, there was an initial boom and even price rises which distorted the second hand ev market, this created a demand in itself as people thought they were also buying an asset which rose in price, this was a positive feedback loop which has now switched 180 degrees to a negative feedback loop. Therefore extraordinary new ev sales are now falling, this never happened in the 1920s despite the similar negative price pressure on second hand cars back then. The demand for the automobile was so big that it swamped everything else, this demand was based simply on the utility of the automobile, everyone had to have one.
This does not exist for EVs since there is already a better alternative in many cases, the traditional powered car. So EVs have alot of competition from conventional cars, therefore the take up of EVs will be very slow now that they have hit a road bump. If the EV sales don't ramp up significantly in next few years we'll then all the government targets of no new fossil fuel cars by 2035 will be shelved, this will be all at eu level anyway where the German car industry will basically decide what cars they make and the German politicians will follow. As for Chinese EVs they are not going to hollow out German industry to benefit Chinese especially in current geopolitical climate

 

[Gordon Gekko]

Anything can be done. Depends if people want to make it work for the benefits of an EV. If they have no interest that's a valid decision for them.

The OP was always going to get hammered trying to trade in a new car after 3 months. But they did it as VW cut it's new prices by up to 15k. Tesla has also been priced cutting last year.

What exactly are the benefits of an EV?

I’m pretty clear on the downsides:

- Inability to get in one’s car and travel meaningful distance without a plan
- Needing to fit a charging point at home
- Garages no longer wanting them as trade-ins
- Human rights issues around children forced to dig-out cobalt with their bare hands
- Five figure sums to replace batteries
- Massive queues at charging points
- Taking ages to refuel your car
- A general shortage of charging points
- Domestic electricity being expensive
- Rapid technology advances rendering one’s purchase obsolete sooner
- Higher upfront cost
- Damage to the environment of manufacturing them
- Battery lifespan
- Lack of specialist mechanics to fix them resulting in high maintenance costs

Electric vehicles are a joke and some form of mania where zealots insist on telling you how great they are. They remain ridiculous for the reasons outlined above. It’s classic marketing spoof where we’re being fed a silly narrative to sell us something that’s rubbish compared to the incumbent product, the combustion engined vehicle.

 

[AlbacoreA]

Further nonsense. The point is it shouldn’t require any work or something approaching a military plan to get from A to B.

Even in a petrol car you wouldn't drive into the unknown with the tank a quarter full.

Norway has about 50% EVs and the best charging infrastructure in the world. But it's still the artic and remote with extremely low temps. It's not a place you forget your coat and hat in.

It's a false narrative.

 

[Gordon Gekko]

Even in a petrol car you wouldn't drive into the unknown with the tank a quarter full.

Norway has about 50% EVs and the best charging infrastructure in the world. But it's still the artic and remote with extremely low temps. It's not a place you forget your coat and hat in.

It's a false narrative.

And if by accident I head off on a long journey with a quarter-full tank, it takes me around two minutes to fill it and pay for the fuel. I don’t rock-up to Barack Obama Plaza and find all of the charging points taken or have to wait ages for my battery to charge.

If someone pitched this concept to you, you’d laugh and ask them to leave. It’s ridiculous.

 

[Blackrock1]

What exactly are the benefits of an EV?

I’m pretty clear on the downsides:

- Inability to get in one’s car and travel meaningful distance without a plan - what defines meaningful?
- Needing to fit a charging point at home - yes agreed but thats also the biggest upside, charge while you sleep, using cheap electricity and no needing to goto the petrol station
- Garages no longer wanting them as trade-ins - recent development and itll pass, ice fuel cars will be there soon enough
- Human rights issues around children forced to dig-out cobalt with their bare hands - cant comment on this but im sure its counter balanced by the human rights issues around the extraction of fossil fuels and the damage done by harmful emissions
- Five figure sums to replace batteries - it would also cost the same to replace an engine in a new car, and also as likely
- Massive queues at charging points - are you speaking from experience? most charging is done at home, in the times i have used fast chargers (ionity in the main) i havent had to queue
- Taking ages to refuel your car - 30 minutes once in a blue moon and the rest when you are sleeping
- A general shortage of charging points - not so much the case any more, more being added daily
- Domestic electricity being expensive - my night rate is 12.5c
- Rapid technology advances rendering one’s purchase obsolete sooner - perhaps altho we havent seen this yet, unless you can point to some rapid advance that has rendered all current evs obsolete?
- Higher upfront cost - like for like this is false now
- Damage to the environment of manufacturing them - worst case its a wash with ICE vehicles
- Battery lifespan - which is?
- Lack of specialist mechanics to fix them resulting in high maintenance costs - not something i have experienced at all as there is much less to go wrong, my BMW M3 was much more costly to maintain for example

Electric vehicles are a joke and some form of mania where zealots insist on telling you how great they are. They remain ridiculous for the reasons outlined above. It’s classic marketing spoof where we’re being fed a silly narrative to sell us something that’s rubbish compared to the incumbent product, the combustion engined vehicle.

answers in line, congrats you have won at FUD bingo !

 

[Gordon Gekko]

For completeness, I’m referring to EVs. Plug-ins etc with an ICE and 40-70 km range make some sense.

 

[Itchy]

Further nonsense. The point is it shouldn’t require any work or something approaching a military plan to get from A to B.

The only nonsense is not recognising that there are trade offs when you're picking a particular tool to do a job.

 

[Gordon Gekko]

The only nonsense is not recognising that there are trade offs when you're picking a particular tool to do a job.

Not really. ICE vehicles are a superior and more convenient ‘tool’ when you make an overall assessment.

 

[Blackrock1]

Not really. ICE vehicles are a superior and more convenient ‘tool’ when you make an overall assessment.

depends on your use case, if your statement was correct anyone who owned an EV would change it back to an ICE when changing, doesnt happen very often.

 

[tallpaul]

depends on your use case, if your statement was correct anyone who owned an EV would change it back to an ICE when changing, doesnt happen very often.

Because the EV zealots can't see the wood for the trees. As long as the 'planet is being saved' by buying an impractical EV, nothing else matters.

Apparently the planet is 'burning' but given that it has rained pretty much non-stop since Christmas, I wouldn't mind a little heat!!

 

[Blackrock1]

Because the EV zealots can't see the wood for the trees. As long as the 'planet is being saved' by buying an impractical EV, nothing else matters.

Apparently the planet is 'burning' but given that it has rained pretty much non-stop since Christmas, I wouldn't mind a little heat!!

what are you talking about EV zealots, the irony is all EV drivers have driven ice cars, yet the people who speak with the most authority are those who have never owned an EV, utter nonsense.

 

[tallpaul]

A fascinating report:

https://carbonmajors.org/site//data/000/027/Carbon_Majors_Launch_Report.pdf

Worth quoting when your local Green Party Zealot comes calling at election time and urges that Ireland needs to reduce CO2 emissions even further.

 

[tallpaul]

what are you talking about EV zealots, the irony is all EV drivers have driven ice cars, yet the people who speak with the most authority are those who have never owned an EV, utter nonsense.

Yes and they now think ICE's are the work of the devil and that EV's are the panacea to saving the world!

 

[tallpaul]

Adrian Weckler in today's Indo hitting the nail on the head:

Insufficient charging points, a long wait to charge EV and general industry/customer distrust of the whole EV Ponzi scheme.

Adrian Weckler: The value of my electric car fell by €17,000 in 14 months… here’s why I’m not surprised sales are falling

Electric car sales have fallen by the biggest number on record — 41pc last month compared with March 2023 and 14pc annually. That’s against a backdrop of an 8pc annual rise in overall car sales.

www.independent.ie

 

[Itchy]

Not really. ICE vehicles are a superior and more convenient ‘tool’ when you make an overall assessment.

An empirically false statement, and you're a "zealot" if you can't see that.

Anyway, this is a finance forum - differing views are what makes a market! And right now, there's blood in the streets!

 

[Gordon Gekko]

depends on your use case, if your statement was correct anyone who owned an EV would change it back to an ICE when changing, doesnt happen very often.

Because they won’t admit their mistake and the ridiculousness of it all. Let’s see how all those people who paid €50,000 for an ID4 a wet week ago feel now that they’re being offered €30,000 on a trade-in (or even worse refused a trade-in).

 

[Gordon Gekko]

An empirically false statement, and you're a "zealot" if you can't see that

What is ‘empirically false’ about it?!

There are a multitude of advantages to an ICE vehicle over an EV, versus very few, if any, advantages to an EV ovet an ICE vehicle.

It’s a ruse. EVs and their advocates are people urinating down your back and telling you that it’s raining.

 

[Leo]

- Damage to the environment of manufacturing them

It's actually hard to believe that anyone still buys into that particular myth at this stage it has been debunked so often and by so many outlets despite the oil industry doing all they can to push the false narrative.