Dublin to erect cameras to catch people crashing red lights
- Thread starter Brendan Burgess
- Start date
I'd say that depends on who you ask....
You'll find people willing to break all sorts of laws and try to justify their actions.
Sometimes the people are bad, sometimes the laws are bad....
Lots of people refused to pay water charges, were their actions justifiable?
Brendan Burgess
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I suspect that the people who crash lights drive at more than 30 kph.
You missed some important details like tax and insurance discs - I think something like shown here is a reasonable ask for all pedestrians (as well as, of course for cyclists, escooters, children on tricycles, etc.) We should all focus our energy on those categories of road-user rather than tackling the continued dangerous abuse of cars...
What a lot of drivers don't appear to realise is that if we can have safer roads for pedestrians and cyclists, we will actually have better commute times for cars as people switch modes. Anecdotal example: where I live most amenities are within walking/cycling distance. My kids are well old enough and capable enough to walk/cycle to their activities by themselves. But I can't let them go alone. They need to be accompanied by an adult if walking or cycling due to the rampant red light running in our area. I can't trust grown adults to do the correct thing as they are too busy to wait at a red light. Most parents default to driving them as a result. A young child was run down and killed in our area a few years ago by a red light runner. The memorial is still there and yet I see people running that red light all the time. I genuinely can't fathom how people can do it and it seems the only way to stop it is to enforce it via use of cameras.
Yes, scooters, pedestrians and cyclists break red lights and can pose danger to other road users we should find a way to tackle that too - we won't get licence plates on those road users so it will probably be human enforcement as it is now. But the most dangerous is vehicle traffic and we should start there - red light cameras are an absolute no brainer.
Yes, scooters, pedestrians and cyclists break red lights and can pose danger to other road users we should find a way to tackle that too - we won't get licence plates on those road users so it will probably be human enforcement as it is now. But the most dangerous is vehicle traffic and we should start there - red light cameras are an absolute no brainer.
Cameras are the only way to go so , if they are not at all junctions already.
Forget the fines and just hand out penalty points...
I wonder if we'll see a private enterprise become involved in supplying and monitoring the cameras, administering the fines etc. ?
My feeling is that motorists will be more concerned about the risk of getting points on their licence, while we private entities are far more incentivised by the ability to generate income via penalty fines....
If a private enterprise does become involved, I expect to see a similar situation to the one that we currently have with the speed camera vans - they'll be placed where maximum revenue can be earned, rather than at the truely dangerous locations.
My feeling is that motorists will be more concerned about the risk of getting points on their licence, while we private entities are far more incentivised by the ability to generate income via penalty fines....
If a private enterprise does become involved, I expect to see a similar situation to the one that we currently have with the speed camera vans - they'll be placed where maximum revenue can be earned, rather than at the truely dangerous locations.
Being hit broadside by a bus, Luas tram or lorry traveling at 30 kmph would be a serious crash.
It certainly would......if a person was silly enough to let it happen
There's a hierarchy of vulnerability on the road. Truck -> Car -> Motorcyclist -> Cyclist -> Pedestrian. The potential harm you and your vehicle can inflict increases, with the more weight you have on the road. If we all used the road in deference to those above us in the hierarchy, it would be a much safer place for everyone.
We also need to be heavily fining pedestrians who disobey lights and/or road markings.Not necessarily just yourself...
Pedestrian (70s) dies five days after being struck by cyclist
Woman was taken to hospital after late night incident on Ranelagh Road in Dublin 6www.irishtimes.com
Cyclist Charlie Alliston jailed for 18 months over death of pedestrian
Alliston jailed over death of Kim Briggs, who sustained ‘catastrophic’ head injuries in east London collision last yearwww.theguardian.com
Cyclist not guilty of causing pedestrian's death by "wanton or furious driving" after trial over "3mph" towpath collision
The son of the elderly pedestrian who died addressed renewed call for 'dangerous cycling' laws by suggesting legislation should be updated, but it's "crucial" that cyclists get more infrastructure and "a safe space to cycle" before any "punitive approach"road.cc
Cyclist who hit pedestrian while on wrong side of the road avoids jail | BreakingNews.ie
Keith Paget (39) was cycling at speed on the wrong side of the road and was undertaking a van when he hit the pedestrian, causing a bleed on the brainwww.breakingnews.ie
Cyclist died after collision with pedestrian, inquest hears
Coroner notes Garda concerns over cycle and pedestrian paths in Phoenix Park
100% anyone who fails to obey the rules of the road should be fined/penalty points etc, regardless of their status in the hierarchy. But we can't wait until we have a perfect solution to attack the problem. No such thing exists. Red light cameras are just one tool in the toolkit. Hopefully freeing up gardai to deal with those that we can't automatically fine or add points to licenses.
Any red light breaker is indeed silly enough to be the cause of it.
You enforce the existing rules for cyclists. Fixed fine penalties. When they came out I remember there were being issued at a rate of 3 per day.... Nationally. Which suggests little or no enforcement. I suspect the rate is a lot lower now.
The priority has to be cars because statistically they are vastly more dangerous. Numbers from the previous trial.
"...In the period before the fines, some 87 per cent of people breaking the lights were driving vehicles.
New figures, for a near 18-month period, reveal that when fines were introduced for drivers, their rate of offending dropped off.
During the full near 18-month period of the trial, some 32 per cent of red light offenders were on bicycles and 68 per cent were in vehicles..."
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That trial was before any of the changes and cars had 100% of the priority and resources. Driver frustration is primarily due to traffic. Which is themselves.
Cars having 100% of the road space for decades only lead to more cars and more traffic.
At some point you have to stop doing the same thing and try something else .
Dr Strangelove
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There’s a private van which parks near me every two months or so (only on a Sunday for whatever reason). It’s a 50 km/h zone.
I drive this road too and I don’t think I’ve seen anyone go over 60km/h. As a local resident who regularly crosses this road I really don’t find speeding to be a worry.
There are about 400 vehicles an hour each way and maybe 10 or 20 will be over whatever threshold.
Raising revenue is the main objective here, road safety secondary.
If they didn't catch anyone they mostly likely wouldn't continue to sit in the same spot.
Studies have shown enforcement works.
Only enforcing know black spots is debatable as people who habitually speed don't only speed at black spots and not all accidents happen at black spots.
That said catching a lot of people who rarely speed is a lazy enforcement tactic that is of dubious value.
Studies have shown enforcement works.
Only enforcing know black spots is debatable as people who habitually speed don't only speed at black spots and not all accidents happen at black spots.
That said catching a lot of people who rarely speed is a lazy enforcement tactic that is of dubious value.
I think people get very frustrated with rules that should be more dynamic given the local situation. We are next to the local school with a 30 kph zone. All great and you need eyes everywhere if passing at school time. However at 11 am on a Sunday it is still the same speed limit but not a child in sight. The speed limit should be 50 kph but if you’re caught doing more than 30 at this time you end up with penalty points. I tend outside school days to do 33-34kph as my car keep beeping at me, should I slow or should I keep going as I am and risk getting caught some day.
Putting in a fixed camera by the school will not make me a safer driver. Just probably one who ends up off the road very quickly.
Putting in a fixed camera by the school will not make me a safer driver. Just probably one who ends up off the road very quickly.