Cycling the single biggest sporting activity for referrals to brain unit in Beaumont

Why any cyclist could possibly think that not wearing a helmet, while cycling, is a good idea... I just don't understand.

Then again, I've seen (adult) cyclists do so many stupid things over the last few years, that I suppose nothing should come as a surprise - other than the surprise that comes from how few cyclists are killed, every year.

With a push to promote more cycling, and no sign of new regulation, law enforcement, or compulsory training for cyclists, I fear that when the brain injury statistics are next updated, the number of injured cyclists will have increased.
 
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Why any cyclist could possibly think that not wearing a helmet, while cycling, is a good idea... I just don't understand.
I find it strange that grown-ups cycle on the footpath all the time. Many cyclists also cycle the wrong way down cycle lanes. There's no shortage of stupid people out there.


With a push to promote more cycling, and no sign of new regulation, law enforcement, or compulsory training for cyclists, I fear that when the brain injury statistics are next updated, the number of injured cyclists will have increased.
Well if the numbers of people cycling increases then you'd expect a pro-rata increase in the injuries unless cycling is becoming safer.
 
I find it strange that grown-ups cycle on the footpath all the time.
In the town where I live the cycle paths are marked by 2 faded white lines on the path on the main street. I'm sure half the people walking on the cycle lane think I'm a nuisance on a bicycle on the footpath when in reality they're on my turf!

Again it's the infrastructure that's the problem. The helmet issue is a distraction.
 
Oh I read it, but you clearly didn't understand the question, so I'll repeat:

Surely you understand focusing only on children does not give you a comprehensive overview of the impact on the population as a whole. Also, where does the Robinson report cover the effects on overall population health or other societal impacts?

Leo now you have lost me, I haven't answered your question because I am not advocating for mandatory helmet use. I simply don't understand why people are so vehemently against the wearing of helmets in urban areas and I don't think a mandatory law would actually have an impact on participation. You are making claims that mandatory helmet use has a negative societal/health impact on cycling based on a random article "Australia's Helmet Law Disaster" which is based on the Robinson paper. The Robinson paper is supposed to support your argument (not mine) but it doesn't, it's a very poor paper in my opinion. I've pointed out that in other countries, similar studies showed no impact on cycling participation so I don't believe it is possible to say that mandating helmets will result in a reduction in cyclist followed by an unhealthy population from lack of exercise.

I'd be strongly against compulsory helmet wearing as it's proven to reduce cycling, particularly in children, when we need to encourage the opposite from both traffic congestion and health perspectives. With the move towards 30km/h speed limits in most urban areas, these should be safe environments to cycle in without the need for a helmet.

As I said, this has never been proven. Cycling participation has increased/decreased in various countries that have no helmet laws so it is impossible to draw a sweeping conclusion on it.

The data says that overall helmets make little or no difference to injury numbers or outcomes. Look at the studies referenced in the Beaumont paper and look at the results where helmet use was made mandatory. You'll see little change in cycling injuries but a significant increase in morbidity due to the health implications of fewer people cycling. A neurologist will always tell you everyone should wear helmets all the time and if they did, X% of injuries would be mitigated, but they are the wrong people to assess the overall societal impact of mandating helmet use.

Again this is simply not true, helmets will not change the number of injuries but they will reduce the severity of head/facial injuries.

More risk-taking by cyclists* and less precautions among motorists overtaking them (studies show drivers pass on average 8.5cm closer to cyclists wearing helmets) increasing the risk of injury to remaining cyclists

That study, by Dr Ian Walker has a number of major flaws, most importantly the fact that he cycled the bike for all of the collected data points so there is an inherent bias in what he was doing. If he dons a wig and changes his cycling behaviour then it not really a reliable study. This study re-analysed the same data and debunked Walkers conclusions. They acknowledged there was a difference in overtaking distance (5.8cm rather than 8.5cm) but that it occurred when the overtaking distance was sufficiently safe, well above 1m so it is not really significant. Other factors such as distance to the kerb are more important to cyclist safety.

* Multiple studies show that wearing helmets increases risk-taking. Indeed, it has been show that the wearing of a helmet https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/full/10.1177/0956797615620784 (increased the risk appetite) of study participants in activities where the helmet could have no possible effect on the outcome.

The best one yet...Dr Ian Walker (again) tested 80 participants, 39 with 41 without helmets all from the comfort of an office chair while inflating an imaginary balloon on a computer screen. If you genuinely believe that helmet/no helmet while completing a computerized questionnaire and inflating a computerized balloon has any relevance to risk taking while actually cycling then I don't know where to go from here. It is a shockingly poor test procedure. Of course people will behave differently when you put a helmet on their head while sitting at a computer, it is an illogical thing to do. It is akin to putting socks on a cat and expecting them to walk normally

Anyway, my last thoughts on it:
  • Improving infrastructure, motorist and cyclist behaviour will reduce frequency of injuries
  • Promoting the wearing of helmets will reduce severity of head injuries at all speeds but significantly at lower speeds. A RTA above 70/80kph will more than likely result in a serious head injury or fatality so the benefit of a helmet irrelevant. The impact forces are far too great for the helmet to make a difference.
 
In the town where I live the cycle paths are marked by 2 faded white lines on the path on the main street. I'm sure half the people walking on the cycle lane think I'm a nuisance on a bicycle on the footpath when in reality they're on my turf!

Again it's the infrastructure that's the problem. The helmet issue is a distraction.
I agree with you. I don't use cycle paths that are just lines on a footpath. I find pedestrians too dangerous.
I'm talking about cyclists that cycle on the footpath, even when there's a cycle lane on the road.
 
I live down the road from New Park Comprehensive School and every morning I see the pupils cycling to school
the majority of the ones I see are cycling on the footpath and not on the road or the "not in use" bus lane
Some cycle slowly others quite fast but the majority at least have their helmets on
Fast forward to when school finishes I see the opposite, most are on the road/bus lane and a sizeable number now have their helmets hanging from their handle bars which presumably will be back on the head just before they arrive home

I often wonder who tells them to cycle on the path and if I happen to be leaving my driveway and one of these kids collides with my car am I going to be held 100% responsible for it, I presume that I will be??
 
Why any cyclist could possibly think that not wearing a helmet, while cycling, is a good idea... I just don't understand.

Then again, I've seen (adult) cyclists do so many stupid things over the last few years, that I suppose nothing should come as a surprise - other than the surprise that comes from how few cyclists are killed, every year.

With a push to promote more cycling, and no sign of new regulation, law enforcement, or compulsory training for cyclists, I fear that when the brain injury statistics are next updated, the number of injured cyclists will have increased.
Where to start.

Compulsory training for cyclists? Worked a treat for all those motor vehicle drivers who obey all rules, never speed, never go through red lights, always have their lights on at night, never drink and drive etc etc ad infinitum. There is cycling training rolled out in schools around the country, numbers increasing every year. Not compulsory and shouldn't be made compulsory.

Have you not seen lots of people do lots of stupid things, including people in cars or vans or lorries?

What new regulation should there be? The Garda enforce very few of the existing laws with regard to bus lane driving, illegal parking, speeding, red light running. Better to start there than add new laws.
 
I live down the road from New Park Comprehensive School and every morning I see the pupils cycling to school
the majority of the ones I see are cycling on the footpath and not on the road or the "not in use" bus lane
Some cycle slowly others quite fast but the majority at least have their helmets on
Fast forward to when school finishes I see the opposite, most are on the road/bus lane and a sizeable number now have their helmets hanging from their handle bars which presumably will be back on the head just before they arrive home

I often wonder who tells them to cycle on the path and if I happen to be leaving my driveway and one of these kids collides with my car am I going to be held 100% responsible for it, I presume that I will be??
Do you think they might be cycling on the footpath because they feel safer? Did you think about the times - more cars when they cycle to school much fewer when they cycle home from school. Spot the common denominator?
Many joggers go at a similar pace to people cycling so I'm really not sure of your point.
 
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I simply don't understand why people are so vehemently against the wearing of helmets in urban areas and I don't think a mandatory law would actually have an impact on participation. I've pointed out that in other countries, similar studies showed no impact on cycling participation so I don't believe it is possible to say that mandating helmets will result in a reduction in cyclist followed by an unhealthy population from lack of exercise.

Multiple studies show participation rates drop when mandatory helmet use is introduced. They're the reason that mandatory helmet use is usually dropped when assessed or even reversed at times. Using a study that only focused on Children suggests you were deliberately trying to find the data to suit your perception.
 
What new regulation should there be? The Garda enforce very few of the existing laws with regard to bus lane driving, illegal parking, speeding, red light running. Better to start there than add new laws.

Indeed, Dublin Council free speed surveys show the vast majority breaking urban limits particularly the lower urban limits and traffic wardens and clampers are looked upon as some evil force out to get the poor innocent motorist.
 
With a push to promote more cycling, and no sign of new regulation, law enforcement, or compulsory training for cyclists, I fear that when the brain injury statistics are next updated, the number of injured cyclists will have increased.

4 times as many pedestrians are killed on our roads as cyclists, surely funds on mandatory training would be better spent there?

There is a percentage of all road users who behave like idiots. Cyclists acting the muppet are far more likely to suffer the consequences of their actions themselves, some will learn and improve so it might be that cyclists as a whole are more considerate road users than others.

Ultimately though, cycling isn't a dangerous activity, injury rates are very low, and as someone who drove to work way back when we were allowed in to the office, I much preferred the good weather days when more would cycle and traffic was lighter.
 
I'm really not sure of your point.

And I'm struggling to see yours!!
But for the sake of clarity teenagers cycling on a path AFAIK is against the law (Could be wrong maybe you could enlighten me please)
and cycling along a footpath is an accident waiting to happen, that much should have been clear from my post
 
Do you think they might be cycling on the footpath because they feel safer? Did you think about the times - more cars when they cycle to school much fewer when they cycle home from school. Spot the common denominator?
Many joggers go at a similar pace to people cycling so I'm really not sure of your point.
They may feel safer but it's dangerous and against the law. If you lack the skills, confidence or coordination to cycle on the road or in a cycle lane/path then you shouldn't cycle. My 11 year old cycles on the road. Adults and teenagers cycling on footpaths are embarrassing themselves.
 
They may feel safer but it's dangerous and against the law. If you lack the skills, confidence or coordination to cycle on the road or in a cycle lane/path then you shouldn't cycle. My 11 year old cycles on the road. Adults and teenagers cycling on footpaths are embarrassing themselves.
To be clear, I don't think anyone should be cycling on a footpath, particularly adults, however I can understand how a child might feel safer doing so. How did your child get the confidence to cycle on the road? Fair play.
I would disagree that it's inherently dangerous, if done at a slow speed it's no different to someone jogging.
For a child, trying to make progress on the inside of cars that leave very little room for people to pass on the left can be frustrating and dangerous, added to the frequent exits without looking of passengers, it may make them feel safer to go on the footpath.
Every time someone tries to promote segregated cycling infrastructure that would make everyone safer, people tend to focus on their needs as car drivers rather than the good of the community. Sandymount and Kill Avenue being recent cases in point, the amount of people who are of course supportive of cycling but just not at my expense is staggering.
 
I grew up in Cambridge, a cycling city, in the 60s. You weren't allowed ride your bike to school until you had passed a practical riding and road safety course given in the school playground by a local police person. Worked.
 
I grew up in Cambridge, a cycling city, in the 60s. You weren't allowed ride your bike to school until you had passed a practical riding and road safety course given in the school playground by a local police person. Worked.

I have fond memories of the traffic school beside what is now Clontarf DART station, as am sure so do many other pre-Celtic Tiger era school kids :(
 
Indeed, Dublin Council free speed surveys show the vast majority breaking urban limits particularly the lower urban limits and traffic wardens and clampers are looked upon as some evil force out to get the poor innocent motorist.
Well, there's two ways of looking at that! Perhaps it's the case that the speed limits are ridiculously low, particularly the lower urban limits. I mean 30kmh, less than 19mph in old money, is farcical. Having a law that unrealistic only succeeds in lowering respect for the law and driving a wedge between citizens and law enforcement.

As for clampers! The penalty is totally disproportionate to the gravity of the offence. Start a fight outside a pub or chip shop that requires breaking up by the Gardai and - if you're prosecuted at all - you'll get the probation act. You're far more likely to be sent on your way home with a telling off. But get inadvertently delayed and overstay your parking meter? That's serious enough to earn you a massive fine! No wonder clampers are seen as evil incarnate. (Although in fairness, the ire would be better directed at the anti-motorist bureaucrats in the city council.)
 
H
I have fond memories of the traffic school beside what is now Clontarf DART station, as am sure so do many other pre-Celtic Tiger era school kids :(

Clontarf Traffic School.
 
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