Cutbacks by Lenihan

i was wanted to emphasize an incorrect message that an earlier postermade, who said that they "were a public sector worked who was in favour of a pay freeze", its just totally false. thats it, enough said
 
public sector workers get increments every year,
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My neighbour, who's a civil servants says that he no longer gets increments - is at the top of his scale. Increments are only paid in the early years - when you reach the top of the scale you get nothing except for the Partnership increases given to all workers. Also says that the only civil servants who get paid overtime are clerical staff in low paid jobs. Middle and senior management are forbidden from being paid overtime even if they work extra hours - something about being officers of the State who are obliged to be available to work whatever hours are necessary to get the job done.

This seems to suggest that a reduction of overtime would have to hit customer service as it mainly applies to the clerical staff who process forms and deal with the public.
 
jimbob1234 said:
public sector workers get increments every year, this is nothing to do with the new bench marking. these increments are still going ahead so the term "pay freeze" is a joke. the 3% will probably be achieved by cutting of contract workers and recruitment freeze. i just want to get the point across that a public sector worker will earn more this yr than last and more nxt year than this yr regardless of this debate. thats the way their increments work. the increments range from 800 to 2500 per year

any outstanding benchmarking is the whole moving up of the public sector salary scales (yet again)
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jimbob1234 said:
i was wanted to emphasize an incorrect message that an earlier postermade, who said that they "were a public sector worked who was in favour of a pay freeze", its just totally false. thats it, enough said
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I don't think so. Increments are not automatic across all areas of the Public sector. Some grades are capped so get no increases unless they move grade, which they can't if theres no new positions. Sometimes the increments have to be approved based on performance reviews etc. People can be stuck on the same salary for years, usually its the lower grades. In effect there can be a "pay freeze" depending where you are and what grade you are on.
 
I think 100 million for a new National Theatre in the docks shou,d go for a hop.
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I'd agree that this, along with some other non-essential projects in the arts, sport & community areas will feel the brunt of the cuts at budget time.
 
There are as yet no details on Health and Education Cut-backs . . . Sorry 'Cost Savings'.

I think these will be announced on a Friday evening during summer when Dail is in recess and everyone (who can afford it) is on holidays.

I'm was a passive Fianna Fail supporter but I am angry at the lack of a strong Opposition to really challenge these PR announcements and get democracy working.
 
Statement by Mary Harney, T.D.
Minister for Health & Children
Budgetary consolidation in 2008
8 July 2008

The Minister for Health and Children, Mary Harney T.D. said today (Tuesday 8 July, 2008) : " The budgetary consolidation measures decided by the Government today will ensure that we can continue on a sound fiscal basis which will support economic growth and provide for improved public services into the future."
"Within the Health Group of Votes, the 2008 Budget provided for an additional €1.16 billion expenditure in 2008 bringing the total to €16.156 billion."
"A total of €144.35m is to be saved within the health sector this year."
"The intention is that this amount will be saved through a combination of the following:
(i) savings of €85m in 2008 arising from the new nursing home support
scheme, the Fair Deal, which has still to be implemented. The
balance of the Fair Deal provision of €110 will be applied as set
out below.
(ii) savings of €38m in 2008 arising from the slower than expected
roll-out of the package of new developments provided for in the
December 2007 budget;
(iii) savings of €21.35m to be identified in administrative costs across
the Department and all agencies other than the HSE to include
payroll, advertising, procurement, consultancy; and in other
schemes within the Department of Health & Children (Vote 39) and
the Office of the Minister for Children (Vote 41).
These savings will not affect the provision of health services to patients and clients or the HSE capital plan in 2008."

Services for Older People – nursing home support
The Minister intends to submit the Fair Deal legislation, which is currently being finalised, to Government for approval to publish as soon as possible. The cost of the scheme will be provided for in 2009.
Sanction has now been received from the Department of Finance for
(i) the spending of €13m from the Fair Deal provision of €110m on
200 extra contract beds and
(ii) the use of a further €12m of these moneys for enhanced
subvention arising from increases in the cost of nursing
home fees.
These measures will assist older people and their families in advance of the completion and implementation of legislation on the Fair Deal.
The HSE has confirmed that it is aiming to deliver the National Service Plan submitted by the Board last November within its approved pre-Budget allocation.
The HSE has already started to roll out some of the new service developments funded in Budget 2008 and included in the Addendum to the Service Plan submitted by the Board in January 2008. Following a review of its overall financial position it now plans to commence the remaining developments next month.
ENDS

Press Office
Department of Health & Children
 
aircobra19 said:
I don't think so. Increments are not automatic across all areas of the Public sector. Some grades are capped so get no increases unless they move grade, which they can't if theres no new positions. Sometimes the increments have to be approved based on performance reviews etc. People can be stuck on the same salary for years, usually its the lower grades. In effect there can be a "pay freeze" depending where you are and what grade you are on.
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When a person reaches the top of their scale they get long term service increments, this is for people who cant move grade and have reached the top of their scale
 
You said every year. You might be waiting 5 or 6 yrs for long term service increments. Theres probably conditions attached too.
 
csirl said:
I cant see how the public sector pay bill can be cut by 3% without a reducing staff numbers.
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I think there is a subtle difference between talking about pay bills and "payroll costs" as Brian L put it. Doesn't "payroll costs" include overtime? What was the Prison Services and Garda overtiome bills for last year? And is travel expense included in "payroll costs", does anyone know?
 
And is travel expense included in "payroll costs", does anyone know?
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Travel expenses are under a different sub-head to payroll in the Book of Estimates.
 
aircobra19 said:
You said every year. You might be waiting 5 or 6 yrs for long term service increments. Theres probably conditions attached too.
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Most LSI are granted after 3 years and are granted in the same way as a normal incremenet. I am on a scale with 2 LSI's and due the last increment in 2011. After that I will receive the national pay awards unless I get a promotion to a different scale.
 
All this talk of public sector pay rises is taking focus off more serious things the government should be doing to get our economy out of trouble. Trimming here and there is all well and good, but as someone mentioned before - look at health. It eats a huge portion of the annual budget. We have moved from regional health boards, to a centralised health board, and now there's talk of going back to regional again. How much does this messing alone cost? Let alone the fact that whether it's regional or central matters not a damn - we still have a god-awful health service.

Decentralisation was a mess. The sooner it dies the better.

Public transport vested interests need to be tackled in order to have any hope of convincing people to use the unreliable, over-priced, poor quality, strike ridden(if you live in Cork) "service". And as an island nation we need excellent road and rail transport, and ports which are efficient and modern. These are the things that make a difference. Concentrating on saving is fine, but unless we address our real problems then this economy hasn't a hope of getting off it's knees any time soon.
 
And people wonder why it cost the hundreds of millions for PPARS, and in the end it still didn't work as a payroll system.

I've read the last dozen or so messages in this thread and I can't decipher for the life of me the beast that appears to be public sector pay - how what you do equates to what you get paid. There just doesn't appear to be any correllation. Expenses here, grades there, long service, short service.

I say stick all public sector employees into a big room with a fan at the bottom, ala The Crystal Maze, throw the wages in, turn on the fan and whatever you can grab you keep. Then if we could introduce some sort of Logans Run type scenario to reduce the numbers then all the better.
 
i have a friend whos girlfriend is a teacher and she is on less money than my friends sister who qualified at the same time. she has called and written to the payroll department countless times and cant get a reason or an answer to why this is. imagine that, the people that run the payroll cant say what the issue is . they cant even look after their own people, so how can they be expected to provide services for us mere mortals
 
If you wish to report any offensive post, you can do so by clicking on the red-outline triangle at the top right hand corner panel of the post panel.
 
I say stick all public sector employees into a big room with a fan at the bottom, ala The Crystal Maze, throw the wages in, turn on the fan and whatever you can grab you keep. Then if we could introduce some sort of Logans Run type scenario to reduce the numbers then all the better.


Logan's Run is a novel by William F. Nolan and George Clayton Johnson. Published in 1967, it depicts a dystopian future society in which population and the consumption of resources is managed and maintained in equilibrium by the simple expedient of demanding the death of everyone upon reaching a particular age, thus avoiding the issue of overpopulation. The story follows the actions of Logan, a Deep Sleep Operative or "Sandman" charged with enforcing the rule, as he "runs" from society's lethal demand.

Howitzer, your comment is neither funny nor useful,it is offensive. If you suggested this about another group in our society, you would probably be banned.
 
Brianne said:
I say stick all public sector employees into a big room with a fan at the bottom, ala The Crystal Maze, throw the wages in, turn on the fan and whatever you can grab you keep. Then if we could introduce some sort of Logans Run type scenario to reduce the numbers then all the better.


Logan's Run is a novel by William F. Nolan and George Clayton Johnson. Published in 1967, it depicts a dystopian future society in which population and the consumption of resources is managed and maintained in equilibrium by the simple expedient of demanding the death of everyone upon reaching a particular age, thus avoiding the issue of overpopulation. The story follows the actions of Logan, a Deep Sleep Operative or "Sandman" charged with enforcing the rule, as he "runs" from society's lethal demand.

Howitzer, your comment is neither funny nor useful,it is offensive. If you suggested this about another group in our society, you would probably be banned.
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Right so, you're first on the list. :p
 
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