Current public sentiment towards the housing market?

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yawha said:
The very fact that Irish people,particulary smart Irish people run away when things get tough is one of the reasons why Ireland has for decades been an economic and social disaster.
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Well maybe if everyone else wasn't so intent on wrecking the economy they might stick around ...

You can point the finger at FF and the PDs for doing little to stop the bubble but they can hardly be blamed for it.
 
yawha said:
The very fact that Irish people,particulary smart Irish people run away when things get tough is one of the reasons why Ireland has for decades been an economic and social disaster.
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Are you advocating that smart Irish people should just accept to live a meager existance, on the dole, at the expense of the government, should there be a downturn?

There's a good case for argument that the smart Irish people who went abroad in years gone by were partially responsible for some of the more recent economic success in the country when they returned.
 
yawha said:
The very fact that Irish people,particulary smart Irish people run away when things get tough is one of the reasons why Ireland has for decades been an economic and social disaster.
For all the flag waving that the Irish do,they certainly can't be too patriot if their doing it from abroad.
As JFK once said(of Irish stock ,Ironicaly) "Think not what your country can do for you but what you can do for your country".
The smart people need to stick around,spread their genes,make decent political parties and vote them into power.
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How do you expect recent school-leavers and college graduates to be 'patriotic' to a corrupt bunch of politicians who govern them? What did they expect? Unfortunately, the good work done by some in power by promoting free education and (more recently) 4th level research has/or soon will be been destroyed by a bunch of fat cats.

You can't blame young people for the failures of others
 
I think the blame game will go on for years. Whether it's immigrants, young people, middle-aged people, the EU, the US economy, the banks, the government, the media, estate agents, builders, etc., etc.
 
Duplex said:
So you think Merrill Lynch are spinning the news?


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Not necessarily, obviously there are indicators which speak for themselves and they are not good.

However the original article states "Merrill Lynch declared that housing is in a bear market and that a "buyer's market" for homes should last for "years."

While the indicators would tend to support the fact that there is a bear market how long it will last is more subjective and is in part Merrill's opinion.

Even a biased commentator can be right if the indicators do actually support their bias I just disagree with the assertion that because Merrill Lynch state it it must be true. When posters on AAM have quoted Estate Agents commentaries in the past it has been rightly pointed out to treat their arguments with caution as they may be spinning it to suit their particular view I would just caution the same for statements from brokers, look at the facts underlying their opinions and see if you think they support their conclusion, if you do fine.
 
dam099 said:
Not necessarily, obviously there are indicators which speak for themselves and they are not good.

However the original article states "Merrill Lynch declared that housing is in a bear market and that a "buyer's market" for homes should last for "years."

While the indicators would tend to support the fact that there is a bear market how long it will last is more subjective and is in part Merrill's opinion.

Even a biased commentator can be right if the indicators do actually support their bias I just disagree with the assertion that because Merrill Lynch state it it must be true. When posters on AAM have quoted Estate Agents commentaries in the past it has been rightly pointed out to treat their arguments with caution as they may be spinning it to suit their particular view I would just caution the same for statements from brokers, look at the facts underlying their opinions and see if you think they support their conclusion, if you do fine.
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Any significant falls in US housing market are bad news for american economy and merrill lynchs business, investment bankers have their fingers in every pie and are far less biased than estate agents as they can make money in many differnet ways unlike the estate agents. Even the US realtors and house builders are saying the markets bad and getting worse.
 
More pressure on ECB to raise interest rates:

http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/Story.aspx?guid=%7BF14E113D%2D1CF6%2D46D6%2D9F81%2DD0590C456409%7D&siteid=

The final sentence points out that rate hikes don't impact German consumers as much as in countries where they are highly leveraged on mortgage spending:

"It remains to be seen if the (hikes) have an impact on consumers in France and Spain due to their high leverage on mortgage spending, but especially in Germany it shouldn't be a problem"
 
Hi all, 1st post!
Whilst I agree that recent investors, highly geared with equity, should consider selling before rates rise, I believe that FTBs should still purchase assuming that the property meets their needs for the medium term and repayments can be met...and purely for non-financial reasons.

For anyone who remembers queuing up with 15 to 20 people outside a pokey house to be "interviewed" by smug tenants (many of whom are still renting I might add) I can assure you that home ownership rocks. No landlords & no sh1tty furniture. You're working hard and deserve a nice gaff. If rates rise..tighten the belts in other areas like everyone else..ride the storm and emerge, like everyone else.

For those who intend hanging on and waiting to buy "when" property is cheap I have heard that argument for the last 5 years...and given the lack of proper rent control in this country, who in their right mind would want to rent for several years if they had the choice?

My advice is buy your first gaff and enjoy the dinner parties!

Firefly
 
Firefly said:
Hi all, 1st post!
Whilst I agree that recent investors, highly geared with equity, should consider selling before rates rise, I believe that FTBs should still purchase assuming that the property meets their needs for the medium term and repayments can be met...and purely for non-financial reasons.

For anyone who remembers queuing up with 15 to 20 people outside a pokey house to be "interviewed" by smug tenants (many of whom are still renting I might add) I can assure you that home ownership rocks. No landlords & no sh1tty furniture. You're working hard and deserve a nice gaff. If rates rise..tighten the belts in other areas like everyone else..ride the storm and emerge, like everyone else.

For those who intend hanging on and waiting to buy "when" property is cheap I have heard that argument for the last 5 years...and given the lack of proper rent control in this country, who in their right mind would want to rent for several years if they had the choice?

My advice is buy your first gaff and enjoy the dinner parties!

Firefly
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Can't wait to hear the dinner party chatter when the bubble bursts! For once property wont be the only thing on the agenda! Only a few people were saying prices were overvalued 5 years ago, the yields were pretty good and rent nearly covered a mortgage,if you cant see the difference between now and 5 years ago then god love ya. the fundamentals are far worse now than 5 years ago, who knows the few guys who predicted things may be proved right to an extent in the future. i dont think property will be any higher in real terms in 15 years time than now.massive oversupply is coming down the tracks.
 
Firefly said:
Hi all, 1st post!
Whilst I agree that recent investors, highly geared with equity, should consider selling before rates rise, I believe that FTBs should still purchase assuming that the property meets their needs for the medium term and repayments can be met...and purely for non-financial reasons.

For anyone who remembers queuing up with 15 to 20 people outside a pokey house to be "interviewed" by smug tenants (many of whom are still renting I might add) I can assure you that home ownership rocks. No landlords & no sh1tty furniture. You're working hard and deserve a nice gaff. If rates rise..tighten the belts in other areas like everyone else..ride the storm and emerge, like everyone else.

For those who intend hanging on and waiting to buy "when" property is cheap I have heard that argument for the last 5 years...and given the lack of proper rent control in this country, who in their right mind would want to rent for several years if they had the choice?

My advice is buy your first gaff and enjoy the dinner parties!

Firefly
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What happens if the only gaff you can afford is in some kip in dublin or else 30 - 40 miles outside of dublin,do you really want to be stuck there for the next 10 -15 years.
My advice is to hold your ground and bide your time,build up as much cash as you can while renting.
The crash will come may be 6 months on the inside,may be 36 months on the outside but it's coming.
 
yawha said:
For all the flag waving that the Irish do,they certainly can't be too patriot if their doing it from abroad.
As JFK once said(of Irish stock ,Ironicaly) "Think not what your country can do for you but what you can do for your country".
The smart people need to stick around,spread their genes,make decent political parties and vote them into power.
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Only an idiot would hang around a country that has turned into a basket case when they could emigrate to some other country where there is a better standard of living, better weather and more jobs to be had. Smart people stick around ? Are you kidding? Smart people get the hell away from crap situations.
 
Firefly said:
For anyone who remembers queuing up with 15 to 20 people outside a pokey house to be "interviewed" by smug tenants (many of whom are still renting I might add) I can assure you that home ownership rocks. No landlords & no sh1tty furniture. You're working hard and deserve a nice gaff.
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My landlord is about to give me ANOTHER discount on my rent. Most of the furniture is mine, and I can't keep "guests" away because of my central location and my patio. I also walk to work.
 
walk2dewater said:
My landlord is about to give me ANOTHER discount on my rent. Most of the furniture is mine, and I can't keep "guests" away because of my central location and my patio. I also walk to work.
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Nice one! Our landlord hasn't upped ours for the second year running (we had got ~17% reduction over the previous two years) I didn't have the heart to ask for another reduction as he is getting a pitiful yield (<1.8%) from it and he is a decent guy
 
Firefly said:
For anyone who remembers queuing up with 15 to 20 people outside a pokey house to be "interviewed" by smug tenants
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It’s nice to reminisce! However the situation is very different now. Huge supply of rental properties, many of them new, professionally decorated - with or without furniture. Rent is so much cheaper than a mortgage and with increasing supply, even when the house price bubble bursts - rent will be competitive.
 
All the fancy furniture in the world provided by your landlord still isn't yours and all the while your cash is paying off someone elses mortgage. If the rent your paying is more than the interest payments on a mtg then you are in negative cashflow...the principal part of a mortgage is simply repaying for what you own..
In reference to being stuck somewhere 30-40 miles from Dublin, my first point is that the house should suit your needs...

POint taken that rents have reduced recently and conditions are better, but this could easily revert to the old days without proper rent control.

Firefly.
 
question for the people who say they'll cut and run if we hit a downturn - where do you intend going to?
If its house-price booms (and potential busts) you're avoiding you'll have to rule out large tracts of the US, Australia and the UK as well as the numerous other markets that have experience record house-price growth in the last 8 years. In this globalised world I suspect the bottom might fall out of several markets simultaneously, narrowing options considerably.
As the cliche says 'If America catches cold, the rest of the world sneezes...'

Its not as if dIreland is the only country run by incompetent, corrupt fools .......
 
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