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SHARP
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......and only €5894 pm* over 30 years (92% loan)
Sure with interest rates on the rise aswell, €6,000 a month seems like a bargain, eh? 30 years and it could be all yours......................
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......and only €5894 pm* over 30 years (92% loan)
Sure with interest rates on the rise aswell, €6,000 a month seems like a bargain, eh? 30 years and it could be all yours......................
Typical bullish argument on here. Dismiss the facts that the bears are quoting with some vague response that belies the obvious.
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phoenix_n
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I tend to disagree. If you were going to buy a house would you not now offer a lower amount than the advertised price and expect it to be taken seriously. I know properties that got their asking price offered on first viewing earlier this year. You have to agree that those days are over. So isolated price drops tells you alot. And these isolated price drops are only what a couple of posters here have found.
When several people have posted drops seperately in different areas (presumably that they've been watching) how is the data 'isolated'?
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plaudit
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This thread is about sentiment and from the articles that people are posting and the price drops being highlighted show that sentiment is changing towards bearish.
There are plenty of 20% price drops in asking price being quoted on this thread, not just 5%.
I'm sure if you looked you could have found isolated drops in asking prices at any time in the last five years. I'm aware of below asking bids that were accepted, certainly. A drop in an already inflated asking price doesn't on its own prove anything, that's my point.
And who said I was a bull?
And who said I was a bull?
...try telling that to a vendor who's had to go through the hell of dropping their price.
Asking price drops are widespread.
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phoenix_n
Guest
Pick a house or two where you live. Phone up your EA. That will tell you everything.
Not true - I haven't seen it since 2001 which was the last time that prices dropped!
A drop in an already inflated asking price proves:
That a buyer at any price no longer exists
That a touch of reality has entered the market
That EA's and sellers are being forced to accept that the properties are worth less than previously thought
That the sentiment that caused the inflated asking prices no longer exists
I won't bother adding a conclusion to the above, it should be obvious.
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plaudit
Guest
Prices can't drop though lads, we are getting a soft landing and its 5% growth after that. Happy days.
Trichet speaks on Thursday @12.00 and the press conference is set for 12.45, this is key, where he will indicate the stance for the new year. The way I see it:
0.25% rise October
0.25% rise December is "probable"
0.25% rise In February 2007 "possible"*
*I think this will be changed to "probable" at Thursdays press conference as the markets have partially priced this in already.
Trichet speaks on Thursday @12.00 and the press conference is set for 12.45, this is key, where he will indicate the stance for the new year. The way I see it:
0.25% rise October
0.25% rise December is "probable"
0.25% rise In February 2007 "possible"*
*I think this will be changed to "probable" at Thursdays press conference as the markets have partially priced this in already.
I think finding lots of examples of price drops is also very significant in the context of record withdrawals from auctions, buildup of unsold houses (25% up on last year) , interest rates marching higher, us market in trouble, increasing evidence of financial stress for borrowers and consumer sentiment on a general downtrend. (did I miss anything?)
liteweight
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I think drops will only really signify something when house/apt/ prices start to fall below what was asked, for the same type of property, in early 2006. Everyone is in agreement (?) that Spring prices were an anomaly. Unfortunately vendors seem to have taken these figures....added 20% and taken their property to market. Every house and every road/area has a ceiling and, in the case of most of the houses displayed on this thread today, I believe the vendors were chancing their arm in the first place.
The market is definitely weakening but I don't believe it's on it's last gasp yet. If that's to happen, and its still an 'if'....it won't be until the next SSIA payout. If anyone here has a crystal ball.......I'm open to advice!
The market is definitely weakening but I don't believe it's on it's last gasp yet. If that's to happen, and its still an 'if'....it won't be until the next SSIA payout. If anyone here has a crystal ball.......I'm open to advice!
It's amazing how the EA's and other vested interests have been so quick to call a soft landing at the first sign of a weaker market.
The full effect of the initial interest rate rises has not been felt yet and we still have a few more rate hikes to come. It's a sad story that they have already had to call a soft landing to encourage any straggling buyers to "come on IN!!!"
liteweight
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Houses in certain areas dropped. D4 in 2002?
Drops in asking prices are significant to me because they are happening in that sector of the market which *everyone* suggested would be okay because they were the high-ish end markets/trader uppers/in good locations. If asking prices are dropping at all, it can only be because the properties are not shifting.
Whilest I would say a drop in an inflated asking price doesn't prove anything, I have been intrigued that asking prices in my area, which generally went up between 10K and 20K for each new similar accommodation in a specific estate coming on the market, have run into a brick wall.
I'm not sure what would constitute "proof" to people who are convinced by softlandings and "you can't lose on property" - I'm not sure you even form part of that community. It seems to me that every single nail in that coffin is explained away by specialised "oh that case was overvalued anyway". The problem is, everything is overvalued by the market in this country, and that is not sustainable.
In any case, if you could have found "isolated" price drops at any time in the last 5 years, it is incumbant on you to prove it. The problem as I see it is that the number of price drops turning up here seems to be growing on a day to day basis. The market is in trouble, it seems. How much that trouble is caused by stamp duty related waiting and seeing and how much of it is caused by affordability barriers remains to be seen. The fact remains that there is a limit to the amount of money that people can spend on housing and while I cannot claim that it is now true that we have reached the limit, it would appear that options are starting to run low.
Clearly they must be. Property is hanging around on the market longer and desperate strategems are being applied. A year or so ago I told an estate agent I would put in an offer of AP-20K on some property and the response I got was a sarcastic laugh and a comment to the effect that he wouldn't even bother telling the seller about the offer because frankly, he was expecting to make AP+40K. Asking prices, you see, weren't reflections of what people wanted. They were just gimicks.
Now, they're gimicks in a different direction. Instead of understating the price, they're over stating it and in increasing numbers.
No, it doesn't prove anything at all...but it is an interesting change.
Weakening property markets don't make gasps. Once a trend is set in motion, it takes either a huge event or a long time to reverse. Rising interest rates have hit the market and there are a few more blows to come.
SSIA effect on property is rubbish. The amounts are not big enough to affect the trade-up market and people of FTB age don't have them. How old would current FTB's have been when SSIA's were released five years ago? I don't know anyone in their 20's with an SSIA.
As someone trying without much success to sell their home, I can tell you that there is a definite change in the market, which I have unfortunately experienced, first hand.
Originally, I put the house up for slightly less than next door sold for at Easter. Since then, I have had to drop the price twice in the five/six weeks the house has been up, and even to achieve the current asking price, that is still €16K less than the exact same house next door (similar decor, etc) got last Easter. And I am at the bottom of the market.
I have had to change EA, as I dont the previous EA was not agressive enough to market the property in the changing market. People are very hesitant, even EA's about the drop. My EA told me that prices in the area are "correcting themselves" at the moment.
I thought originally that it was just an over supply of houses in Lucan, but over the past few weeks and having spoken to other people trying to sell in different areas, its the same all over.
One resident has even taken to advertising their house in the Evening Herald as "Bargain, Bargain, Bargain, €10K off.....just to get their sale.
Originally, I put the house up for slightly less than next door sold for at Easter. Since then, I have had to drop the price twice in the five/six weeks the house has been up, and even to achieve the current asking price, that is still €16K less than the exact same house next door (similar decor, etc) got last Easter. And I am at the bottom of the market.
I have had to change EA, as I dont the previous EA was not agressive enough to market the property in the changing market. People are very hesitant, even EA's about the drop. My EA told me that prices in the area are "correcting themselves" at the moment.
I thought originally that it was just an over supply of houses in Lucan, but over the past few weeks and having spoken to other people trying to sell in different areas, its the same all over.
One resident has even taken to advertising their house in the Evening Herald as "Bargain, Bargain, Bargain, €10K off.....just to get their sale.
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