BUPA leaving Ireland

Re: Bupa leaving Ireland All Fermoy jobs lost

anybody who is renewing or has renewed their bupa subscription in jan'07 will have cover (according to their plan) for 2007. bupa will not be renewing subscriptions from feb'07 onwards.
 
Re: Bupa leaving Ireland All Fermoy jobs lost

Why is it the Governments fault? It's private business.

Plus, Vivas health are quite a realistic alternative so talk of a monopoly is just typical reactionary nonsense by people who were too blinkered to be aware of their presence. One wonders how these people can properly feel aggrieved now considering they obviously were not fully aware of the range of products in the market to begin with.l
 
Re: Bupa leaving Ireland All Fermoy jobs lost

greenfield said:
Just looking at Vivas website and the price is certainly compatible with Bupa, however my concern would be whether many consultants are willing to accept Vivas payment - anyone know?
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Their coverage with consultants is as good as VHI. I recently had to make my first claim with them and they covered the cost of the blood works as well as the consultant's charge, which surprised the lab as neither VHI nor BUPA would have covered it.
 
Re: Bupa leaving Ireland All Fermoy jobs lost

Bupa's press statement [broken link removed].

Letter to their members [broken link removed].

Notice for members renewing in January [broken link removed].
 
Bupa leaving Ireland All Fermoy jobs lost

... blaming risk equalisation.
Full story here: [broken link removed]

What will happen with Vivas? Do you reckon it's a bluff to get the government to do a U-turn?
 
Re: Bupa leaving Ireland All Fermoy jobs lost

Thanks for that, reassuring to know that Vivas customers are happy, had looked at Vivas before but was never tempted to change as was very happy with Bupa and the price difference was minimal, however will definitely now consider as alternative to VHI
 
Re: Bupa leaving Ireland All Fermoy jobs lost

greenfield said:
Thanks for that, reassuring to know that Vivas customers are happy, had looked at Vivas before but was never tempted to change as was very happy with Bupa and the price difference was minimal, however will definitely now consider as alternative to VHI
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I only switched over earlier this year. I was really happy with Bupa, but even a few extra quid in my pocket was worth the move. Have had no problems with Vivas so far.
 
Re: Bupa leaving Ireland All Fermoy jobs lost

If we all change over to Vivas, wont we just all be in the same position a few years down the line again ?

I cant see Vivas paying over lumps of money to the VHI either. Who would believe that in order to get rid of a monopoly, the incoming supplier has to pay over wads of cash to compensate the original supplier that had it so good for donkeys years. It is very hard to blame BUPA. They were a breath of fresh air and provided really good options.

This Republic is crazy. Anyway, I am going out to my garden to tend to my banana tree.

Disgusted I am, disgusted.
 
Re: Bupa leaving Ireland All Fermoy jobs lost

Dinky said:
I only switched over earlier this year. I was really happy with Bupa, but even a few extra quid in my pocket was worth the move. Have had no problems with Vivas so far.
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I am with Vivas too for the last year. I have had no problems at all with them. I had to get an MRI scan earlier in the year and it was fully covered. Just had to fill out a form. Found their customer service v good too over the phone. BTW i have no affiliation with Vivas just mentioning my experiences with them and that they are a decent alternative to VHI.
 
Re: Bupa leaving Ireland All Fermoy jobs lost

It might be a little late but perhaps a solution would be to forceably move a tranche of higher risk VHI customers to BUPA, VIVAS and (yes) ESB providend.

Inertia and a (misguided) sense of loyalty is all that is holding these customers anyway.

On the other hand I have to agree with Brendan - the whole private health insurance edifice in Ireland is an artificial construct built on a seriously flawed view of how (insurance) business operates.
 
Re: Bupa leaving Ireland All Fermoy jobs lost

Has to be the final nail in the coffin for this government.
 
Re: Bupa leaving Ireland All Fermoy jobs lost

You mean like the previous nails which caused their popularity to soar in subsequent opinion polls?
 
Re: Bupa leaving Ireland All Fermoy jobs lost

elefantfresh said:
For Gods sake, whats wrong with this Government?
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How much time have you got ?

They have made an absolute pigs ear of this.
And silly me thinking that the health sector couldn't get any worse.
 
Re: Bupa leaving Ireland All Fermoy jobs lost

Far be it from me to defend either the government or the VHI, but BUPA are no 'life saviours', either — just another hard-nosed insurance company chasing profit. More efficiently than others, I'll grant you.

Two points worth bearing in mind:

(a) In Australia, where they are among the dominant players, BUPA receive Risk Equalisation payments and are happy to do so.

(b) When they entered the Irish market, BUPA knew that Risk Equalisation was part of the 1994 legislation. Now that the numbers aren't working out, they claim to have been 'forced out of the market'?

Methinks Martin O'Rourke is shedding a few crocodile tears in those populist press releases/letters to members.
Irish consumers are the real losers...
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Insurance of any kind is predicated on the company's gain and the consumers' (aggregate) loss.
 
Re: Bupa leaving Ireland All Fermoy jobs lost

Will Vivas follow suit? They have also not been paying into the risk equalisation scheme. They are also going to face higher costs as a result of the ruling.
 
Re: Bupa leaving Ireland All Fermoy jobs lost

jprender said:
How much time have you got ?

They have made an absolute pigs ear of this.
And silly me thinking that the health sector couldn't get any worse.
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Moan, moan, moan. What could the government have done differently? Given into the blackmail demands of BUPA? If you have community rating, you have to have risk equalisation or it just won't work.

Brendan said:
It's time that the government got rid of community rating and risk equalisation.

Brendan
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Community rating makes private health insurance affordable for older people. Yes it would be nice if we had a good enough health service that no-one needed private health insurance but we don't and it would be particularly unfair to older people who have paid above-risk costs in their younger years (in the expectation of in turn being subsidised when they get older) to find themselves priced out just when they need the cover.
None of the moany 'isn't the government terrible' posts has offered anything constructive. What is the alternative to risk equalisation? Do you think community rating can trundle along without RE? Is rating by age feasible? What about people who have contributed to VHI for years in the expectation of subsidy when they get older? Is it fair that BUPA make big profits because they have a younger profile of customers?

I think that BUPA should absolutely be permitted to profit from any efficiencies they introduce into the system (e.g. shortening the average hospital stay from X to Y days etc.) but not from being 'lucky' enough to have a younger profile of customers.

An 'age at entry' system would be a fairer to individuals. One unfairness that we currently have with community rating is that someone can join at age 64 (when they will be a net beneficiary) and pay the same price as someone who has been contributing since they were born. Age at entry woud mean having a price for those who joined at birth, a slightly higher price for those who join at 20 and a higher price for each joining age so that someone joining at age 64 would pay significantly more than a 64 year old who had been there from birth. You would still need risk equalisation between companies though....
 
Re: Bupa leaving Ireland All Fermoy jobs lost

My own (admittedly limited) understanding of the health insurance market is that Ireland is the only country in the world that applies risk equalisation where there is a dominant player in the market with more than a 30% share of the market. I also understand that community rating operates successfully in many countries without risk equalisation, although I stand to be corrected if necessary on both counts.

It doesn't sound sensible that a market is closed to competition for decades, that the monopoly provider can use its monopoly power to expand its customer base over that time, and that as soon as a new entrant enters the market they have to pay the incumbent for effectively failing to attract a certain specified range of customers.

I think this particular mess could have serious political implications for the PDs and for FF. A lot of Bupa customers will be renewing their health insurance over the next 6 months and will resent having to forcibly switch to VHI or Vivas. Not to mention the 300+ jobs gone in Cork.
 
Re: Bupa leaving Ireland All Fermoy jobs lost

orka said:
Moan, moan, moan. What could the government have done differently?
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um, let me think.....

perhaps let the health insurers battle it out for business in an open market ?

If Bupa have been "lucky" enough to attract the more lucrative younger people, why havent VHI done something about it to get them back ?
You know... something really radical like reduce their charges.

Government/ Brewery / Piss-up / organise / couldn't

are the words that spring to mind.
 
Re: Bupa leaving Ireland All Fermoy jobs lost

do BUPA or VIVAS prevent older people from joining up? If not why do older people not avail of savings?
 
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