You're getting the emphasis wrong. They say that you MAY move out to accommodate merging traffic, not that you must move out regardless. Being in the left lane approaching a merge is usually perfectly fine.
Appropriate approach to someone driving at 90kph in the middle lane of the Naas Rd?
- Thread starter Joe_90
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You're getting the emphasis wrong. They say that you MAY move out to accommodate merging traffic, not that you must move out regardless. Being in the left lane approaching a merge is usually perfectly fine.
A big issue with some people driving in Ireland is that they do not join in the Motorway at a safe or matching speed. They seem to stick to 60-80kph and then pull into Lane 1 forcing all traffic behind to move into Lane 2.
Also, good practice will say that if you are on a motorway you should move over if it is safe to do so to allow merging traffic. On approaching a junction, advanced driving courses will tell you to move over in advance of a merging lane.
No matter if you think it is silly or not, it is dangerous and against the rules of the road. Really do wish Gardai clamp down on this and middle lane hoggers. Both are signs of ignorant and incompetent driving.
It's endemic on the N7 all the time and it drives me mad because it is extremely dangerous. I rank it up there with mobile phone use and wonder how many accidents it causes because you can clearly see the impact it has on traffic flow and driver behaviour.
I have seen marked and unmarked Garda cars ignore this and it's one of the things that makes me think about a "Russian" web cam on the dash.
From my observations, it is usually older male drivers and women drivers who do this.
(Am ducking now)
I have seen marked and unmarked Garda cars ignore this and it's one of the things that makes me think about a "Russian" web cam on the dash.
From my observations, it is usually older male drivers and women drivers who do this.
(Am ducking now)
Brendan Burgess
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Hi MichaelM
Despite our learned counsel, Mathepac's analysis of your case, I think your overall obligation is to drive safely. And it is clearly safer to pass a car on the inside than cross over two lanes, overtake him and then cross over again in front of him to the inside lane.
I will give evidence on your behalf.
Brendan
From the ads I always take it that you should and always do. Precisely because living off the N3 I wish more drivers would move to lane 2, merge is at most 200m to the M50S
Was this discussed before here ;
http://www.askaboutmoney.com/showthread.php?t=34604
From my reading of it traffic on motorway always has right of way.
http://www.askaboutmoney.com/showthread.php?t=34604
From my reading of it traffic on motorway always has right of way.
For what it's worth
-the Naas Road is a dual carraigeway so the rules for motorways do not apply.
-when I was doing my driving test, allbeit a long-time ago, the rules for driving on dual-carriageway were that you overtake on the right, unless traffic in your lane is moving faster than traffic in lanes to your right.
-so on that basis, just for the question asked, C, stay in lane, pass car in middle lane.
-note moving into the left hand lane to overtake is not allowed and may be what the Gardaí have pulled people in for.
I would agree that people dont know how to drive motorways here. Compared to Germany, Switzerland it's very unmannerly and at times very dangerous. They really need to educate people to pull out to the outer lanes to allow a safe merge. Anything else just causes backlogs on ramps at busy times for no reason or worse, could cause accidents when impatient drivers just pull out in front of moving traffic rather than slow down and wait for a safe gap.
Another gripe is motorists not getting in the inside or filter lane early enough to safely exit a motorway, at 80kmph or less. Instead some weave in and out of lanes, possibly crossing 2 lanes of traffic to exit at the last moment, often taking advantage of the safe zone left by a driver to the car in front of them, and then slam on the brakes, thus putting the safety of the driver that does it by the book in danger. Madness!
-the Naas Road is a dual carraigeway so the rules for motorways do not apply.
-when I was doing my driving test, allbeit a long-time ago, the rules for driving on dual-carriageway were that you overtake on the right, unless traffic in your lane is moving faster than traffic in lanes to your right.
-so on that basis, just for the question asked, C, stay in lane, pass car in middle lane.
-note moving into the left hand lane to overtake is not allowed and may be what the Gardaí have pulled people in for.
I would agree that people dont know how to drive motorways here. Compared to Germany, Switzerland it's very unmannerly and at times very dangerous. They really need to educate people to pull out to the outer lanes to allow a safe merge. Anything else just causes backlogs on ramps at busy times for no reason or worse, could cause accidents when impatient drivers just pull out in front of moving traffic rather than slow down and wait for a safe gap.
Another gripe is motorists not getting in the inside or filter lane early enough to safely exit a motorway, at 80kmph or less. Instead some weave in and out of lanes, possibly crossing 2 lanes of traffic to exit at the last moment, often taking advantage of the safe zone left by a driver to the car in front of them, and then slam on the brakes, thus putting the safety of the driver that does it by the book in danger. Madness!
Assuming we have two adult, law-abiding, responsible and fairly competent drivers, the following is the ideal scenario:
- Driver "B", realising he is gaining on Driver "A", indicates right and moves into Lane 2 when it is safe to do so.
- Driver "A", observing her mirrors, sees a car behind her in Lane 2, indicates left and moves to Lane 1 when it is safe to do so
- Driver "B" passes Driver "A" safely on her right and when it is safe to do so, indicates left and moves to Lane 1.
Of course if either or both of the drivers is not law-abiding, responsible and competent, anything is possible, including some of the illegal and dangerous manoeuvres described in the thread already.
[LATE EDIT: I forgot to say that if there is slower-moving traffic in Lane 1, Driver "A" can stay in Lane 2. Driver "B" must then use Lane 3 to overtake her, moving back to Lane 2 when it is safe to do so.
I can only suggest you take up your issues with Uncle Gaybo, the Guards and ultimately the legislators.
Not sure why you mention the Naas road but for the record I do C in Ireland where every motorway or whatever you want to call them has most of the trafic in the middle lane, often with none at all in the driving lane. But I know A is the correct procedure.
I don't like passing out and A requires a minimum of 5 steps and I'd prefer to relax and do C. I consider A is a heck of a lot more dangerous than C.
Where there is a sliproad joining the motorway I change lane to allow trafic to join and then go back into the driving lane. And I must say it's a lot more of a pleasure to drive on all the new motorways and indeed even the M50 is great now since it ceased to be a car park. And they've a wonderful new system in place for rented cars and tolls on it now whereby it goes automatically on your credit card. Not sure what those who drive from the UK do as their is no way they could possible understand that the toll is actually there etc.
Bill Struth
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Up until a few years ago it was acceptable in this country to drive out of the test centre after having failed your driving test.
60,000 people were given full licenses in 1979 despite never having passed a driving test.
A study last year showed that 43% of learner drivers were driving unaccompanied.
Any wonder standards are so poor.
60,000 people were given full licenses in 1979 despite never having passed a driving test.
A study last year showed that 43% of learner drivers were driving unaccompanied.
Any wonder standards are so poor.
I agree, passing out while driving is to be avoided at all costs.
You have the option of driving in lane 1, but if you want to overtake, then following the ROTR is the best idea.
Not only standards are poor, obeying the rules or good sense is poor and courtesy is poor. Many of the junctions are poorly designed in this country. Very much designed by engineers and with little thought to the practicalities of using them.
If it drives you nuts, does that not suggests you are consistently driving faster than the traffic in the middle lane. So you are constantly overtaking in effect. So is there a need to constantly move to the slowest moving inside lane?
If its safer to go between the middle and the outside lane, I think that's more important than obeying the letter of the law by diving to the inside lane constantly. Or undertaking.
If it drives you nuts, does that not suggests you are consistently driving faster than the traffic in the middle lane. So you are constantly overtaking in effect. So is there a need to constantly move to the slowest moving inside lane?
If its safer to go between the middle and the outside lane, I think that's more important than obeying the letter of the law by diving to the inside lane constantly. Or undertaking.
Whilst I know that A is correct & I will do so whenever possible (usually with a bit of a dirty look) there are times, this is not an option
I was on the Nass road - 3 lovely wide lanes. There was actually NOTHING in the middle lane (unusual I know) - they were all on the outside overtaking lane (lane 3). Almost bumper to bumper. There were a scattering of cars on the driving lane, so I stayed where I was & cruised alone. Technically incorrect, I know, but had I moved to lane 3 I would have not made progress & just added to the problem.
It would have been interesting to see what a garda would have said - who is more in the wrong? The cars in lane 3 who are not overtaking or the (fewer) cars in lane 1 who are doing as they should - driving.
Another time I joined the M50 at Blanchardstown & drove to Firhouse. There was a car in lane 3 the WHOLE way. He was doing 100kmp, but never moved over. I was behind him (in lane 1 & doing the same speed). Loads of cars flashed him, honked etc & eventually undertook him on Lane 2 (yes, I am aware they would have been speeding).
In what ways? Some of the merging lanes on the autobahns and freeways are quite short - you wouldn't get away with dawdling on to the mainline at 70 km/hr!
Bill Struth
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Why do people use the term 'driving lane?'
they're all driving lanes aren't they?
'Fast lane' is another one that's used quite often.
they're all driving lanes aren't they?
'Fast lane' is another one that's used quite often.
Things like roundabouts with two marked exit lanes at the same, going into a single lane.
Roundabouts just too small with two many lanes.
Exit ramps where the left lane goes right and the right lane goes left.
Lane marking which change immediately after a blind crest.
A filter off lane with suddenly vastly lower speed (due to a tight bend) than the main road.
A favorite one in a local estate where they widened the road, removed verges, trees, and footpaths to create a bus lane. Then added about 4 sets of lights, and narrowed all lanes including the new bus lane into one lane in two places, creating bottle necks where previously there were none.
Inconsistent cycle lanes. In the same estate there's about 5 of roundabouts. Each one has the cycle lanes done a completely different way.
Roundabouts just too small with two many lanes.
Exit ramps where the left lane goes right and the right lane goes left.
Lane marking which change immediately after a blind crest.
A filter off lane with suddenly vastly lower speed (due to a tight bend) than the main road.
A favorite one in a local estate where they widened the road, removed verges, trees, and footpaths to create a bus lane. Then added about 4 sets of lights, and narrowed all lanes including the new bus lane into one lane in two places, creating bottle necks where previously there were none.
Inconsistent cycle lanes. In the same estate there's about 5 of roundabouts. Each one has the cycle lanes done a completely different way.
Never heard "driving lane"
Why do people use "Fast lane" ? seems pretty obvious. Its the fastest lane.
In any event, the clown doting in the middle lane is probably as likely to switch, without checking mirrors, into the outside lane as he is the inside lane.
Bill Struth
Registered User
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'Driving lane' has been used a couple of times in this thread.
So if someone is undertaking in the inside lane, thereby going fastest, is this then the 'fast lane?'
'Fast lane' is the incorrect term to use, they are, of course, all fast lanes.