Advice on a relationship issue?

[Firefly]

Thank you for all points of view. I can understand why I probably come across as a nag and somebody just thinking about myself. One thing I haven't mentioned that is really troubling me is the fact that for the past two years he has been at me and at me to have a child. Now, finances over the past two years didn't allow for this but now we are in a better place - or at least I thought we were. I worry now that even though he wants a baby so badly now- he might not be ready for it and I am worried that I'll end up trying to work and pay bills and not have any time to spend with a baby. It's all very confusing.

Hi Bullwinkle and sorry for your predicament.

Have you spoken about why he wants a child so much? There are probably valid reasons, but I note from your first post that, before this current job, he has been unemployed for a long period of time. It sounds to me, (and I'm no marriage councillor), that perhaps having a child will enable him to be a stay-at-home Dad. Nothing wrong with that of course, but maybe that's a way for him to avoid going back to work. Apologies if this causes any offense as I obviously do not know you nor your husband...just what came to mind when linking the comment above with your first post.

Firefly.

 

[bullwinkle]

Hi Bullwinkle and sorry for your predicament.

Have you spoken about why he wants a child so much? There are probably valid reasons, but I note from your first post that, before this current job, he has been unemployed for a long period of time. It sounds to me, (and I'm no marriage councillor), that perhaps having a child will enable him to be a stay-at-home Dad. Nothing wrong with that of course, but maybe that's a way for him to avoid going back to work. Apologies if this causes any offense as I obviously do not know you nor your husband...just what came to mind when linking the comment above with your first post.

Firefly.

Indeed, I have been thinking this myself but the reality is that without a second income it is going to be very difficult for us to have a child. Our house is quite old and needs a lot of work done to it - practical things like plumbing - insulation etc and all of that had been planned for this year so that we could go ahead and start the family etc. He knew the money situation was already tight enough.

 

[dmos87]

You mention in your posts that you take care of the housekeeping, meals, etc.

As your partner has now taken the decision to be at home, advise him that it is now his responsibility to take care of the housekeeping, washing, cooking, and everything else that comes with it until he gets a job. At least that will take some of the stress off your shoulders for now.

Sit down with him this evening and tell him you are proud of him for leaving a job he was unhappy in, and that you understand his decision even though you might not agree with it. Tell him you hope it helps him to be happier, and that all you want is for him to be happy. Tell him that you need his support in keeping your family afloat, and that means taking care of the house so you have one less worry. Be honest with him by saying you are not comfortable starting a family with the debt that you are currently working so hard to clear, and that once this is resolved you would love to start a family with him. This last point might motivate him to find work.

You need to ask him to please be open with you on how he was and is feeling. Try and put yourself in his shoes when he is explaining his feelings, however frustrating it may be. You both need to discuss his options for the future - and there are plenty! You need to encourage him, that will do wonders for his confidence.

I am not a counsellor of any sorts, but you two have communication issues. It seems to me that somewhere along the line of being supportive you have begun "controlling" him in ways - and this is not your fault, it has simply happened. From an outsider looking in, him quitting the job was his way of taking some of that control back.

 

[Plek Trum]

If its any consolation, I imagine your story is a very similar one to many households around the country at the minute.

For what its worth, I would recommend approaching this from a different perspective perhaps (hard to put your frustrations to one side I know but bear with me!) I imagine your husband is feeling lost, under valued, somewhat depressed and wondering 'how did it all go wrong?'. In order to prise him our of this predicament you may have to encourage, help and guide him until he comes up to speed and feels motivated again.

Pick up the book 'What Colour is Your Parachute', have a read yourself for first few chapters and then recommend it to him as a start to 'getting his life back' Be patient, do not place demans or deadlines but let him know that as a team, you really need him with you so you can get back on track together and then, hopefuly in time, consdier starting your family.

Also, please check out volunteer groups in your area - local Education Services are always looking for Volunteer Tutors to help with literacy classes. Try also googling 'Volunteer Ireland' or similar (as I dont know where you are I cant be more specific)

Volunteer work in the interim may just give him the sense of self worth that he needs to break out of this cycle, plus its a committment which will hopefully instigate the changes needed. Who knows where it may take him, he may discover a new area of interest that he hadn't explored previiously and help make changes to the lives of others along the way. Also its a great reference source for when that job does come along.

Patience, encouragement and a sense of wanting to improve his situation 'together'.
Hope it all works out, let us know.

 

[bullwinkle]

Here's the thing now - He seems really chilled out and happy over the last week which is good for him. Meanwhile, I'm working out budget plans, trying to get extra work sorted which means this week i'll be working 6.5 days, i'll have Sunday evening off. He is acting like we haven't a care in the world. I must admit I am struggling to hold my temper at the moment and grateful that I have this extra work to keep me away from the house - it's just so frustrating. I have cancelled four very important things which I had planned over the next few months as I don't have the money now to go ahead and do them. I have also cancelled a course which I was due to take, I had put it off when he was unemployed before and had rearranged to start in March - can't afford this one now either. I am waiting for him to decide what he wants to do, job wise/training wise etc but at the moment he is at home making dinner just happy out! I am trying the softly softly supportive attitude but the more gentle I am the lazier he appears to be getting.

I do believe he may be depressed or something - it's the only thing I can think of to explain it -I mentioned to him that he might be depressed , he completely denied it - won't hear of seeing somebody & thinks I am completely off my head & he thinks I'm completely over reacting. In his mind, he lost the job and he is telling everybody that he they had to let him go - last in first out (i'm going along with him when he tells people this, even though he has admitted to me that he knows he lost it over attitude/laziness etc) .

And so we trudge on.........

 

[truthseeker]

Here's the thing now - He seems really chilled out and happy over the last week which is good for him. Meanwhile, I'm working out budget plans, trying to get extra work sorted which means this week i'll be working 6.5 days, i'll have Sunday evening off.

And what is his attitude/response to this? Does he notice all the time you are working? I think you are mad. You are one person. Work a 5 day week and let him deal with the financial consequences as well.

He is acting like we haven't a care in the world. I must admit I am struggling to hold my temper at the moment and grateful that I have this extra work to keep me away from the house - it's just so frustrating. I have cancelled four very important things which I had planned over the next few months as I don't have the money now to go ahead and do them. I have also cancelled a course which I was due to take, I had put it off when he was unemployed before and had rearranged to start in March - can't afford this one now either.

And what does he say about all of this?

I do believe he may be depressed or something - it's the only thing I can think of to explain it -I mentioned to him that he might be depressed , he completely denied it - won't hear of seeing somebody & thinks I am completely off my head & he thinks I'm completely over reacting.

Sounds like he is swimming in a river in Egypt.

In his mind, he lost the job and he is telling everybody that he they had to let him go - last in first out (i'm going along with him when he tells people this, even though he has admitted to me that he knows he lost it over attitude/laziness etc) .

More evidence for swimming in a river in Egypt.

You may have to make some hard decisions, there is only so much a reasonable person can put up with. Plus, you will make yourself sick if you keep overworking.

 

[Knuttell]

To be perfectly blunt your husband is a lazy, self centred so and so,there is no two ways about this,you have enabled him in this behaviour and allowed him to to walk all over you,there are thousands who would give their right arm to have a job yet he treats those who offered a helping hand with contemptible ingratitude.

In every workforce up and down the Country there are individuals who swing the lead and leave others pick up the slack,these people are universally despised by their put upon colleagues.

I feel for you as you are running the show and getting no support whatsoever from this "man",you have two choices,continue as you are on a never ending ritual of being saddled up and doing the work of two until resentment turns to passive hatred or give him an ultimatum,either he shapes up or he ships out,to be honest knowing the type he may engage with the process for a while but will slip back into his old lazy useless ways pretty quickly.

Frankly if it were me,this individual would be long long gone.

 

[WaterWater]

In every workforce up and down the Country there are individuals who swing the lead and leave others pick up the slack,these people are universally despised by their put upon colleagues.

I knew a manager who tried to deal with a person like this and ended up have a bullying complaint made against him.

Bullwinkle. Just work your 5 day week. I am curious to know what were your four very important things that you had planned to do over the coming months. Did any of these things involve your husband.

 

[nai]

OP - maybe I missed it but I can't recall you stating what type of profession your husband worked at previously.

Can you outline what type of profession it was and also what type of skill set / interests your husband has ?

Perhaps the aam community may be able to suggest some direction.

Reason I ask is that I know a large number of people cross skilling into IT related courses under some of the social welfare schemes while also remaining in receipt of their dole. Difference is that they will be coming out of college in a year or two with Post grad diploma / Masters in a Computing related discipline. (i know a lot of them because I'm lecturing some part-time) These students backgrounds are very varied but their futures should be pretty assured given the severe shortage of IT skills in Ireland.

 

[bullwinkle]

Did any of these things involve your husband.

Yes 3 out of 4 did - basically family trips & things that had previously been put off because of his unemployment.

Truthseeker - this is the thing he is not reacting to any of it, he is hymming and hawing etc but not actually giving me any feedback on any of it. He IS being lazy git, people are right but at the same time I know there is an underlying unhappiness that he has to deal with. Truth is if we are not married I would be gone by now as realistically I am young enough to make a new life for myself but I do take the marriage seriously and cannot just up and leave. I have to give it my best shot and know that all routes were explored. It is going to take a lot of work on his side to make things right here, at the moment all I can do is deal with the practical things and see to it that we pay bills and eat.

I feel in hindsight that a lot of all of this is my fault - I have dealt with all the responsibilities throughout our lives, I have kept him wrapped up and away from the hassles and now he expects me to get us through this one as well. I need to make him stand on his own two feet.

 

[truthseeker]

Truth is if we are not married I would be gone by now as realistically I am young enough to make a new life for myself but I do take the marriage seriously and cannot just up and leave.

You could suggest you separate for a period of time while you have a think about things. He would be forced into standing on his own two feet then.

Whatever else happens, stop taking responsibility for everything right now, you are only enabling it still - stop working mad long weeks etc..

 

[bullwinkle]

He would be forced into standing on his own two feet then. .

Doubtful - he'd head back to live with Mammy who never wanted him to leave in the first place.

 

[Bronte]

To be perfectly blunt your husband is a lazy, self centred so and so,there is no two ways about this,you have enabled him in this behaviour and allowed him to to walk all over you,.

I fully agree with Knuttell. From what you've described so far your husband sounds like a 'bum' as Judge Judy would say.

You've posted some very very personal stuff on here. And we do not have his side of the story. There are times in every marriage when one is hopping mad, but you have to talk to each other and resolve it. And both agree.

You and your other half need conselling or you need to come to the realisation that you cannot change another person. And that there are two of you in it.

On financials

Why are you stretched so financially that even with two jobs it's hard to manage. Did you push for the house, the renovations etc (this is not necessarily a negative thing).

Your other half doesn't seem to give a damn about bills because you've completely taken control of that, so why would he worry or care?

You have drive and ambition, either you live with that and accept that he does not.

How many years was he unemployed and in what period while you supported him. Why was he unemployed.

Finally, maybe your marriage has ended and it requires the courage to face up to that. This I do not say lightly, but it certainly has to be said before the big mistake of having a child comes into it. You've not said one thing positive about your husband. Is there anything good about him, why did you marry him?

I don't expect you to answer these questions, there more for you to think about. What is it you see in him, what do you want and if it's not possible let it go.

 

[bullwinkle]

There's a lot there Bronte so i'll try to answer.

Re being stretched all ready - we bought a near derelict house and had to take on a loan just to get the basics done. About 2/3 years in, he lost his job (company went bust).

Re us - we have always been two very very different people but somehow that never mattered - I am a very independent person & I get things done, he is not independent - never really was but it was never a problem before because he went to work, contributed to the house/money etc & it all ran very well. This man now - is not the man I married!. The man I married was great fun, very kind, yes he was a bit of a spoiled brat at times but I didn't pay any heed to that! He still is that kind loving man but at the moment he is weighed down with something else?? I don't know - perhaps a combination of me doing everything for him and depression or something??

I love him, I really do (the problem is I don't have the same level of respect for him) and I feel awful having to post online about such personal issues but I guess I don't want to speak to friends about it. It's very tough at the moment, I feel as though I am being held back from life at the moment there are so many things I want to do but I have to help him over all of this. Two weeks ago when I first posted I think I was on the verge of walking away, now that the dust has settled I feel I need to give this one more go. In many ways I feel so sorry for him I think he is wasting a great life - the practical part of me though wants to kick him up the a**e as people have suggested. I may well have to accept that it's over - I don't know! I hope not I really really hope not!

 

[Bronte]

You're very contradictory in your description. So he was a good man, he worked hard, was happy, you both were happy but he lost his job 2 years ago. But then you say he was a spoiled brat.

Anyway I've immense sympathy for anyone who worked hard and lost a job they loved. Times are very tough and we have to be understanding of our partners. Good times and bad is what marriage is for. Not a marriage counsellor, but you must look at yourself too and see are your expectations too much for any man.

 

[44brendan]

Times are very tough and we have to be understanding of our partners. Good times and bad is what marriage is for. Not a marriage counsellor, but you must look at yourself too and see are your expectations too much for any man.

Full credit to you for putting up with this so far. We all have our problems, but we also have our limitations. Your expectation appears to be for this guy to get his act together and contribute to the household income. If he is unable to do so, that's one issue. However, he has blown a good opportunity to get back on his feet. I'm all for giving people a chance, but how far are you prepared to go with this. Send him back to Mammy and let her look after him for a while. Give yourself some space to re-think the relationship. Leave the door open for him, if he is prepared to get his act together. You are not his mother. If you want to take that role, then be prepared to accept the consequences.

 

[Hans]

I am trying to communicate - we always communicated well. But the problem is that he doesn't have a plan and if I say to him well what will we do, or what do you want to do? or do you have anything in mind that you'd like to train in.... he just shrugs his shoulders and says "don't know". So I can't help him until I know what he wants to do -otherwise it's just me nagging and nagging telling him what he should be doing and I don't want to do that! So.... I am waiting until he can tell me what he wants

I think you have hit the 'nail on the head' when you say you are trying to communicate, you really need to talk to a counselor I know some posters had bad things to say about counselors but that is silly it's like people having an opinion on a good doctor or hairdresser you shop around until you get one that suits you. You will be surprised at the help that you will get from one as they will facilitate the conversation between you and your husband and make sure you are asking the right questions and keeping to the point when you are talking about decisions a good counselor wont give you the answers but will guide you to find them together and also leave your relationship stronger after the process. Lay people here can give you advice about what to say and do but you are the only person that can do that. To save your relationship at this stage you need professional help not advice from lay people. It is a shame to let it crumble without getting help if you or your husband were physically sick you would not ask here for help but find a professional that could help you.

 

[bullwinkle]

You're very contradictory in your description. So he was a good man, he worked hard, was happy, you both were happy but he lost his job 2 years ago. But then you say he was a spoiled brat.

At times yes he was a spoiled brat - I knew that when I met him! it's hard not to be contradictory Bronte - there have been good times as well as bad times - i'm trying to give a summary of a relationship spanning 14 years so there are bound to be contradictions.

 

[dmos87]

My heart is breaking for you Bullwinkle, it sounds like you are clinging on by the fingernails. Please please, for your own wellbeing, do not work that much. You will put yourself in an early grave with a combination of the stress and workload. Marriage is a partnership, and as of right now you are without a partner.

You need to go home and have an honest chat with your husband. Tell him how you are feeling - and I mean how you are feeling about your marriage. Is he aware you were almost ready to walk away two weeks ago? Sometimes it takes a shock to the system to get people motivated again.

Lay it all out on the table, with no deadlines. Tell him to go to Mammy for a few days to think things through and get a clear head, and you do the same in the peace of your home that you are working so hard for.

No-one here is going to give you the answers. We are not counsellors, nor are we involved in your marriage. Go home to your husband and talk things through properly and tell him how alone you are feeling in it. Tell him how hurt and angry you are that he has not considered you in his decisions.

 

[truthseeker]

At times yes he was a spoiled brat - I knew that when I met him! it's hard not to be contradictory Bronte - there have been good times as well as bad times - i'm trying to give a summary of a relationship spanning 14 years so there are bound to be contradictions.

Did you ever face a difficult period in those 14 years where he wasnt working, or in a job he didnt like etc... or is this the first time that you have seen this side of him - by this side of him I mean the guy who dilly dallying about not engaging with no plan for the future?

On some of the other issues - did he really go straight from Mammy to you - he never lived independently? He had Mammy looking after him, then he had Bullwinkle looking after him?

On buying the house etc...who was the driving force, did he come to you saying 'Ive seen this great house that we could do up' etc.... Even though a couple may agree on plans there is often one person who drives it more. If you can look back at 14 years and it turns out you are more often the driver - then it may be that he just doesnt know how to get up and start driving (as it were).