Bitcoin blockchain technology isn't a subset of blockchain technology. It's an application of blockchain technology. Other cryptos use applications of the exact same technology.
I disagree and we won't be agreeing so I suggest you drop it. There are 605,000 results for 'bitcoin blockchain technology' - by all means take issue with all of them if you wish. As regards 'Bitcoin blockchain technology' being a 'subset' - (subset meaning ' a part of a larger group of related things), then Bitcoin blockchain technology is very much a part of an overarching group - that being blockchain technology. The bitcoin network is open source - so there are plenty of similar networks. However, there are others still that are quite different. Furthermore, there have been innovative solutions programmed and written for the Bitcoin network that make up that technology - some of which I listed in my last post.
The point was very specific to bitcoin, and its failure to meet its design purpose as a currency. You seem to want to confuse that point by bringing in other cryptos, current and future. Different point completely.
As per my previous post, new technology finds its use case. Bitcoin is forming that use case as a store of value, an uncorrelated asset which can act as a hedge against the conventional system - which this week printed off more monopoly money than the complete market capitalisation of cryptocurrency.
Now, as regards 'bringing in other cryptocurrencies' - I have done no such thing. Where have I mentioned other cryptocurrencies? Please point it out.
Come back to me when they're hitting 100,000tps with sub second end-to-end confirmation. 100% improvement on next to nothing is still next to nothing.
As it stands today, 100,000 TPS isn't needed. In fact, you are deliberately trying to mislead others by quoting that figure. The visa network processes 1,700 transactions per second and rarely exceeds that level. That's a long way off your 100,000 TPS.
Notwithstanding that, lightning network is expected to achieve somewhere in the region of 1,000,000 TPS.
As regards the improvements I mentioned, they're all going to play their part. To say otherwise is absurd.
The internet doesn't have such limitations built into its core, bandwidth limitations are not designed in.
Sense of humour much? So you'd have us believe that at the origins of the internet - ARPANET - in the late '60's, it just came out of a box from the get go and could scale? There were limitations at its core - not that this matters. The bottom line is that the technology couldn't deliver for most use cases until many years later. As I type this, I'm stuck in an area with limited bandwidth - and to say that internet infrastructure is not relevant is ridiculous. It's kind of intrinsic to service delivery.
After the nonsense in the original article posted, I won't be wasting my time reading anything else he has to say.
Well then please don't waste anyone's time then. It's little wonder you didn't understand the underlying context of this most recent discussion then, isn't it.
So considered means actually taking action, not just having considered something? Regardless, residents of the US and other relatively stable and what appear to be well run economies are buying bitcoin, but your logic suggests they're all mismanaged.
You just admitted above that you didn't and won't read what Carter wrote. You have little business then commenting on it - and less still to take issue with something you can't possibly understand the context of (despite it being explained to you) - having not read Carters blog post. You're now telling me what my own thoughts are - hillarious stuff.
That's hilarious! So I can use bitcoin to buy anything on Amazon, but in effect, what I'm doing is sending bitcoin to a 3rd party who will then connect with another party (Coinbase) and then pay it to Amazon via the conventional banking system. Now that is the future right there.
I'm not hear to impress the likes of you, Leo (but I won't have you mislead anyone else that happens upon this thread). I will tell you what is hilarious though - the willful ignorance that your comments betray.
I said that I can buy anything from Amazon with Bitcoin. That statement is true - and remains true despite your challenges. Aside from that, you seem to have the most basic of comprehension difficulties (or at best? feigned comprehension difficulties).
Here's the 40 seconds of video showing the seamless purchase of an item on Amazon using that browser extension. You're trying your hardest to contrive to make that seem complex when its not. This is a solution for people who possess Bitcoin - and want to spend it on goods and services. If they're within that eco-system, then how is it so complex or unreasonable to have this hooked up with a Coinbase account? According to your logic, it would be absurd if a debit card had to be linked up with a bank account.
Also, using that method I lose the valuable protections offered by credit or debit card providers
Yeah, and nothing in this life comes for free. 2.5% of the sale of any good or service has been tacked on to pay for credit card fees. Furthermore, 39% of consumers in the US reported card fraud last year. $24.5 Billion lost in card fraud in 2018. Merchants pay down 40% of that - which means that there's much more than 2.5% meshed in to product/service pricing to cover your precious cards and your 'protections'.
those protections will now just be limited to the transaction between myself and Moon.
They are a third party
payment processor. You are still buying direct from Amazon. You have all the protections that platform itself provides.
And even that is limited by the lack of regulation around crypto.
Do you have ANY notion about what you're going on about here? What regulation? They act as a third party
payments processor. Your purchase is still
direct with Amazon.
Can you share some links? Maybe my Google search skills need some tuning, but I was unable to find any. Focussing on the Netherlands, I did find hashop.nl who carry a lot of the Aeotec range, but alas not the bypass device. But you can't have meant them anyway as they only deliver to the Benelux countries and Germany, and despite advertising that they accept bitcoin, do not offer any means of using them in the checkout process.
I have no notion of doing so. You're well capable of using google yourself. If it was someone else, I certainly would - but it's apparent to me that you've lost objectivity on this discussion a long time ago. The info above on Amazon opens up 353 million products to you - including the Aeotec Bypass that you're looking for. If you had Bitcoin to make the purchase, then there's a strong chance you'd already have a Coinbase account. ...in which case it would take you 40 seconds to make that purchase - job done. You're all out of excuses dude.
Well my point is if I had bitcoin, I'd want to spend them on things. Most of the businesses here that advertise having bitcoin ATMs don't actually accept bitcoin payment themselves. If I wanted to use my bitcoin to pay for something there, I had assumed the ATMs they were operating would allow convert and withdraw Euro, but alas they don't.
What do you want to buy in Bitcoin off a Bitcoin ATM operator?
Once again, Euro is freely available to everyone as its part of the conventional system. You are just looking for an excuse to bash by complaining that a Bitcoin ATM won't spit euro out at you. The idea of Bitcoin ATM's is to expand the reach of Bitcoin - and make it available to a wider public.
ALL of the examples I provided by the way ( in the U.S. , South America and Ireland) have involved roll outs in the past 12 months. In the case of the former two, they've had news of further expansion plans in the last few weeks. Coinlogiq have just installed a Bitcoin ATM within 10 minutes walk of my apartment.
The point is that you've deemed this whole thing dead - when it hasn't even gotten started.
Why do we even need bitcoin ATMs to buy bitcoin? Is it a bit archaic that such advanced technology isn't all online? Or is the ability to repeatedly lodge cash a handy way to hide the proceeds of black market or worse activity?
Bitcoin ATMs are important as oftentimes they will provide people's first experience of Bitcoin. They will play a role in onboarding people into the ecosystem. There are online options. There are peer to peer options. They are all facets of an ever expanding ecosystem. KYC/AML is the other reason why ATMs are being rolled out. It causes friction - people don't want to have the hassle of submitting paperwork. This is the reason that Bitcoin ATM rollout has increased 500% since 2016 with 5,457 Bitcoin ATMs worldwide.
As regards your black market jibe, there's far more illicit activity carried out every day of the week in CASH than there ever was or will be with Bitcoin. Other than that, you seem to want to wash away the freedom people are provided with via Bitcoin.
As regards money laundering, you just need to get a banking license to do that - and move money in the billions. KYC/AML exists for lesser mortals as a financial surveillance mechanism and nothing more.
The argument on AML/KYC is also nonsense. You find it 'absurd', it doesn't prevent 100% of illegal activity. Speed limits and road traffic legislation don't prevent hundreds of deaths and thousands of injuries on our roads. By your logic we should also scrap all that.
Your analogy is completely wayward. AML/KYC is a mechanism of recent times. The world functioned just fine without it - and it will again. Speed limits and road traffic legislation have little if anything by way of a downside trade off. I don't have to give up my privacy for same. That's not the case with AML/KYC.
Other than that, you are trying to distort the stats I presented a couple of posts ago by suggesting that they don't 'prevent' 100% of illegal activity. The point is that the guys that are positioned to apply these regulations (the banks) are the ones that actively move billions of illicit money around at will and not one banking official has been imprisoned for that. If authorities want to go out and fight crime, then let them do it. However, they should not be allowed to trample over peoples financial privacy in doing so.
And no confusion on what came first, I'm just sensing the dip in the bitcoin hype cycle. Technology adoption rates have accelerated massively over recent years, Bitcoin is lagging at this point.
I'm not sure what you're going on about. There has been a hype cycle with virtually every promising technology. Right now, we have AI and Robotics, IoT, Blockchain, AR and 5G as the headline technologies. There's been hype surrounding all of them. AI has been knocking around for years - but only now is coming through.
It took the telephone decades to reach 50% of the population. It took credit cards 40 years to gain adoption. The internet was borne out of ARPANET in the late 60's - when was the first time anyone here used it? All through the market doldrums of 2018, I could see the hard work being put in away from the hype of Dec 2017 (and I posted here to that effect). I've also seen people give up their jobs in conventional financial services and move entirely into the crypto space. Even in the last few posts, I've mentioned aspects of bitcoin blockchain technology that have been developed very recently. LN capacity is growing at an exponential rate. To achieve what has been achieved in the space of 10 years from the starting point of the collaboration of a handful of cypherpunks on internet message boards - its truly phenomenal. That you can't see that is an issue for yourself to resolve.
Up until now I believe we were discussing the value, if any, of the Bitcoin CURRENCY rather than the underlying blockchain technology.
Do you want to point out to me the aspects of what I've written above that are not about or relevant to the Bitcoin blockchain network and Bitcoin Blockchain Technology? Please review and come back to me.
As regards 'Bitcoin currency' - there was no such limitation. On the thread as a whole, we have been discussing Bitcoin - full stop. The thread is titled 'Why Bitcoin has Value" - and value can come from a number of use cases whether that be store of value, cross border transfer of value, the purchase of goods and services, a hedge against the conventional system, etc.
The most recent exchanges stem from post #110 - where I linked and quoted form Nic Carters blog post. I'm not under any illusion as to the topic at hand. Perhaps you are - in which case, please have a read through.
I think lumping them together at this point in the debate is misleading and I can't help but think you are doing it to help justify your belief in Bitcoin
Eh, I have no earthly idea as to what you could possibly be referring to. By all means quote a section of what I've written to illustrate your point. I have not mentioned any other cryptocurrency here.
You are not using Bitcoin to buy anything on Amazon, you are first converting it to FIAT
This segue stemmed from my claim that anything can be bought from Amazon using Bitcoin. That statement remains completely true - and it is a complete lie to suggest otherwise.
The transaction and contract exists between me as a buyer and Amazon. The fact that someone can use a simple browser extension as a third party payment processor is no major encumbrance. As per the video linked to above, its childsplay to purchase using Bitcoin on the Amazon platform.
First I need to convert them to real money.
YOU don't need to do anything. The whole thing is automated. Secondly., what you actually mean is that the automatic conversion is carried out from sound money to unsound money.
What's the point of this?
Well, it's quite simple what the point is. You earn sound money (Bitcoin) or received sound money (Bitcoin) from someone. You want to spend it and this simple yet innovative plugin opens up a marketplace of some 353 million products to you. It means this nonsense from Leo that 'you can't buy anything with Bitcoin' is exactly that - nonsense.
What's more this is cutting edge stuff. They're using Lightning Network - transactions are instant and they've only just started. By next year, they expect to support every major e-comm platform. Ergo (despite the fact that you both hate the thought of it) there is little if anything left that you can't buy with Bitcoin. That Firefly is the 'point' of it.