Remote (SIM) control of central heating

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dub_nerd

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I've needed a way to control home heating remotely for a long time (for slow starting UFH) but haven't got round to it yet.

I was interested to see in Electric Ireland's latest e-mailing (Switched On #15) a system called "Climote" which does this job. Only thing is, the price seems nuts -- €299 including installation ("reduced from RRP of €399") and €40 odd per year for the "remote access fee".

Now I haven't even looked carefully yet, but it seems to me that I can easily get a single relay controller from the UK or Europe for half that money, and a PAYG SIM that just receives text inputs costs a tenner up front and zero for ongoing "remote access". Admittedly I'd have to do wiring myself, but we are talking about replacing a single switch -- hardly rocket science.

Has anyone else looked into this or other systems in more detail? Is there any reason for Electric Ireland's crazy price other than the usual -- gullible captive audience?
 
Thanks gipimann, but as the old saying goes ... "I wouldn't take it if it was free". :)
Well, 'cos it isn't free ... it's a €40/yr "remote access fee" which would actually be free on a PAYG SIM.
I'd probably use it no more than half a dozen timesa year ... it would stick in my craw to be paying more than a fiver to turn the heating on.
 
Hello,

Like dub_nerd, I also got the promotional email from Electric Ireland and was interested in learing a bit more, thought this was a good idea etc.

However, having given this a bit more thought, I found myself wondering why would I never want to use something like this regularly, when I've got a timer on my heating system and can just manually adjust my temp. setting from time to time ?

Unless I'm missing something serious in terms of the features this gizmo offers, then it's a load of rubbish for anyone who already has a decent timer on their system. Money spent putting in zone controls, might be a better investment ....
 
Yeah, I looked at the Climote recently too but ruled it out. Very expensive for what it is.

Do you have a home alarm system that is connected to the phone line/ SIM? Depending on the alarm, you may have the option of remotely turning on/off an output on the panel that could power a relay.

One problem with the SIM is, even though you can get them for a tenner, most require a regular top-up to keep them active.

From other posts, building your own solution from [broken link removed] components might be an option for you? There are a lot of X10 based solutions out there too.
 
this popped up as a facebook advert today. [broken link removed].

A very simple idea that could probably be adapted to switch on your heating.

Edit - it doesnt need a sim, it uses your wifi
 
I recently zoned a system for a client who wanted remote access.
We looked at Climote and turned it down as it has €36 per annum fee plus it can only remotely tell you the temperature from the built in sensor within the controller. Most people have their time clocks in the kitchen or utility. This would not be a good location for a thermostat as those rooms would not be a true average temperature for a zone.
The other restriction was they cannot communicate with an external 2nd stat or hot water cylinder stat, so you cannot control temperature remotely.
Luckily the client was extremely techie, so we opted for the Heatmiser system. The time clock is built into each stat. The hot water is built into one of them so only 2 required. They communicate remotely via wi-fi so no annual fees. A separate router is required if you wish to tie both stat together. An app is downloaded to operate via smart phone or it can be done on-line.
 
JohnJay said:
this popped up as a facebook advert today. [broken link removed].

A very simple idea that could probably be adapted to switch on your heating.

Edit - it doesnt need a sim, it uses your wifi
Click to expand...

Thanks JohnJay ... looks interesting. I believe they are launching a light switch version later this year, which could also be more appropriate for central heating switching. The existing switch gets some terrible reviews, unfortunately, to do with unreliability in staying connected to the WiFi.

If it worked, it would be perfect for me -- I have permanently on WiFi, and can use dyndns.org to enable port forwarding. So no SIM needed. It seems a bit nuts that there is only smartphone app support -- not even a PC application, let alone a website that you can do your switching from. I also make a habit of not trusting Belkin gear, but I am prepared to be persuaded.
 
dub_nerd said:
If it worked, it would be perfect for me -- I have permanently on WiFi, and can use dyndns.org to enable port forwarding. So no SIM needed.
Click to expand...
This definitely sounds interesting. Surely there is enough of a market out there for someone to base a heating control product on the basis of that device? Even better, if they could further develop the app - so that it could check real time external temperature (for example, if it linked in to accuweather or similar service), the app could offer a setting to switch heating on at a specified external temperature. It would just need to be set to check real time weather data every 5-10 minutes.

The above would most likely cost less than eur 100. I have gotten various quotes over the past 5 years for heating controls - ranging from €500-€1000 (after seai grant). I even got a quote from a company offering multi-zoning (by way of electronically controllable thermostatic radiator valves) for a whopping €2500!! No that's not a typo - the quote was €2500 - and that was for 12 radiators and would still need the use of a sim in the gsm module.
Some will say that we wouldnt be comparing like with like - but whilst taking actual temperatures internally will be a smidgen more accurate, there would be a massive difference in outlay. Furthermore, the other frustrating thing was that with conventional heating controls, to retrofit them often meant having unsightly qualplex cable runs (some of those who quoted said it couldn't be avoided).

<EDIT>Just after looking up the heatmiser system that Shane mentioned above - and I suppose it does all that is necessary.

@Shane007: Are the stats that work with this battery powered or mains? In my case, I don't have any stats right now - so would have to retrofit. It that meant not having to run cabling, it would be much better.
Have an analogue timer in utility - with 2 switches for selection of three zones i.e. both off but heating otherwise on = hot water only; 1 switch for downstairs; Other switch for upstairs.
Do you think this system could be used in my case? How difficult would it be to install? </EDIT>
 
The ones I installed were mains fed as they were wired to motorized valves & ultimately back to fire the boiler.
I would think they also do a wireless range with a receiver to be hard wired to the valves or the boiler.
It sounds like your system is already zoned so, generally it would not be a huge job to retrofit them to the valves. This will ensure proper boiler interlock.
By the sounds of it you do not have a motorized valve on the hw. This would be a must to really bring your running costs down. Only heat the hw when you need to.
 
serotoninsid said:
I even got a quote from a company offering multi-zoning (by way of electronically controllable thermostatic radiator valves) for a whopping €2500!! No that's not a typo - the quote was €2500 - and that was for 12 radiators
Click to expand...

That was probably the Honeywell wireless TRV Evohome System. I installed a few of them a couple of years ago & the material cost was of over €2,000. Nice system but a lot of batteries to replace in each TRV. By memory, there was 3 or 4 batteries in each, so that is 48 batteries to replace when they go!
The good thing is you can have just one radiator on if that is all you wish, say for at home doing some work in a home office, etc.
 
Shane007 said:
The ones I installed were mains fed as they were wired to motorized valves & ultimately back to fire the boiler.
I would think they also do a wireless range with a receiver to be hard wired to the valves or the boiler.
Click to expand...
Nobody can find the motorised valve for the zone downstairs. We think that the builders put it directly below the hot press behind a plasterboard wall!:mad:
I know that's a problem that I'm likely to run into at some stage - but I'm not going breaking in there until that arises. For the purposes of the heating controls, hopefully I could hook this up to the boiler itself.

I'll contact heatmiser in relation to that and wireless controls and see what they come back with.


Thanks for your posts on this - much appreciated.



Shane007 said:
That was probably the Honeywell wireless TRV Evohome System. I installed a few of them a couple of years ago & the material cost was of over €2,000. Nice system but a lot of batteries to replace in each TRV. By memory, there was 3 or 4 batteries in each, so that is 48 batteries to replace when they go!
The good thing is you can have just one radiator on if that is all you wish, say for at home doing some work in a home office, etc.
Click to expand...

Nice system for sure - but very hard to justify that level of expenditure.
 
I would certainly try to find the valve. I have come across a few like that over the years but the time you really do not want it to fail is the time it will. They are generally not that difficult to locate. I use thermal image cameras to follow heated pipes. Another tool is camera with flexible lens lead. Drill small hole in plasterboard & insert camera.

Heatmiser have a Dublin number that diverts you to their UK technical support, so you do not have to pay international call rates. 01 - 485 2893. You should find them very helpful. You can buy direct or through a local merchant.
 
Heatmiser - Steer well clear of them!

Shane007 said:
I would certainly try to find the valve. I have come across a few like that over the years but the time you really do not want it to fail is the time it will. They are generally not that difficult to locate. I use thermal image cameras to follow heated pipes. Another tool is camera with flexible lens lead. Drill small hole in plasterboard & insert camera.
Click to expand...
Point well made - and your not the first to make it to me. I've resigned to the fact that this will become an issue at some stage. However, I'm prepared to deal with it as it arises - not everyones approach - but that's the option that suits me best right now.

Shane007 said:
Heatmiser have a Dublin number that diverts you to their UK technical support, so you do not have to pay international call rates. 01 - 485 2893.
Click to expand...

Given that they wouldnt respond via email and were not prepared to contact me via the number I had provided, it would have been beneficial if they advised me of the irish number as opposed to the uk number!

Shane007 said:
You should find them very helpful. You can buy direct or through a local merchant.
Click to expand...

I don't doubt your experience with them but that wasn't mine yesterday morning!

Contacted Heatmiser yesterday via email with my query - explaining my setup and asking them to provide a list of the kit needed. Received a response saying to ring their UK number (I had provided mine - why they couldnt make the call is anyones guess). Called - then put on hold twice. He then started rattling off model numbers for the various bits of kit that would be needed. I was trying to write these out on a scrap of paper - and asked if he would email on the list.
i.e. ONLY a simple list of the items required (so as I wouldn't end up ordering the wrong kit). There was a long pause followed by..."um...yeah - you should take note of them now anyway". i.e. in other words, I wont bother taking the 2 minutes required to email that to you.
He then clarified that the 'stats would have to be wired to the mains. I told him that I needed wireless battery powered stats. At this point, he feigned hearing loss - pretending that there was a problem with the line - that he couldn't hear me....and ultimately hung up on me - the customer. No call back, no email.
When the ticket was closed, I received an automated email asking me to complete a satisfaction survey. I provided the account above.
No call back, no email.

Steer clear - and source elsewhere.

Additionally, their system works out quite expensive when all is said and done. In addition to the controller unit and 2 'stats, there's an extra piece of kit required if the system is to be accessed via web browser/app. Tot that all together and it's cost-prohibitive. I would say exactly how much but I'm unsure of the ruddy product model numbers!
 
I bought it.

I was away over Christmas and New Year. It enabled me to check the temperature on my app over wifi. I was able to adjust it when the temperature dropped I was able to adjust it when some family members used my house and I had the house cosy for their visit in my absence. And I was able to adjust it after their visit.

I just have one zone. (TRV's in upstairs bedrooms.)

I use it to turn on my heat just before I leave work (varying times).

Is it worth it? It gave me huge peace of mind while I was away.

Marion
 
Well, here we are, another winter and I still haven't gotten round to remote controlling the heating. I am now looking at these two basic SIM-controlled options:

http://texton.ie/

http://www.smscentralheating.co.uk/

My question, if anyone can help, is really about mobile SIMs. Which Irish providers, if any, can provide a PAYG mobile SIM with credit that never expires. A controller that works by text message with status responses might need less than a fiver credit per year, while the type that switches on in response to a phone call (which it doesn't answer) might use no credit at all. (I found this note from Tesco mobile which suggests that "credit from top-ups never expires" but it's not clear if it refers to an existing plan you can buy).

If there's no non-expiring SIM, what is the next cheapest option? Obviously anything that needs monthly top-ups would be completely useless for this application.
 
Quick reply so I don't forget. Check the diy forum over on boards recent thread on this if you haven't already.
 
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