Delays in rolling out vaccine

It should be said that all the questions we have regarding the vaccines are in general unanswerable to a level that would remove people's doubts.
These are vaccines that were/are being developed in record time and the data is essentially being generated in the real world and obviously collating all this takes time and understanding.
Overall I personally think it will work out but not in any time frame the scientific/political groups have set out as there are too many unknowns, add in the logistical challenges progress will not be what people feel it should be. (Thats not taking away from the UK and Israel in their rollouts)

Then there are the mutations(known)that apparently are causing some headaches to the producers in trying to work out if existing vaccines remain effective or will new vaccines have be made or will 2 jabs be enough?

I can't see us back to anything approaching normal this year, unless something radically changes for example the vaccines are proven to prevent transmission and they are robust enough to provide protection for variants and mutations.
 
We will never get everyone vaccinated and it should be remembered that the target it not to get everyone vaccinated.
The target is to get enough people vaccinated to keep the R number well under one when restrictions are lifted and society and the economy are opened up.
 
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Purple said:
We will never get everyone vaccinated and it should be remembered that the target it not to get everyone vaccinated.
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Ah yeah, shure we know that. “Everyone vaccinated” is ~80% of the population. Just like “full employment” is 4% unemployment.
 
EasilyAmused said:
Ah yeah, shure we know that. “Everyone vaccinated” is ~80% of the population. Just like “full employment” is 4% unemployment.
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Exactly, and remember the aim is to enable the full lifting of restrictions while keeping the R number under one.
 
When all the elderly and all the vulnerable are vaccinated I expect the business community and a large cohort of the public (and the elderly and the vulnerable?) will call for the lifting of restrictions regardless of the case numbers. And if there is an ongoing daily death count of zero they’ll have a very strong case.
 
EasilyAmused said:
I’m surprised their national rate isn’t higher. Didnt they pay above the going rate to secure extra vaccine? And also agree to share their vaccine statistics with the manufacturer as part of the contract?
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Over 22 % of the population was completely vaccinated (all necessary jabs administered). That is the highest percentage worldwide.
Ireland 1.36%.
The percentage who received at least one injection in Israel is higher and most likely they will finish the whole vaccination campaign by end of March
 
EasilyAmused said:
When all the elderly and all the vulnerable are vaccinated I expect the business community and a large cohort of the public (and the elderly and the vulnerable?) will call for the lifting of restrictions regardless of the case numbers. And if there is an ongoing daily death count of zero they’ll have a very strong case.
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Also the financial markets only have a certain amount of patience, when that is achieved or achieved by the leading countries in the vaccine rollout then everyone else could be faced with higher interest rate penalties when going looking to sell more bonds to keep paying for everything. Suspended animation of the economy can only last so long
 
joe sod said:
Also the financial markets only have a certain amount of patience, when that is achieved or achieved by the leading countries in the vaccine rollout then everyone else could be faced with higher interest rate penalties when going looking to sell more bonds to keep paying for everything. Suspended animation of the economy can only last so long
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Governments keep piling up debt to prop up their Covid-paralysed economies while the ECB keeps printing money to help finance it. Some of this money goes to necessary and worthy causes such as support for unemployed hospitality workers. Some of it is spent on classic "socialism for the rich" causes such as bailing out privately owned airlines. In the end, all this money printing and spending will lead to inflation, unless the basic principles of economics have permanently vanished somehow.
 
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tomdublin said:
Governments keep piling up astronomical debt to pour money into their Covid-paralysed economies while the ECB keeps printing money to finance it. Some of this money goes to necessary and worthy causes such as support for unemployed workers in the hospitality industry. Some of it is spent on classic "socialism for the rich" causes that are unjust and make no sense, such as bailing out privately owned airlines. In the end, all of this has to lead to inflation, unless the basic principles of economics are all permanently suspended somehow.
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When privately owned airlines or any other busineses are prevented from operating by Government policy decisions then there is no argument to be made against State support. Airlines are no differen
 
Gov decisions curbing travel were due to a pandemic which is an unintended act of nature just like bad weather or an ash cloud and an intrinsic business risk if you own an airline. Why should a tax payer on the average industrial wage pay to protect businesses against such risks?
 
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tomdublin said:
Gov decisions curbing travel were due to a pandemic which is an unintended act of nature just like bad weather or an ash cloud and an intrinsic business risk if you own an airline. Why should a tax payer on the average industrial wage pay to protect businesses against such risks?
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Why should a tax payer on the average industrial wage pay to protect any business? But if any business is prevented from operating in the name of public health, I have no issue with my tax being used to support them to make sure they are still there and employing people when this is over. Just like my tax money is spent supporting retail, hospitality, tourism businesses all over the country. And yet you seem to have an issue with airlines? Why? Because they are big?

Ireland is a Island. Air links are absolutely crucial to economic performance. The idea that IAG can move aircraft from Aer Lingus Irish Market to other markets as they are already doing or other parts of the group and we should just go 'who cares' is economic idiocy. The idea that Ryanair if they pull aircraft out of Ireland will ever return without significant incentives is delusional. There is a reason why Germany, France, Netherlands, Norway, Italy and numerous other countries have poured billions into airline support since this pandemic started. Same with the US. They know that there is no economic recovery without airlines. Next the argument will be that other airlines will fill the slots if an airline like Aer Lingus go under. No they won't. Global aviation is on its knees. If we don't protect what we have in Ireland, then we can forget about it.

Aer Lingus employees are currently on 60% pay. Many of them earning less than what people are getting on PUP. Do these people not deserve the same chance as hotel or shop employees whose employers are getting support to see their jobs survive this pandemic . No airline in Ireland has asked for support yet. Ryanair took support off the UK government. If Aer Lingus come looking for support, I have no issue with it being given to them considering the support already given to European airlines.
 
Sunny said:
The idea that Ryanair if they pull aircraft out of Ireland will ever return without significant incentives is delusional
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Why? If there is demand for air travel someone will supply it and will employ the people needed to supply it. Lots of airlines have gone bust over the past two decades and there has never been a supply shortage as a result (quite the opposite). Government support should concentrate on workers thrown out of work by the pandemic, not on businesses and their (generally) wealthy owners.
 
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tomdublin said:
Why? If there is demand for air travel someone will supply it and will employ the people needed to supply it. Lots of airlines have gone bust over the past two decades and there has never been a supply shortage as a result (quite the opposite). Government support should concentrate on workers thrown out of work by the pandemic, not on businesses and their (generally) wealthy owners.
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So airline workers should suffer?? Why are they different to other workers. Because you think airlines are greedy? There has never been an event like this for aviation. Every single airline in every single country is suffering. And you think they will be a position to serve Ireland? Even 9/11 which decimated air travel is nothing compared this. If Governments stop shops/hotels or any other business from operating because of public health, they deserve support to help them survive and give them at least a chance to be there when this is over. The size of the business is not relevant. This pandemic could drive an airline with a couple of billion of free cash out of business just as easily as it could a hotel if it goes on long enough.

You seem to be arguing that we should be spending all ourmoney on unemployment benefits for workers instead of trying to make sure businesses that employ them actually survive. Because employers are greedy or wealthy???

Anyway, completely off topic.
 
No, it should in principle apply to all businesses, subject to pragmatic exceptions where it's genuinely in the public interest to keep a given business afloat. Anything beyond that is just a redistribution of wealth from average citizens to wealthy vested interests no matter how it's being dessed up.
 
It’s my understanding that vaccination centres have been set up in Dublin, Cork, Galway and Limerick but I can’t find any confirmation of this.
Are these centres actually set up and if so where can we find location details?
 
Eureka101 said:
It’s my understanding that vaccination centres have been set up in Dublin, Cork, Galway and Limerick but I can’t find any confirmation of this.
Are these centres actually set up and if so where can we find location details?
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Like everything else I think they are talking about "what they are going to be doing"...
 
Leo said:
If you extend that argument out, why should someone earning €200kpa pay so much tax to subsidise those on the average industrial wage?
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Because where there is economic redistribution it should happen from the rich(er) to the poor(er), not the other way around.
 
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Vaccination roll out is a shambles IMO. Now the AZ vaccine of which a supply of 21000 doses having arrived to much fanfare by the minister is probably of no use against the SA variant. It must be tweaked and Autumn is said to be the expected date of arrival. We have children being deprived of their education despite them not being responsible for the surge over xmas. Most days I checked the stats there were zero covid positive children in paediatric hospitals. Therefore children dont get ill with covid. Best to admit closing schools was a bad decision totally OTT. So much elective healthcare has postponed indefinitely when it should have gone ahead plus many people delaying attending hospitals because of fear. Vaccination is not the way out of this. The virus mutated too rapidly and by autumn you can bet there will be other variants out there. A good treatment repurposed or new is what's required IMO. The swedish approach to developing some level of herd immunity might not be such a bad approach after all. We cant live like this economically or socially much longer. A zero covid approach is utter fantasy in my view. We cannot hermetically seal our borders. Wouldn't work.
 
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