Why there is so little house building in Ireland

[ashambles]

This actually gets better, we have Mary Lou wading in with this:

Proposed co-living scheme is just a 'glamourised form of tenement living' - McDonald

A proposed “co-living scheme,” comprising a room the size of a parking space and kitchen area shared by 42 people, has been condemned during a Dáil debate.

www.independent.ie

Proposed co-living schemes is just 'a glamourised form of tenement living. '

That also gave me the giggles. And I do wonder what she said at the time they got rid of the bedsits.

- a room the size of a parking space
- kitchen area shared by 42 people,
- a proposed monthly rent of €1,300 was utterly unacceptable.

The room is 16 sq meters. That's fine for a bedroom.

Typical bedrooms in an Irish 3-bed semi might be 12M 14M and 7M. It's usually better to compare like to like, rooms to rooms, not rooms to handicapped parking spaces.

People pretending to be outraged about the co-living should also be moaning about 3-bed semis. Since every bedroom in that 3-bed semi is usually smaller than a handicapped parking space, and in fact smaller than many things that are not rooms.

For elderly people co-living can be great, for young workers also great. People who want to co-live do so, and in doing so free up other types of housing for people who don't want to co-live.

The people in this country who to rail against any type of new (to Ireland - not places like the Netherlands or Sweden) idea and then complain about why nothing changes would lead you to despair.

 

[Ceist Beag]

I see no issue with the provision of this type of accommodation. However rent of €1300 for something like this is outrageous and should not be allowed imho.

 

[WolfeTone]

This is an example from Berlin
Live Berlin
Ive no issue with it if people want to live it. But its probably most suited to temporary working immigrants who are not set on settling in Ireland or starting a family.
Basically an upmarket hostel.

 

[Bronte]

Part V

This is the social housing requirement. Here an Irish Reit to comply with this will be selling 10% of their development in Sandymount to Dublin council. A three bed will cost you, the taxpayer nearly 800,000.

Could anyone on AAM tell me is this a ‘normal’ Price for a 3 bed in that area or nearby. Seems extraordinary to me.

Ires Reit makes €21.13m social housing proposal to council

Landlord offers to sell 43 Sandyford units to Dún Laoghaire-Rathdown County Council

www.irishtimes.com

Is this 21 million taxpayer cost justified. Would purchasing on the normal market be cheaper. Are these prices the same price it costs the Reit to build, which doesn’t make sense to me.

Seems to me, and I may be wrong, that the money is to be made by selling to the council and that money gets ploughed into the build cost.

 

[Bronte]

This is an example from Berlin
Live Berlin
Ive no issue with it if people want to live it. But its probably most suited to temporary working immigrants who are not set on settling in Ireland or starting a family.
Basically an upmarket hostel.

That’s doesn’t look like no upmarket hostel I’ve ever been in. It mentions students. Where does it mention shared kitchens by 42 units?

 

[NoRegretsCoyote]

I see no issue with the provision of this type of accommodation. However rent of €1300 for something like this is outrageous and should not be allowed imho.

Why is it outrageous if there is someone willing to supply and someone willing to pay?

 

[Ceist Beag]

I doubt anyone is willing to pay that amount! Some people may feel they have no option if nothing else is available but let's be honest, that is an extortionate amount of money for something as humble as this and just smacks of pure greed.

 

[NoRegretsCoyote]

I doubt anyone is willing to pay that amount! Some people may feel they have no option if nothing else is available but let's be honest, that is an extortionate amount of money for something as humble as this and just smacks of pure greed.

Well if they weren't willing to pay they wouldn't pay it. That's what willingness to pay means!

This is designed for someone who needs something more permanent than a hotel room but more flexible than a one-bed apartment.

It is appreciably cheaper than either.

 

[Ceist Beag]

I guess we will never agree on this one but I think you are wrong to not see the difference between willingness to pay and simply being forced to pay due to lack of alternatives. Maybe you missed the fact there is a housing crisis at the moment. Maybe you don't think charging 42 * €1300 per month is gouging but I most certainly do think it is.

 

[Bronte]

SANDYFORD - D 18

So I decided to figure out where this is. It's south of the city and seems to have Foxrock (upmaket) and Shankill (not so nice) in it. I've no real clue though. Anyway you can buy the following :

3 bed semi 530K
2 bed apartment 295K
4 bed semi 495K
2 bed apartment 375
1 bed 235K
4 bed semi 550K
2 bed apartment 310K
3 bed semi 470K

Now if I compare the above with the Reit's prices to the council, bearing in mind these are all only apartment:


Ires Reit’s proposal shows that value of one-bed apartments ranges from €279,627 to €292,633, two-beds from €487,722 to €637,290, and three-beds ranging from €598,272 to €780,355.

 

[Firefly]

SANDYFORD - D 18

So I decided to figure out where this is. It's south of the city and seems to have Foxrock (upmaket) and Shankill (not so nice) in it. I've no real clue though. Anyway you can buy the following :

3 bed semi 530K
2 bed apartment 295K
4 bed semi 495K
2 bed apartment 375
1 bed 235K
4 bed semi 550K
2 bed apartment 310K
3 bed semi 470K

Now if I compare the above with the Reit's prices to the council, bearing in mind these are all only apartment:


Ires Reit’s proposal shows that value of one-bed apartments ranges from €279,627 to €292,633, two-beds from €487,722 to €637,290, and three-beds ranging from €598,272 to €780,355.

You would actually expect someone buying a tranche of properties to get a reduction.
Looks like another example of the government spending more of taxpayer's money than necessary.

 

[Bronte]

You would actually expect someone buying a tranche of properties to get a reduction.
Looks like another example of the government spending more of taxpayer's money than necessary.

What I'd love to know is how much that developement is costing the Reit to build, all costs, including the site cost.

 

[RedOnion]

What I'd love to know is how much that developement is costing the Reit to build, all costs, including the site cost.

There's quite a lot detailed in their planning application.

Note, the newspaper just picked 1 of their 3 proposals (assuming it was because of the better headline).

Option 2 was to provide apartments in another development, already built. If social housing was critical, these are available earlier.

Option 3 was to build another apartment block, to agreed designs, a short distance away. This is similar to what's happening in Cherrywood.

A policy decision is needed - do councils want to spend money in high end developments, so that social housing is integrated with non-social housing or get more space for less money in different developments.

 

[Purple]

There's quite a lot detailed in their planning application.

Note, the newspaper just picked 1 of their 3 proposals (assuming it was because of the better headline).

Option 2 was to provide apartments in another development, already built. If social housing was critical, these are available earlier.

Option 3 was to build another apartment block, to agreed designs, a short distance away. This is similar to what's happening in Cherrywood.

A policy decision is needed - do councils want to spend money in high end developments, so that social housing is integrated with non-social housing or get more space for less money in different developments.

There should be a complete ban on any State body or State funded body buying existing housing stock to provide social housing. All they are doing is increasing housing costs for private purchasers without increasing the housing stock.

 

[Purple]

I heard a Lecturer from the school of Architecture in Bolton St. talking about the National Children's Hospital on NewsTalk this morning. She said that productivity in the construction sector has not improved at all in the last 20 years.
To put that into context in anther manufacturing sector where I work (precision machining), productivity had more than tripled in the last 20 years. That's why we can pay everyone more than twice as much but make parts 20% cheaper than we did 20 years ago.