why is it so hard here for people to do the decent thing??

I remember driving from Portadown to Derry a few years ago, and driving through towns and villages on the way,it was an eye-opener to observe the Union Jack-festooned villages being immaculate, and the Tricoloured villages being dumps-It speaks volumes for the Irish mentality...

daithi
 
Er..what?!

If you are saying what I think you are saying, believe me, I've seen plenty of immaculate, snotty republican villages and loads of shabby, lawless loyalist villages too - as weli as vice versa.
 
I think it's all our fault, modern generation, myself included :(. As posted, we generally don't really care what our politicians do, once they look after the town/area they represent. Local politics and all that. These days, we just moan and complain but never really do anything. I was so proud of my mum :cool:, over 70 and outside the dail with thousands of her fellow pensioners protesting about the proposed changes to the medical card scheme back in 2008...Think we've really let them down to be honest
 
notagardener said:
I was so proud of my mum :cool:, over 70 and outside the dail with thousands of her fellow pensioners protesting about the proposed changes to the medical card scheme back in 2008...Think we've really let them down to be honest
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Was that the one where the pensioners on €1400 a week wouldn't pay twenty quid VHI?
 
Fair play to her, but I know a few pensioners who are incredibly wealthy and could probably do without the massive pension, free medical card, free electricity, free phone calls etc that they are given by default. And they admit this themselves.
 
RMCF said:
Fair play to her, but I know a few pensioners who are incredibly wealthy and could probably do without the massive pension, free medical card, free electricity, free phone calls etc that they are given by default. And they admit this themselves.
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If they are incredibly wealthy, then they are paying significant amount of tax. You don't need to cut universal services to catch the few 'incredibly wealthy' - just tax them.
 
Complainer said:
If they are incredibly wealthy, then they are paying significant amount of tax. You don't need to cut universal services to catch the few 'incredibly wealthy' - just tax them.
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So employ civil servants to collect the taxes and then employ more to give them back. Sounds like good sound socialist logic to me alright ... jobs for the boys (and girls) eh?
 
Black Sheep said:
Not sure what your point is Purple. Pensioners pay tax at the same rates as everybody else.
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My point is that in many areas we have social welfare payments that are universal (non means tested). For higher earners that involves the state taking their money, paying a clerk to process it and then giving back what’s left. Why not just take less money in taxes and don’t give out universal welfare payments.
Children’s allowance is a better example of the same thing since it isn’t taxable. Get rid of it and introduce a refundable tax credit instead.
 
I wonder if Judge Judy would come over here and shout at our politicians about what is right and what is wrong.
She puts it fairly bluntly.

Are we heading for a rebellion? Do our politicians really represent us - they say we get what we deserve. Every day there is another revelation about irregularities.

I recently requested to rent a house for 2 weeks from a German couple, while they are on holidays. I was surprised when they said 'it would mess up their tax'. They dont pay an accountant every year and paying to have the extra money added in would be too messy?

Browtal
 
Complainer said:
If they are incredibly wealthy, then they are paying significant amount of tax. You don't need to cut universal services to catch the few 'incredibly wealthy' - just tax them.
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Complainer,

I know of pensioners on 700-1000pw gross who pay 2-5% tax.

Some are under 65, and get medical card, free travel, free VEC courses.

They pay zero income levy and zero health levy.

They are not "vulnerable", as the media suggests many of them are.

They can't believe how generous the State is.

They feel the Govt is too soft.
 
Protocol said:
Complainer,

I know of pensioners on 700-1000pw gross who pay 2-5% tax.

Some are under 65, and get medical card, free travel, free VEC courses.

They pay zero income levy and zero health levy.

They are not "vulnerable", as the media suggests many of them are.

They can't believe how generous the State is.

They feel the Govt is too soft.
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Protocol said:
No, you pay less tax if over 65.

This is due to the Age tax credit, and also much higher tax exemption limits.
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Just to be clear, I'm suggesting that our current situation is perfect. I wasn't aware of the higher tax exemption limits for older people, and I've no idea what the rationale for these is. I was out for a family dinner on Sunday, and noticed how the restaurant that was full to the brim with young families and kids two years ago is now half-empty, and most of the customers there were over 55. Draw what conclusion you like from that. However, let's keep it in context.

I know many entrapreneurs and investors who can't believe how generous the State is, giving them patent royalties tax free (for not very innovative patents). very low corporation tax and allowing them to shelter income by renting their own properties to their businesses. They feel the Govt is too soft.

So perhaps lots of changes are required to our tax system. But my main point was that tax system is the best vehicle for addressing anomolies. If there are lots of older people with considerable income, then they should be paying considerable tax. The cost of introducing a means-test system for the medical card would be considerable. All the infrastructure is already in place to collect this tax. The cost of adjusting tax rates and allowances would be neglible, and there may even be cost savings if the current systems can be simplified.
 
Complainer, I agree with you.

A single person over 65 has a tax exemption limit of 20k, married couple = 40k.

Note: only one spouse must be >65.

So a married couple can earn 750pw free of tax, if one of them is over 65.

Take a typical retired teacher / guard / higher civil servant / bank official or manager, who retired on 70k (one-earner couple).

Their pension is 700pw, tax free. They will also both get medical cards, even if one spouse is aged 25 (unlikely, I agree). They also both get free travel, as a spouse under 65 is classed as a "companion". Plus, once they get the medical card, they no longer pay the income levy or the health levy (I'm nearly 100% sure of this).

Great country, where else would you get it??!!
 
Protocol, are you saying that a retired person with a pension of say 50K will pay less tax than someone currently working on 50K?
 
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