Gordon Gekko
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“Person who opened an account using a fake name now struggling to withdraw cash using his real name”I think it is both inappropriate and incorrect to describe what the OP's father did as ‘fraud’ or that he acted ‘fraudulently’. He opened the account with a different name than the one on his birth cert. But based on what we are told he did not act with deception to obtain an unlawful gain, or wasn’t money-laundering. So it does not appear to be a fraudulent act.
Opening accounts in names other than that on your birth cert was a fairly common practice in the past, for example many with first names of Immaculata or Concepta etc. preferred to use their second name of Mary or Joan, etc. in official documentation. It is unfortunate your father used a totally different name but as has been suggested elsewhere you really need to look at the terms and conditions at the time the account was opened.
I don’t see how the bank can walk away from this. They allowed your father to open and operate the account. It’s your father’s money. He doesn't appear to have acted fraudulently. It is for the bank to tell you what you must do to obtain the money, not for you to suggest solutions.. You could also look at the Central Bank’s Consumer Protection Code 2012. Consumer Protection Code 2012 - published 2015 (centralbank.ie), to see / ensure their response to you in handling your complaint is compliant with the code. [I recently has to deal with an institution on behalf of an elderly relative. We kept hammering them on ‘you tell us what we must do’. They did and the issue was sorted out.]
care of the branch. They asked him for nothing basicallyIt was impossible to open an account back in the day without an address. The EBS internal forms require an address. What is the address on the book?
Severe depression and paranoia. He was on a host of medication (some of which is now discontiuned due to the impact it had on the patient)sWhere there are mental health issues, it has not been unknown for people to open bank accounts in different names.
there's often a paranoid delusion that "they" are going to steal money & the false name is a way to hide it.
the adopted name usually has some relation to the persons own name, it might be a grandparent or 'as gaeilge', a middle name etc.
“Person who opened an account using a fake name now struggling to withdraw cash using his real name”
Are you actually kidding me. Do you have any understanding of mental health - as you obvously do not. The reason nothing was done if you bothered readng the thread is because (1) the family did not know about it until this year after our father had a stroke and was unable to afford to sort out the electrics in his house as he didnt have the money. We then needed to start digging why was this was and (2) The man was on 4 different types of medication for the last 50 years. Some years he probably didnt know what he was doing as he was on a cocktail of antidepressants - many of which have now been discontinued as a result of the severe side effect that it was discovered that they had“Person who opened an account using a fake name now struggling to withdraw cash using his real name”
I’m no fan of the banks, but honest to God, at what point do customers and/or their families admit personal responsibility?
Why was nothing done in the interim?
Is this not hurtful to the OP? Also it's incorrect. It wasn't a fake as in spurious name, or using the the name of a real person with the intention of deception. It was a different name than the name on the father's birth cert. So what? Say he had opened it in the Irish version of his name, would this problem exist?“Person who opened an account using a fake name now struggling to withdraw cash using his real name”
. What im complianing about is the fact that the bank is not working with us to resolve this complex matter - they are saying that basically they are keeping the money (or NTMA when it goes dormant)
The bank came back though and basically said that they cant help us as we cannot provide any ID for the name on the account (it went to their legal and vulnerable team).
Is this not hurtful to the OP? Also it's incorrect.
A final response letter - that is solid advice. I will ask them for that when I am talkin to them again. Thanks!It is odd that the bank can't provide a solution. For example, telling you or your father that he must get an affidavit or a guarantee or something like that. But I can fully understand that the bank is vulnerable. They hand out the money and then John Doe shows up looking for the money.
I doubt that this situation is covered in the Handbook.
The former staff who knew your dad should be able to help confirm that it is he. However, they might not want to get involved as the banks got savaged for opening non-resident accounts when the authorities knew that they were doing it, but turned a blind eye.
I would suggest that you ask the bank for a Final Response Letter which allows you to take it to the Ombudsman. That often wakes up a senior person who might look for a solution.
You could also contact the Dormant Accounts section of the Central Bank and ask them for guidance on the matter.
Dormant Accounts | Central Bank of Ireland
The purpose of the Dormant Accounts Act 2001 is to reunite account holders with their dormant funds held in banks, building societies and An Post. A dormant account is an account that has shown no activity for 15 years.www.centralbank.ie
Yeah and i get that from the banks perspective. Its more about the working with us with whatever they will take. Thats a good idea regarding the bankers Federation though. Ill get on to them aswellI'm sure the OP's father was not the first and only person in Ireland to open an account with false names etc back in the 80's, That's why we had things called Tax amnesties back in the day, to try and bring this money back "into the fold". It was a different world
All very easy for people to shout fraud on this occassion but given the fathers mental state then and physical state now, it's unlikely this will ever come to a trial.
Firstly, EBS cannot simply hand over the money. This is not a case of someone changing name via a deed poll for example, and indeed, it's not even the account holder who is attempting to recover the funds, rather a relative. Hence they have an account in name x and name y is trying to claim that name x is really name z (if that makes sense).
It could be worth contacting the Bankers Payment Federation for advice.
Assuming the last transaction was in 2011, it will go dormant in 2026.
It's quite possible there is a tax liability here as well, or at best, a risk of a tax audit. Assuming the funds were legit, if's included in Probate when the time comes (and hopefully that's a long way away), it could delay and complicate probate.
How did he get statements without giving them an address to send them to?
What address is on the statements ? Is it C/O EBS ?He picked them up in the branch. He was in there regularly. But all Hothe staff he used to be there are retired
Put that one in writing, not a phone call.A final response letter - that is solid advice. I will ask them for that when I am talkin to them again. Thanks!
No, I’m not kidding.Are you actually kidding me. Do you have any understanding of mental health - as you obvously do not. The reason nothing was done if you bothered readng the thread is because (1) the family did not know about it until this year after our father had a stroke and was unable to afford to sort out the electrics in his house as he didnt have the money. We then needed to start digging why was this was and (2) The man was on 4 different types of medication for the last 50 years. Some years he probably didnt know what he was doing as he was on a cocktail of antidepressants - many of which have now been discontinued as a result of the severe side effect that it was discovered that they had
So my friend - if you have nothing constructive to add to the conversation other then changing the name of the thread, try to be a little more tolerant and less of a keyboard warrior
It was not the OP's father's name. It was not someone else's name. It was therefore a fake name. But this is moot.It was a different name than the name on the father's birth cert.
I agree. It is highly unlikely anyone would be interested in prosecuting this, and it's not even clear there was a trial.All very easy for people to shout fraud on this occassion but given the fathers mental state then and physical state now, it's unlikely this will ever come to a trial.
No, I’m not kidding.
During these last 40 years, did anyone in your family, your father included, raise an eyebrow when they saw that his bank account is in the name of ‘Billy Bunter’ rather than his real name?
It’s a sad state of affairs, but it’s not EBS’s fault, it’s your family’s.
My sense is that there’s very little you can do; maybe get Conor Pope on the case or even better ‘talk to Joe’? This is exactly the type of nonsene case where Joe Duffy and the lunatics who listen to him might metaphorically storm the EBS and get your father back his money on the basis of the ‘grave injustice’ that’s taking place, nevermind the fact that ‘we bailed out the banks’ and that ‘the banks wrecked the country’.
No, I’m not kidding.
During these last 40 years, did anyone in your family, your father included, raise an eyebrow when they saw that his bank account is in the name of ‘Billy Bunter’ rather than his real name?
It’s a sad state of affairs, but it’s not EBS’s fault, it’s your family’s.
My sense is that there’s very little you can do; maybe get Conor Pope on the case or even better ‘talk to Joe’? This is exactly the type of nonsene case where Joe Duffy and the lunatics who listen to him might metaphorically storm the EBS and get your father back his money on the basis of the ‘grave injustice’ that’s taking place, nevermind the fact that ‘we bailed out the banks’ and that ‘the banks wrecked the country’.
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