UN Hearings - Salisbury nerve agent attack

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TheBigShort said:
The one about "walking like a duck"? Have you not set that as your bar for presuming guilt?



Wow! That is totally damning.

A few points.

First, it is not my beloved Russia, I have no affiliation with that country.
Second, I do not know who was behind the attacks in Salisbury.
Third, I am sceptical of the claims being made by the UK simply because of the manner this saga is being played out in the media and UK government.


So, I am asking you, how many Russian diplomats have the Netherlands expelled since the Salisbury attack?

I have it at two. They were expelled by the Netherlands ‘in solidarity with UK’ back in Mar 26/27 2018.


Your report, that walks like a duck apparently states, “The Dutch government expelled two alleged Russian spies this year…. it has emerged”. No date provided as to when they were expelled but if the newspapers you read is in the business of providing current news, then when they say “it has emerged” then they must mean an additional two diplomats were expelled as was reported publicly in Mar 26/27?


Here is what Dutch news is saying today, it is broadly similar but with some notable exceptions

“European intelligence services, including the Dutch military intelligence and security service MIVD, detained two Russian spies”

“The incident in The Hague was not made public at the time. However, prime minister Mark Rutte said on March 26 in a reaction to the Salisbury attack, that the government had decided to expell ‘two Russian intelligence agents working at the Russian embassy’.

This is interesting, because again the time of this ‘incident’ is again, not revealed.
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I give up. I do. Goodnight.
 
Firefly said:
I give up. I do. Goodnight.
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:D I know im like a dog with a bone.

But the reason I posted this thread back in April is because it appeared obvious, to me anyway, that the Salisbury incident was being used to push political agendas elsewhere, namely Syria and Ukraine.

I wouldn't put it past Russia to do something like this, but it is the manner in which the UK shot first, asked questions later which stands out.
The media reporting on this is all over the place, including your link to the guardian article which, quite frankly, is embarrassing.

Nevertheless, for the passive follower a juicy headline, lots of official sounding rhetoric, linking a visit to Switzerland to an incident at a Swiss laboratory in the Netherlands (by different people:oops:) helps to paint a picture of guilt in the court of public opinion.

But for anyone really interested in this incident and the wider geo-political sphere, then its obvious that we are far from the truth in this whole saga.
 
TheBigShort said:
Yes, especially when its hard for some folk to pick up on simple things like snow or no snow.
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Sigh. It really is tiresome. Two random Russian tourists decide they want to visit the tourist Mecca of Salisbury to see the cathedral and Stonehenge. Basically because the Salisbury journal has reported the success of the Salisbury tourist body to attract Russian tourists. It’s a great coup. Anyway, these two guys decide to visit for a few days. Now they work in health and fitness but can’t really discuss it much further. Can’t even give the name of one European company that they have dealt with despite numerous European business trips. That’s ok though. You are entitled to your privacy.

Anyway these two guys are so organized that they go hey we might want to stay another night so let’s book flights on desperate days to cover us. Just normal tourist behavior I suppose.

So these two guys get to london and decide to visit Salisbury on the 3rd March. But guess what. It’s snowing and Stonehenge is closed. But they can still walk around and see the cathedral. So these poor Russians who are used to more tropical climate decide to walk around for a hour but their feet are getting wet and it’s cold so they decide to go for a cup of coffee before returning to london and their hotel over 100 miles away. Again normal tourist behavior. So no problem.

So the next day, the two poor cold Russians decide to try it again. It’s salisbury for gods sake. Can’t go back to Moscow and say they spent all their time in london and didn’t see the world famous Salisbury cathedal. They would be laughed out Russia. So they hop on the train again because its sunny in london. Great news is that we know Stonehenge was open because the Salisbury journal has told us. We know they could walk around easily because of cctv of them walking around with clear footpaths and roads. So all good then!

So you brave Russian tourists arrive in Salisbury where they come out of the train station and move in the opposite direction of the cathedal which can be seen from the train station. This is where the poor guys luck begins to run out. The direction they head in and where they are spotted just happens to be near where a Russian traitor and his daughter just happen to live. Of all the gin joints in all the world, what are the chances. Anyway no problem. These things happen.

But you are not going to believe this but on this particular day when these brave travelling Russians decide to visit a provincial city in the UK, there is sort of attack on the Russian traitor. Now you just know it’s not your day don’t you....

So anyway our two Russians who are more used to tropical climates can’t believe it but there is sleet on the ground and so instead of visiting Stonehenge like they planned and was open, they decide to back to london.

At this stage, they are just getting grumpy. They arrived to see all these beautiful things and all they are getting is wet toes. They are missing the warmt of Moscow and the sunshine. So our two Russian decide to go straight to the airport to board a flight to Moscow without any luggage.

And now they are being accused of all these dastardly things. All because they wanted to see a beautiful cathedral....I don’t know about anyone else but I think these two deserve an apology from the UK government and a free holiday to Salisbury.

And the good news is thanks to the big short and his analysis of the twitter feed from the Salisbury journal about snow, he has been able to poke holes in the UK’s cunning plan and lies. I can imagine Therese May sitting there saying ‘I would have got away with it if it wasn’t for you pesky kids’..........
 
Ch4 news reporting they had sequential passport numbers and shared a room while in the UK.
Russian un-intelligence!
 
Sunny said:
I feel bad for writing that now. I didn’t know I would be disagreeing with Craig Murray. Like the actual Craig Murray!!!! Well I feel pretty stupid now.
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Whats to disagree with? He is merely asking some obvious questions and then pointing to the mob mentality of trying to dismiss those questions before they are answered.

Your post above is excellent, very convincing, if it weren't for the inaccuracies, inconsistencies, presumptions and assumptions.

I suppose that is point im making. I don't know who carried out this attack. I dont know if it was these two individuals, whether Russian state was involved or not, whether Putin sanctioned it or not.

You seem to think its pretty clear cut despite your own understanding of events shown to be wrong, twice already.

Im simply skeptical believing any agenda that is propagated by faceless intelligence agents through any government and media.

Not least the British government considering their history in affairs related to this country alone, nevermind internationally. That anyone could simply take the word of British intelligence, parroting through a mouthpiece like Boris Johnson, and not be somewhat sceptical is odd.

But hey, this isnt a court of law...its the court of public opinion. The bar is set low, very low, I think its set at "if it walks like a duck...".
 
Delboy said:
Ch4 news reporting they had sequential passport numbers and shared a room while in the UK.
Russian un-intelligence!
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Its getting more Keystone Cops than the highly disciplined and technically capable GRU that Teresa May told everyone in UK parliament.
 
BREAKING NEWS! :D:D

Former UK Labour Party leader Michael Foot was a paid Soviet informer.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/...hael-foot-was-paid-soviet-informant-vpdtg3lgx

MI6 were prepared to tell the Queen of his KGB ties upon him coming Prime Minister. (Warning for Jeremy Corbyn no doubt).

Its all being revealed in new book. The sensational headline is somewhat diluted when it emerges the information comes, somewhat ironically, from a Russian spy working for MI6!

You have to admire the publishers timing. How long were they sitting on this 'scoop'?
 
Peter Hitchens

http://hitchensblog.mailonsunday.co...other-experts-the-rush-to-war-in-syriua-.html

Discussing the alleged chemical attacks in Syria.
He takes time to actually read beyond government sponsored media headlines. In doing so he is able to cast doubt on the veracity of claims made by some (governments of US, UK) simply by understanding the meaning of words relative to the conclusions made by others (in this instance OPCW).

It may be of assistance to some here to learn that before posting UK government sponsored propaganda pieces.
 
Bellingcat, investigative journalism site, is claiming it has evidence that links Petrovs passport to Russian security services.
If this is true, then this would act at least as some significant evidence to support the accusations against the two suspects.

https://www.bellingcat.com/news/uk-...s-passport-data-shows-link-security-services/

And then the Telegraph go and publish this speculative nonsense.

"British officials told The Telegraph they believe the two suspects accused by Scotland Yard of the attack were wheeled out on Russian state-sponsored television as punishment for leaving a trail of evidence during the operation to target Col Skripal."

Its this type of nonsense that leads to my skepticism. This is either made up or its true. If its made up, then a separate agenda is being peddled for ulterior motives.

If its true, then its wholly bizarre that the Russians would "wheel them out" for ridicule while simultaneously holding to the claim that they had nothing to do with the attack.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/20...ices-crisis-fallout-botched-salisbury-attack/

The Daily Mail

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ru...t-London-hotel.html?__twitter_impression=true

"Highly disciplined" "Technical capability" "Operational experience" - I cant help think of Teresa Mays words in HoC last week when all of this broke.
I would have assumed that she was briefed on the investigation?
Knowing what we know about this whole affair and what is now being reported, is it odd that the PM would attribute such descriptions to an ill-disciplined, technically dysfunctional and reckless operation?

These two guys have been compromised and are being hung out to dry by some other party.
We are far from the truth in this whole affair. If not, Putins credibility as a leader is in tatters.
 
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Read some comment that the two boys going on TV with talk of a visit to Salisbury Cathedral was intended as mocking the British.
 
Yes, ive been reading that spin too, that the Russians are trying to turn this into a pantomime. A sort of "nah, nah, na, nah na...you cant catch me!"

On the other hand, more seriously, the Russians have apparently offered to consider any request from UK authorities to come to Moscow to interview suspects.

[broken link removed]

This is not showing up in UK based media as far as I can see?

It would see reasonable to expect the UK to request permission to interview these suspects.
 
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