The R Word

joe sod said:
we now have the highest paid public sector workers in europe
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Would you like to clarify your source for this? I'm pretty sure the recent OECD review of the Irish public sector came up with a pretty different conclusion.
 
I hope the public sector dont get a cent in a pay raise. If they are not happy with their current rate of pay there are and will be many people happy to take there place.

Joejoe
 
im afraid purple is right.....the government are terrified of the public sector unions,they have had them in a stranglehold for years now. thats what half the problem is in this country is....weak governments
 
yes, that was the case for so long, but the government showed some backbone on benchmarking II, so I see a glimpse of change...

Also they didn't cave in (yet) to SIPTU on their demands in exchange for support of the lisbon treaty
 
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uiop said:
Whats' a worst case scenario if the government did actually stand up to the public sector ? Would the country fall to pieces with strikes or would it just mean less votes for the government ?
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strikes, strikes and more strikes.
 
But could essential services be maintained? Could the army drive the buses? If a winter of discontent is required to break the public service union stranglehold on our country then would the general public (ie, private sector, no guaranteed pay rises or job for life security) support a strong challenge to the unions?

The public sector unions could be placated in good times. 'Partnership' was always flawed as far as I am concerned and a downturn will expose it. A short downturn may refocus minds on waste in the public sector, something which is badly needed IMO!!
 
uiop said:
Whats' a worst case scenario if the government did actually stand up to the public sector ? Would the country fall to pieces with strikes or would it just mean less votes for the government ?
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i would say plenty of strikes.....and less votes for the government.
the present government just dont have what it takes to go head to head with them.
 
murphaph said:
But could essential services be maintained?
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The army could fulfil certain tasks e.g. transport, waste disposal but what about nurses/junior doctors, electricity supply, air traffic controllers, front line staff in DSFA etc.
 
I realy hope that the government stand up and put the public unions and workers in their place. They all have privliged postions and just take take take....

Joejoe
 
joejoe said:
I realy hope that the government stand up and put the public unions and workers in their place. They all have privliged postions and just take take take....

Joejoe
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i hope so too joejoe...but dont go expecting very much...this goverment has shown no real backbone when it comes to tackeling the hard issues.
 
murphaph said:
But could essential services be maintained? Could the army drive the buses?
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You might just find that the army have a different idea of their role to the PD-like posters on this thread.
rmelly said:
yes, that was the case for so long, but the government showed some backbone on benchmarking II, so I see a glimpse of change...
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Indeed, the recent benchmarking report shows the utter fallacy of Purple's comment above. I guess if he keeps saying it often enough, there are some people out there who will believe it, regardless of the truth.
 
Complainer said:
Indeed, the recent benchmarking report shows the utter fallacy of Purple's comment above. I guess if he keeps saying it often enough, there are some people out there who will believe it, regardless of the truth.
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Come on now, I didn't go that far.
 
Why does this recession thread keep reverting to a discussion of the public service?

What about the other crucial questions in the recession: our manufacturing base, the multinationals, exports, migration, property, consumer spending, the credit crunch, the banking crisis, the ISEQ meltdown, oil, food prices, unemployment...
 
Because the public sector pay is a drain on government spending, and the cost only ever goes one way - UP.

The private sector makes the money, the public sector spends it.

When less money is coming in (reduced tax revenue) caused mainly by global phenomenon beyond the governments control, the most obvious target is to reduce the burden of the public sector.

Standard business behaviour, when sales fall or stagnate (tax take), rationalise/reduce costs.
 
rmelly said:
Because the public sector pay is a drain on government spending, and the cost only ever goes one way - UP. .
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Wow thats a clever bit of analysis. As a key role of government is running the public service it is obvious that thats where the money goes, i.e. running our hospitals schools etc.

rmelly said:
The private sector makes the money, the public sector spends it..
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Public servants pay tax and cannot use the miriad of tax scams/loopholes avalible to some business people earning fortunes in the private sector.


What exactly do you want to rationalise in the public service? The health service? This was done in the 80s and lead a decade of under funding and cutbacks. |Much of the funding on heath ovwer the last 10 years went in to addressing this.

I suggest all workers regardless of being in the public private should act in a united way to ensure our public services are maintained and strengthened during this time. This is not the time to make the public service a scapegoat for this recession. All of us whether in the private or public sector will suffer if the government is allowed to cutback on our schools and hospitals.
 
One thing is for sure televison, your a public servant, how about the new pay talks, would you be happy to take a stall in pay? Do your bit for the country.

Joejoe
 
rmelly said:
Because the public sector pay is a drain on government spending, and the cost only ever goes one way - UP.

The private sector makes the money, the public sector spends it.
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Nice rhetoric, but fairly empty and meaningless. To describe spending on hospitals, schools, public transport infrastructure, supports for people with disabilities etc as 'a drain' ignores the vital and essential purpose of these spends.

rmelly said:
When less money is coming in (reduced tax revenue) caused mainly by global phenomenon beyond the governments control, the most obvious target is to reduce the burden of the public sector.
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Indeed, but following the most obvious path is not always the smartest approach. For the record, the boom/bust in the construction sector was very much the creation of our current government.

rmelly said:
Standard business behaviour, when sales fall or stagnate (tax take), rationalise/reduce costs.
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Smart businesses go a little deeper. Smart businesses seek to continue to retain the best staff, as they know their future sucess depends on these staff. Smart businesses invest in their future, whether through infrastructure or research or product development, as they know their future success depends on it.

But regardless, the government is not a business. It is a government.

Our government needs to invest in education now. Schools will be facing a 25% approx increase in their heating bill this winter with no corresponding increase in their capitation fee. It's kinda difficult to focus on leaving cert maths if your fingers are blue with cold.

Our government needs to invest in public transport infrastructure, as the ridiculous model of single-occupant-car-commute becomes unattainable for many workers.
 
joejoe said:
One thing is for sure televison, your a public servant, how about the new pay talks, would you be happy to take a stall in pay? Do your bit for the country.

Joejoe
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I have being doing my bit for the country for 15 years working in the public sector.
 
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