Also frustrating when the often-repeated argument gets pulled out that when someone is "young", they should solely concentrate on saving for a deposit/pay down mortgage and wait to fund pensions later when more comfortable. Definitely seeing the snowball benefits now of having saved consistently in a pension even on 20% rate for the last 15 years!
The effective tax rate for a retired couple on €50k?
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Let's be fair to them:- they probably have to pay a fair whack of LPT on their bijou detatched five bedroom house somewhere in the leafy suburbs!
We're seeing the massive growth in Stock Markets due to quantitative easing over the last decade. My pension fund value about doubled during that time.
It seems decidedly unfair that despite looking forward to holidays in New York , Cadiz , Seville , Porto and Heidelberg in the coming year that will keep us out of the country for 5 months that we get no rebate on LPT tax !!!
As pensioners on DB pensions plus contributory old age pensions this is an outrage !
Seriously though it really is a great country for some pensioners and we are extremely lucky and grateful.
It's jaw dropping that Motormouth Doherty hasn't yet promised to refund LPT - plus interest - to every homeowner over the age of 55!
Talk about a missed opportunity!
What really gets me going is that the State/taxpayer gives 35 pm / 420 pa off the elec bill of my parents, even though they have 500k in financial assets!!!
We charge them too little tax, and then we give them cash off their bills, even though they have half a million in financial assets!!!
Such a country.
And yet if you read the media, you think these people are "vulnerable elderly"!!!!
We charge them too little tax, and then we give them cash off their bills, even though they have half a million in financial assets!!!
Such a country.
And yet if you read the media, you think these people are "vulnerable elderly"!!!!
Yep.
Isn't it bizzare that a State that pays incessant lip service to the principle of "equality" is quite happy to discriminate legislatively in favour of the elderly?
Not to mention the media who appear to revel in the impression that every elderly person is a frail, penniless 90 year old who can't walk 12 paces without a zimmerframe and is doubly incontinent (although they prefer not to focus on that bit!)
And then, to add insult to injury, if they make it to 100 years of age - at which point they have parasited off the rest of us for 35 years, if not longer! - the buggers get a tax-free present of €2,500 from the President!
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How do you know that is what people think of their parents?
Mine are in their 70's and costing the State a fortune in medical costs but they are grateful for all the hand-out's they get. They have the free travel but they don't use it. When they are visiting expensive restaurants they use a taxi. If they are not drinking they use one of their expensive cars.
Anyway, if it was their final years there wouldn't be a problem but they hang around for decades!
How do you know they did? There was more tax evasion in the 70's and 80's and probably more welfare fraud. There was far more corruption and lots of them got to buy their Council house at a massive discount.
I've no real problem with all the hand-out's and the unearned pensions that retirees get. I'd just like them to say thanks once in a while. A pit of gratitude goes a long way.
Here's an example; If you are a pensioner I suggest the next time you have your dinner delivered by some poor young fella on a bike with a deliveroo bag on his back you should apologise for stealing his future to pay for your retirement and thank him with a good tip from your unearned pension...
Then apologise again because you wouldn't increase the retirement age so he won't get a State pension...
Then show him your house and apologise again because your generation screwed things up so badly that he's never own a house...
If it's raining you can also apologise for ignoring Climate Change until it was too late...
Etc...
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As the author of some of the comments that you're criticising, permit me to point out that I'm an OAP with far too much money for my needs plus a couple of hard working kids in their mid-30s who may never own their own home. :mad: In the next few years I'm going to get a "free" Medical Card although I have private healthcare, which my kids can't afford (so we pay it for them).
And I haven't "bloody well earned my wealth" - I inherited most of it from the sale of my hard-working parents' home after their death. And I am not alone - my siblings, plus quite a few of our long-standing friends are exactly the same situation.
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I worked in a furniture factory specialising in the manufacture of TV cabinets where half the workforce were missing a finger or two or the most common injury finger tips , the only plus was that you left work high on the fumes of French Polish !
I then worked in a brewery on a Guinness bottling line where bottles regularly shattered showering us with glass , again there was a saving grace as we got free drink.
Following that I worked in a Flour Mills where my job as an electrician's helper was to note the voltage of motors that were as high as 50 feet from the ground without a safety harness.
Following that I worked in the intensive heat of tomato glasshouses which was backbreaking, miserable work.
Finally I got a more comfortable, less honest job in the Bank of Ireland.
I am grateful to have a decent occupational pension plus the contributory OAP but equally I feel like most of my mates who worked similar jobs that we are totally worth it .
I then worked in a brewery on a Guinness bottling line where bottles regularly shattered showering us with glass , again there was a saving grace as we got free drink.
Following that I worked in a Flour Mills where my job as an electrician's helper was to note the voltage of motors that were as high as 50 feet from the ground without a safety harness.
Following that I worked in the intensive heat of tomato glasshouses which was backbreaking, miserable work.
Finally I got a more comfortable, less honest job in the Bank of Ireland.
I am grateful to have a decent occupational pension plus the contributory OAP but equally I feel like most of my mates who worked similar jobs that we are totally worth it .
I started working part time in a factory when I was 14, full time at 17. I worked 65 hours, over six and a half day a week. I’ve had the top of my finger cut off and sewn back on plus many other injuries. I still think young people have it harder today and working hard doesn’t mean you paid for your State pension.
NoRegretsCoyote
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My own parents a similar age. They and their friends all worked hard and paid double-digit mortgage rates in their 20s and 30s of course, paying a lot of tax along the way too.
But the massive increase in house prices and decline in rates in the 90s saw them all pay off mortgages easily by age fifty, then as sixty hit they all started to retire many with DB pensions. None of them worked full-time past 63, some dip their toe back in with part-time work here and there.
They have the guts of 20 years life expectancy still - and fair play to them - but their effective tax rate really is very low given their means, and the household benefits package that kicks in at 70 is ridiculous and completely superfluous to their needs.
I don't complain about my own lot, but I have friends in their 30s who pay 70% of their gross income in mortgage, childcare, tax, pension contributions, and health insurance combined.
Something is not equitable here.
I fully acknowledge what my parents and their generation faced (born approx 1940-1950):
- my mother studied for the LC by candlelight in late 50s
- she had to pay to train to be a nurse - I repeat, the apprentice nurse paid to receive training
- high interest rates on mortgages in 1970 and 1980s
- high income tax rates in late 70s, into 80s
However, I still make the point that given the benefits they receive now, paying 7.2% direct income tax on 49.5k is too low now, we can't as a society afford that now.
Does any other country charge such low direct tax, and then pay 35pm of elec bill, even though the people have 500k financial assets?
I would love if we could afford this now, but we can't.
We have a large public debt, and okay the public debt interest bill is not too bad, but we are living in a slowly ageing society, with increasing healthcare and pension and LT care costs.
I accept that it is politically very difficult to remove these benefits:
- GP card for all over 70
- HBP for all over 70: free TV licence, 35 pm off elec
- Free travel pass for all over 66
- Medical card for many over 70, softer means test than under 70
However, we could at least charge them a bit more income tax, that is my suggestion.
Any data to support that assertion?
And are they all paying only 8% tax?