Key Post The case for buying a property in France, Spain or Portugal

OMG_OMG said:
We were talking about this thread last night and another thing came up.
We thought of all the people who we know who own holiday homes abroad and in Ireland and it surprised us just how many we know.

Anyway when we thought about it we realized that all those people we know pay for their holiday homes, yet their relatives (children, in-laws, brothers and sisters) and friends all get more or less free use of it.

So the main beneficiary of a holiday home seems to be not the person who buys it, but their relatives and friends.

Now the relatives might throw them the odd hundred or a bottle of whiskey, but they are getting the better part of the deal :)

It reminded me of the time when I had 3 weeks off unexpectedly that i had to take at short notice. We called the owner of a holiday home we rented a few times asked could we rent that for the 3 weeks. She said her sister was going to be in it that week and she would go check. She rang me back later, very annoyed at her sister and said her sister wanted it for the week in the middle. So we had to look elsewhere. I doubt she was going to the the €2k she was going to get off us from her sister :)
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I considered a camper van a while back. Relatives all thought it was a fantastic idea. Yet none of them ever bought one. Know a friend who bought one and deliberately bought a bigger one so a car licence won't do. Relatives can't borrow it.
 
And that's the other reason (other than financial) that we never did buy an apartment. Two of my sisters in law are teachers, so I can guarantee that they would decamp to our apartment for the summer, when we are working 9 -5 and they are off (plus any mid-terms).

I didn't feel like subsidizing their holidays.
 
You can always say ‘no’.

My parents have been asked a few times over the years and my Dad just point blank says no.

(to extended family)
 
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Well! You'd think we'd learned something after:-
(i) Owning a caravan which we towed all over Ireland - got held up in traffic where there were no by-passes (e.g. everywhere) every time we brought it out.
(ii) We owned a mobile home planted in a serviced site Co Kerry - (Our biggest disaster ever; I'm sure I wrote about it on this forum).
(iii) We bought an exhausted P&T van which we converted into a "dormobile" - our cheapest holiday investment and we drove not only throughout Ireland, but the UK and France/Spain/Holland - I think I wrote about that too here.
(iv) An old house in the middle of nowhere (Co Kerry) which we largely renovated ourselves and got the builder (the guy we bought the place from and father of about twenty, God Bless his devoted wife) to replace the flat roof on the kitchen with a proper roof - Also, I wrote about that too here - We eventually sold it. It was in so a remote area, on one occasion we lost our way there after the place was vacant over the winter/spring.
(v) In Spain, we bought our first holiday home abroad, an apartment in Ballymun-in-the-Sun (and no offence to anybody from Ballymun) on a clear day we could see the ground. We couldn't sell it fast enough, but we did and bought a low rise apartment further south which we continue to own (loved, caressed, appreciated and attracted to by everybody I know). We are not going to sell it.

We we used our mobile home much more than the other "van" owners (when you own a mobile home, you can call it a "van" like when you own a Mercedes you can call it a Merc). All the family used it throughout the year when the park was open (Easter - October). The main thing I learned during our time as "van" owners is the upwardly mobile clitterati from Limerick are three times worse than the worst clitterati from Cork - I kid you not! The stories I could tell . . . The clitterati stories got worse when the "van" became the oldest van on the park.

The house we bought in the Everglades of Kerry needed care. There wasn't a time we visited that something didn't have to be replaced. You'd spend your holidays painting, repairing, replacing, cutting grass. We had a near neighbour who was a sports personality and although he had a dream holiday retreat, he never ever visited and was a love nest - If ever I was to get into blackmail, there was my chance. Being a good Irish Catholic citizen I kept my mouth shut and wouldn't ever spill the beans.

The "dormobile" with aircon supplied by opening the back door was our most interesting escapade. I think that every garda who is an owner of a B&B moved us on wherever we had parked. I'll save the memories for my autobiography.

Perhaps I'll give a synopsis of our life as "travellers" to some AAM Posters who occasionally visit us in Costa Almería.
 
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"Clitterati" now there is a Schrodingers' phrase if ever there was one. I want to know the exact meaning, but at the same time don't.

In any event, I shall use it (with your permission) as a term of offence whenever possible.
 
Buddyboy said:
You must not be familiar with the angst and guilt generated in the Irish female when she is asked to say no to one of her family.

I live with it and would rather avoid it when at all possible. ;)
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That does seem to be a common phenomenon alright ;)
My Mum would be be on the same page as my Dad though, but when my wife and I chat about buying somewhere, I’m sometimes horrified at the thought of some of the people who might visit. But I don’t think we would let anyone stay unless we’re there; same as our home really.
 
Buddyboy said:
"Clitterati" now there is a Schrodingers' phrase if ever there was one. I want to know the exact meaning, but at the same time don't.

In any event, I shall use it (with your permission) as a term of offence whenever possible.
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I deliberately misspelled the word in case I would cause offence and that's something I would never want to do. But, if you own a "van" which is older than all the other vans in a mobile home park, you'll learn the true meaning of the word, believe me! The pressure we came under to update or sell our mobile home was horrendous which included not inviting our young kids to other kids (of other mobile home owners) birthday parties, being shunned, etc which was a low as you can get. I'll tell the full story in my autobiography though.

Just on a point of information:- We were always delighted to allow our family and extended family members use the apartment in Spain.

PS:- Feel free to use my word though.
 
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OMG_OMG said:
I was thinking it would be nice to own a mobile in Wicklow too :)
What kid of costs do you have with that do you mind me asking?
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We bought in Ballincarraig back in the early 90's. Now called Potters Point.

The mobile home at the time was expensive, about £22k. To get a decking cost £1k. We had to pay an annual membership of £2k. The prices seemed to go up every year.

The owner was very strict and kept an eye on everything.

Many families decamped there for the summer. Wives plus children, seven days a week. Husbands arrived at weekend, usually to play golf.

We only used it at weekends. Neither of us play golf nor tennis so we really didn't use the facilities. Many people had been there for years and really weren't interested in getting to know us blow ins. It didn't really bother us as we spent our time strolling the beach or just lounging around.

We enjoyed going there off season when many of the homes were vacant.

Some people began to upgrade their mobile homes to mini type houses. At one stage the Freehold was offered for sale for eye watering amounts.

Our children didn't want to go down over the weekend so we took the decision to sell. We got more or less our costs back, so we were happy enough. You had to pay a percentage of your sale price to the site owner.

When the Celtic Tiger began to roar, these basin mobile homes plus freehold were selling for vast sums of money. It would have been a very good investment to hold on to it.

Occasionally I think I would like to have it now. Not so much for myself and my wife but for my children. I would be happy to pitch in and pay toward a new mobile home in Wicklow or Wexford and let all the family use it. Everyone would have to 100% committed though.
 
Buddyboy said:
You must not be familiar with the angst and guilt generated in the Irish female when she is asked to say no to one of her family.

I live with it and would rather avoid it when at all possible. ;)
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My other half mentioned our interest in a holiday home a couple of years ago.
I lost count of how many said - "Did you get your holiday home yet? Can I have the first 2 weeks in August?".
We never ended up getting it, but even to this day are getting "requests" for when they can have it.
And even then you can see the pain on her face when she tells them they cant have it. :)
 
Cervelo,

We are a God-fearing nation.........when you talk about coffeeshops, I shudder to think of the type of establishment that you have in mind!?
 
"I considered a camper van a while back. Relatives all thought it was a fantastic idea. Yet none of them ever bought one. Know a friend who bought one and deliberately bought a bigger one so a car licence won't do. Relatives can't borrow it."

The trend now is stealth camper vans.
Full apartment inside.
Looks like a large transit van roof and some panels are transparent.
You can park anywhere, without drawing attention.
 
A few years ago I went down the campervan rabbit hole on YouTube
I was thinking of following the the cycling season around Europe, northern Europe for the Monuments
Italy, France, Spain for the Grand Tours and whatever else I could find in-between
There is a ton of info on YouTube from your casual family two week holiday to the young couples that have embraced the nomadic lifestyle
I was surprised to find out that a VW campervan could cost you over a €100K to buy new but also that they don't depreciate as quickly as a car
which led me to think that if I could save money on accommodation and eating out and not lose out massively on the sale of a campervan, that this could be a very viable project compared to traveling in a car and staying in hotels along the way

Then I came across a channel of a young gorgeous couple living the nomadic life traveling through North and South American with their dog in an old VW campervan, They had lots of advise on how to live this lifestyle including a "10 learning curves you need to be aware of" type vid
1. People smell, your partner will smell, when living this close together there is no way of avoiding it. Get used to it!!!
 
I saw a nice camper van for sale for €20k that i really, really wanted. Only problem is I would have nowhere to store it when not used.
Im sure you could rent secure space in a yard for them somewhere, but i never looked into it.
 
I wonder has the pandemic and the government reaction to it dampened people's enthusiasm for buying a place in Spain. On the one hand people are yearning to get out of Ireland and go on holidays but on the other hand the risks of owning a holiday home in a foreign land have increased dramatically. Look at what's happened, borders closed, airlines stopped, deep suspicion of outsiders and foreigners. It seems to be that increased localism and nationalism has taken over from "ever increasing union ". You just have to listen to the irish discourse on the pandemic to realise that, even going down to a mobile home in wexford was a capital offence. Could a holiday home in Spain become a "stranded asset"
 
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