Tenant wants to move girlfriend in - does this become a new tenancy?

Arnie Hammer said:
An extra body is going to add about 5% of the rent to my costs and I want to be compensated.
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Your 5% number is just plucked out of the sky.

I would venture that, on average, there should be no impact. The areas where there’s a material effect, e.g. utility bills, are paid by the tenants anyway.

Where’s the impact? Toilet seats being put up and down 50% more? More people sitting on the couch?

There’s no economic justification for charging more.

What’s next, upping the rent when tenants have a baby?!
 
Gordon Gekko said:
I would venture that, on average, there should be no impact.
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That is not my experience. The property has had one, two, and three tenants over the years.

More tenants equals more wear and tear. In the very short term that's not visible (it's not like the effect of mileage on your tyres) but on average and long term yes there is.
 
Arnie Hammer said:
That is not my experience. The property has had one, two, and three tenants over the years.

More tenants equals more wear and tear. In the very short term that's not visible (it's not like the effect of mileage on your tyres) but on average and long term yes there is.
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Oh well, we can extrapolate from that so…

:)

Your experience with a few tenants here and there is hardly empirical evidence.
 
Arnie Hammer said:
Could they do this without my consent though? My understanding was that they couldn't.
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They could indeed.

The tenants are under a statutory obligation to inform the landlord of the identity of any residents in the dwelling. However, the landlord is not in a position to accept or veto the individual concerned as he/she would with a tenant.

Bear in mind that if the girlfriend becomes an additional co-tenant, as opposed to a mere guest of the existing co-tenants,, then she can enforce her statutory rights (security of tenure, etc.) against you.

Also, remember that whether, and to what extent, you can raise the rent is regulated by statute. I'm afraid your additional projected costs are not relevant in this regard.
 
Sarenco said:
Nope.

If a property is the subject of a co-tenancy, then each tenant is jointly and severally responsible to the landlord for the payment of the rent.

The co-tenants could sub-let the property to another party with the consent of the landlord or they could allow another person to enter the property as a licensee. However, neither arrangement has any impact on the obligations of the co-tenants to the landlord.

Nobody rents a room in a shared house. The co-tenants jointly lease the whole house and they can decide amongst themselves where they sleep at night.
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Are you saying the tenants can allow another person to live in the premises as a licensee without the landlords permission.

If so what are you basing that on.
 
cremeegg said:
Are you saying the tenants can allow another person to live in the premises as a licensee without the landlords permission.

If so what are you basing that on.
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Are you seriously suggesting that the landlord's consent should be required every time a tenant has a guest over?!

If a girlfriend moves in without becoming an additional co-tenant, then she is there as a guest of the co-tenants.

No landlord consent required for that arrangement.

Tenants are entitled to quiet and peaceful enjoyment of the property - who they choose to share their bed with is, frankly, none of the landlord's business.
 
Sarenco said:
Bear in mind that if the girlfriend becomes an additional co-tenant, as opposed to a mere guest of the existing co-tenants,, then she can enforce her statutory rights (security of tenure, etc.) against you.
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That's a useful point. The other tenant may be happier with her as a licensee.

Sarenco said:
Also, remember that whether, and to what extent, you can raise the rent is regulated by statute. I'm afraid your additional projected costs are not relevant in this regard
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This is clear. Thread was derailed on this issue which is beside the point. I simply wanted to know what the maximum permitted increase would be and it seems it's the same whether girlfriend becomes a co-tenant or licensee.
 
Arnie Hammer said:
That's a useful point. The other tenant may be happier with her as a licensee.


This is clear. Thread was derailed on this issue which is beside the point. I simply wanted to know what the maximum permitted increase would be and it seems it's the same whether girlfriend becomes a co-tenant or licensee.
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Or even if she doesn’t move in at all!

She’s a red herring in terms of increasing the rent.
 
Sarenco said:
Are you seriously suggesting that the landlord's consent should be required every time a tenant has a guest over?!
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No.

Are you suggesting that there is no difference between having a guest over, and someone moving in and making the property their place of residence.
 
From my understanding your existing tenant remains the "tenant" as per the existing lease and she becomes a licensee on his account if she just moves in.
You can draw up a joint tenancy in both their names if they so wish, but I am not sure how that impacts both your obligations in the event of things like notice periods?

cremeegg said:
No.

Are you suggesting that there is no difference between having a guest over, and someone moving in and making the property their place of residence.
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Its complicated - the "tenant" is obliged to tell you who is living there, but I don't think you have rights to refuse them to do so unless they want to assign the tenancy to someone else. They are allowed to sub-let where appropriate but this person then becomes their tenant, and they become "head tenant." Now unless you've let them a sub-20m2 studio, I am not sure you have a case for refusing them to do so. Its probably easier and simpler to ask the tenant if their new friend can become co-tenant on the existing lease. Its probably easier to leave them with tenancy as is, and well enough alone.

It does not give you any rights with regard to rent changes, as the existing tenancy is still in place.
 
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From the current RTB1 form:
"Subletting occurs when a tenant permits another party to lease the rental property that the tenant has leased from the landlord. Subletting can only take place WITH THE CONSENT OF THE LANDLORD.
Both the original tenancy and the sub tenancy is registered"


This states that where there's Subletting (not licensee) a tenant has to have permission from landlord.
the situation under discussion isn't a Sublet . It's licensee.
Do you need permission from landlord for licensee? I don't think so.
 
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