Teddybear name diplomatic incident

diarmuidc said:
Do you want to change your tune or are you still gung ho for bombing them back to the stone ages, just in case?
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Well after reading the NIE which only has came to my attention after you pointed it out (thanks for that), I think we can continue with "sanctions" until the NIE shows that they are near to get enough material. Than let's bomb them to stone ages. That is if the "sanctions" don't show further results by them completly stopping with their goal.

Under no circumstances can that re-incarination of Hitler be allowed to have controll over atomic weapons.

But as long as these "sanctions" and political efforts stop him from whiping Israel off the map I'm all for peacefull solutions. But if he is near to getting the weapons for his goal, than I'm going back to military solutions.
 
DublinTexas said:
I would never go to Persia until the current terrorist goverment is gone. That has nothing to do with my religion or sexuality. It's common sense. In fact I think we should bomb that little country back to the stone ages. And that has nothing to do with religon but rather with terrorist activity and the fact that we can't let that little Hitler have an atomic weapon because he will wipe Israel from the map.
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Well thankfully your not in charge of foreign policy in the USA. Do you not think nuking Iran (or Persia as you prefer to call it) back to the stone age would not have an affect on Isreal if the wind was blowing east to west?
Or on the American soldiers serving in Iraq? Or the people of eastern Europe? Or the people here in Ireland? Or on world ecomonic conditions?

I was giving your argument a little though until you came up with the gem above.

Do you not think what the Sudanese government deserve to be nuked into the stone age for what they are doing in Darfur? Or are you only interested in terrorism that directly affects the United States?
 
The_Banker said:
Well thankfully your not in charge of foreign policy in the USA. Do you not think nuking Iran (or Persia as you prefer to call it) back to the stone age would not have an affect on Isreal if the wind was blowing east to west?
Or on the American soldiers serving in Iraq? Or the people of eastern Europe? Or the people here in Ireland? Or on world ecomonic conditions?

I was giving your argument a little though until you came up with the gem above.

Do you not think what the Sudanese government deserve to be nuked into the stone age for what they are doing in Darfur? Or are you only interested in terrorism that directly affects the United States?
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Where did I ask for "nuking" somebody. The destruction of equipement in Iran that could be used to create weapons of mass destruction by military means (what I called bomb them back to the stone ages) is in my opinon a viable solution, which however in light of the NIE as above does not seam right at the moment.

Now you drag in Dafur and that is hot topic for me!

In respect of Dafur, I gave money to charities dealing with Dafur way before everybody else every made a fuss. I made a politcal fuss about by writing to my goverment more than once to get the finger out of their collective asses and do something. I think not enough is done done their and the current AU or UN troups are a joke. So is the EU force which may or may not be deployed to protect refugee camps.

Dermot Ahern's performance about this in yesterdays Q&A on RTE was a shame. So is what other politican worldwide (including the US) are doing (or rather not doing).

Stop delaying the deployment because of political face saving. Either you want to help or not. If you want to help, get the troops and helicopters down there. Hell for sure the soldiers are gonna get shot at but either we want to protect the refugess or not.

If we want than stop waisting time and act now before more people die.

Now the talk about deploying it in January, despite the rebels moving now. Just because they move 1 month earlier than last year we can't keep our head in the sand. What are "rapid deployment forces" for if we can't get them up in over 5 month now?

And finaly I am against terrorism from where ever it comes. From the right, left, protestants, catholics, muslims, jewish or greenpeace or anthing else.
 
DublinTexas said:
*In fact I think we should bomb that little country back to the stone ages.
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...which would be in my opinion just another wrong done since the overthrowing of democracy in Iran during the 1950's followed by the support of the evil shah by the west.
You cant talk about understanding different cultures and their punishments without understanding why they became the way they are today.


DublinTexas said:
When is the last time people got up in arms about a woman being stoned in Saudia arabia because she had sex outside marriage? Where are the protestor than? If it would have been a "western" woman than everybody would have been up in arms.
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I completely agree here and think its total crap that we dont say more about this to the heads of the countries concerned. In this case it appears oil and the need for cordial diplomatic relations is the major factor.
When the oils runs out; then there will be a big change. Nobody will probably care what happens in the middle east then. And*western governments will probably find the courage to mention such things as human rights if the occasion arises.
I remember maybe 2 years ago there was a photo of a meeting of our government ministers and saudi officials and our female minister had to sit away from the saudi heads of government on the other side of the room while 'the boys' all sat together with them. All to please their chauvinism. That really says it all.
 
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room305 said:
I would argue that even with good knowledge of Sudanese law, it would have been very easy to trip up. Precisely because religious blasphemy laws are very subjective.
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Room305 is quite right here - I lived in the Middle East for 5 years and almost came a cropper when out jogging on the seafront in a Gulf State.

We had been told that we must cover our arms and legs, no need to cover the hair and so long as we did that, we would be okay.

Went jogging with a long (to the mid thigh) long-sleeved t-shirt and black full length leggings and socks and trainers and nearly got lynched!

A Mullah out for a stroll took offence to my leggings and quickly gathered a crowd around him to yell and scream at me. I was very lucky that a Lebanese man who could see what was happening came to my rescue and explained in English what was going on. He managed after much heated argument and the police having been summoned to persuade them that I had understood that I was to be covered from neck to ankle and that I had not realised that some people might find the leggings offensive. We hadn't been told that the clothing must be loose so as not to define the shape of any part of the body.

I was very lucky to get away from the group that had gathered as it appeared that they all believed they had to agree with the Mullah!

It's disappointing that Western countries are expected to be tolerant and accept the traditions of other cultures (to the extent where we deny our own traditions and cultures such as the cancelling of a Nativity Play in a Dublin Creche this week because of a few complaints from non-Christian parents or the removal of a crib from a public hospital last year for fear of causing offence) when they come to live in our societies, but believe me, our tolerance is certainly not reciprocated in Islamic countries.
 
I had a stand at the local car boot sale last weekend.... I had bought this teddy for €5..... I then sold it at the car boot sale for €10! .. Now the friggin' Sudanese Muslims are after me for making a prophet out of a teddy bear!!!!
 
She was a stupid women to do what she did but Fundamentalist Islamic law is evil and has no place in a free country.
I don't think that nativity plays should be stopped. I do think that covering your entire face in public should be banned. I don’t think we should pussey-foot around these issues.
If you don't ant to live in a secular western democracy with a strong Christian tradition then don't move to Ireland.
If you want to live in a country that has Sharia law then don't move to Ireland.
If you are from Ireland and you want Sharia law then move to some repressive misogynistic s*** hole where they have it.
This is Europe; we had our religious wars. Then we had an age of reason and an age of Enlightenment. Religious fundamentalism, or any other form of totalitarianism or fascism has no place in a civilised country. Any culture that accepts any of the above forms of law or government are inferior to ours and we should not be afraid to say so.
 
Purple said:
She was a stupid women to do what she did but Fundamentalist Islamic law is evil and has no place in a free country.
I don't think that nativity plays should be stopped. I do think that covering your entire face in public should be banned. I don’t think we should pussey-foot around these issues.
If you don't ant to live in a secular western democracy with a strong Christian tradition then don't move to Ireland.
If you want to live in a country that has Sharia law then don't move to Ireland.
If you are from Ireland and you want Sharia law then move to some repressive misogynistic s*** hole where they have it.
This is Europe; we had our religious wars. Then we had an age of reason and an age of Enlightenment. Religious fundamentalism, or any other form of totalitarianism or fascism has no place in a civilised country. Any culture that accepts any of the above forms of law or government are inferior to ours and we should not be afraid to say so.
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Fully agree - BTW I think your 'word mincer' must have seized up by now from lack of use. ;)
 
Purple said:
She was a stupid women to do what she did but Fundamentalist Islamic law is evil and has no place in a free country.
I don't think that nativity plays should be stopped. I do think that covering your entire face in public should be banned. I don’t think we should pussey-foot around these issues.
If you don't ant to live in a secular western democracy with a strong Christian tradition then don't move to Ireland.
If you want to live in a country that has Sharia law then don't move to Ireland.
If you are from Ireland and you want Sharia law then move to some repressive misogynistic s*** hole where they have it.
This is Europe; we had our religious wars. Then we had an age of reason and an age of Enlightenment. Religious fundamentalism, or any other form of totalitarianism or fascism has no place in a civilised country. Any culture that accepts any of the above forms of law or government are inferior to ours and we should not be afraid to say so.
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I agree 100% with every word.
 
Caveat said:
Fully agree - BTW I think your 'word mincer' must have seized up by now from lack of use. ;)
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Say it like it is. Our society is superior, in every way, to those that repress half their population because of their gender and institute barbaric laws in based on the 1500 year old ramblings of a nomadic warlord.
A society based on fundamentalist Christianity or Judaism would be just as inferior.
 
Purple said:
This is Europe; we had our religious wars. Then we had an age of reason and an age of Enlightenment. .
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I still agree with your whole post. However upon reflection, because the west's religious wars were'nt solely our own and were exported and that this has occurred fairly recently and continues to occur; I'm therefore not sure how enlightened we are. I do think however that we are more enlightened and reasonable than any fundamentalist theocracy can be.
 
... and if US fundamentalist Christianity gets a hold and spreads I fear we may be entering an age of un-Reason and un-Enlightenment.
 
Purple said:
She was a stupid women to do what she did but Fundamentalist Islamic law is evil and has no place in a free country.
I don't think that nativity plays should be stopped. I do think that covering your entire face in public should be banned. I don’t think we should pussey-foot around these issues.
If you don't ant to live in a secular western democracy with a strong Christian tradition then don't move to Ireland.
If you want to live in a country that has Sharia law then don't move to Ireland.
If you are from Ireland and you want Sharia law then move to some repressive misogynistic s*** hole where they have it.
This is Europe; we had our religious wars. Then we had an age of reason and an age of Enlightenment. Religious fundamentalism, or any other form of totalitarianism or fascism has no place in a civilised country. Any culture that accepts any of the above forms of law or government are inferior to ours and we should not be afraid to say so.
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Must agree with the above. She was foolish to go to a nutbar country.
 
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