The registered owner gets the fine/points,however if the registered owner says he/she wasn’t driving the vehicle he/she can put down (any body’s) licence number once valid on the paperwork and return it.Does a speeding fine mean automatic points these days ? Could the OP have got a fine but not penalty points ?
You'll need permission or agreement of the other driver, which is a fairly big ask. It can come back to bite you on the ass too - ask Chris Huhne.The registered owner gets the fine/points,however if the registered owner says he/she wasn’t driving the vehicle he/she can put down (any body’s) licence number once valid on the paperwork and return it.
It’s called point swapping and is quite common.
You would indeed need permission or an agreement but in some cases the person receiving the points doesn’t even know.You'll need permission or agreement of the other driver, which is a fairly big ask. It can come back to bite you on the ass too - ask Chris Huhne.
How would the person not know? They'll get issued with the FCPN by post.You would indeed need permission or an agreement but in some cases the person receiving the points doesn’t even know.
It can bite hard if discovered.
It could be a family member,like a son or daughter putting there elderly parents details on it.How would the person not know? They'll get issued with the FCPN by post.
Or someone no longer in the country.How would the person not know? They'll get issued with the FCPN by post.
Apparently, there's lads in Sydney who've clocked up quite a few Irish points on their licences.Or someone no longer in the country.
Or someone no longer in the country.
Great arguments for increased regulation on drivers there, like reducing the period of licences and requiring regular retesting.Apparently, there's lads in Sydney who've clocked up quite a few Irish points on their licences.
Yes, duty of disclosure arises as soon as any change occurs. What I was saying above is that duty extends to any of the details that were provided when getting a quote.Not just when looking for a quote Leo.
I don't think that's necessarily the case. As with any insurance policy contract, there is an absolute good faith requirement for full disclosure when entering into the contract. But once the contract comes into existence, the insurer has taken on liability for insurable events for the 12 months duration of the contract, based on their assessment of a full and fair disclosure of the facts as they existed at the time of entering into the contract - including an assessment of the risk that those facts might change over the period of insurance.Yes, duty of disclosure arises as soon as any change occurs.
Again it depends. If you want to change the basis of the contract, eg a different model vehicle, additional drivers, different category of use, etc, you must notify this or you won't be covered for the changes.What I was saying above is that duty extends to any of the details that were provided when getting a quote.
I only have RSA, Allianz and Aviva policies here, all call out that you must disclose changes throughout the policy term.Of course, if there's a term in the contract requiring subsequent disclosure, and there often is for health issues, that's a different matter. But, absent such a term, I don't see how a disclosure requirement arises.
I only have RSA, Allianz and Aviva policies here, all call out that you must disclose changes throughout the policy term.
I think that anyone with a titter of wit might figure out (or "reasonably envisage") that a significant cohort of motorists will pick up points in any given period!But does the fact that in order to pick up penalty points you must have broken one of the ROTR and therefore changed your "envisaged" risk level in the eyes of the insurance company!!
Now I don't agree with an insurance company penalizing you for one infraction of the ROTR but two or three in a short period of time definitely shows a lack of responsibility and/or adherence to the ROTR and should definitely be reflected in your risk level and premium
Fair enough. Depends on how "change" is defined though. This is from my Allianz renewal notice:
'Any clause of the policy which refers to a "material change" will be interpreted as referring to changes that take the risk outside that which was reasonably envisaged by both you and us when the policy sale was concluded.'
Still not 100% clear, but it's a long way short of unambiguously saying you most disclose penalty points during the currency of the policy.
Duty of Disclosure of Material Facts
A material fact is anything which affects this insurance.
Duty of disclosure of a material fact continues throughout the life of the Policy.
...
If You are in any doubt as to whether a fact is material or not, You should contact Us for clarification.
You must tell Us immediately about any change which could affect Your Policy.
You must tell Us if:
1. You change Your Car
...
13. You or any driver has any motor prosecution pending, been convicted of a motor offence, had a driving licence suspended or had fixed penalty points applied.
I don't disagree. There's no wiggle room there because, and only because, it's specifically written into the policy document that you must tell them if you get penalty points!Allianz's current policy document contains:
I see no wiggle room there.
Agreed, it's just my experience that for quite a few years now, any policy that I've taken out has always contained such a clause. Note, you should never rely on the renewal notice for full terms, you must review the full policy document that's in effect at the time.My sole issue here is that absent such an explicit contractual term in the policy, there is no general duty to disclose points during the currency of the policy. (Obviously we all agree it must be disclosed at renewal.)