True, but one doesn’t justify the other.
Agreed.
Very true.
Yep, I agree with you there as well.
True, but one doesn’t justify the other.Exactly. A lot of people in this country - while they themselves are doing okay - are only too willing to bash those below them, with petty remarks about "oh they have mobile phones" or "they drive a car" or "they smoke" instead of looking at the class above where the real money goes (Seanie Fitzpatrick, etc.)
Agreed.I wondered how long it would be before these kind of 'arguements' came up. Sure, we all know career dole-ists. The problem with the current system is that for career dole-ists it's a lot of money per week. For those actively seeking a job it's certainly not.
Very true.We had something like 160,000 people on the dole during the boom. Why were they left on it? I'm all for helping people off it, but urinating on them isn't going to produce a good outcome. Several people on SW have paid taxes for years, so all they are getting back is a little bit of their own money.
Yep, I agree with you there as well.Last but not least, we have the 'Interview allowance'. This is available through CWO's, and amounts to €150. Who needs 150 quid to go to an interview? That should be split up into 3 installments of 50, with proof of attendance required in each case. There are umpteen ways to cut out waste - of which there is loads - in the system.
As for needing more staff to oversee all this, well, what was the Croke park agreement supposed to be for?
I don't see people on the dole as below me. According to this thread, many seem to be far better off. That, surely is the problem.Exactly. A lot of people in this country - while they themselves are doing okay - are only too willing to bash those below them, with petty remarks about "oh they have mobile phones" or "they drive a car" or "they smoke" instead of looking at the class above where the real money goes (Seanie Fitzpatrick, etc.)
Germany
JSA = 359 pm or 83 pw plus non-cash benefits
This is why we have no credibility in europe.
As long as the long term unemployed continue to enjoy benefits far in excess of those in europe and as long as we have a minimum wage higher than the countries who are being asked to lend us money, we will find it hard to get a sympathetic ear in europe.
No argument can make a long term unemployed person on €188 p.w. with a medical card and rent subsidy in Ireland worse off than their german counterpart.
It would be very nice to continue to have minimums we have in terms of social welfare. But if protecting some of those minimums is preventing us from making a case to europe to retain our corporation tax levels or preventing us from forcing burden sharing with those who funded the banks, we are setting the country up to have a lot more people living on a lot less than the current minimum.
Yep, people on high incomes shouldn't get childrens allowance.
Depends what you call high incomes.
A combined income of 150-200K maybe, but how many people are on this.
If they set the cut-off point too low it will be a further barrier to getting people back to work. It would require a good salary to encourage someone to give up 7.5K, using your example.
It will turn out to be a pyrrhic victory if the hotels in question go bust.I really think that we cannot pay any attention to what employers say. We saw the reaction of O Callaghan Hotels to the cut in minimum wage. At least those workers had a union to defend them.
Agreed but if a high minimum wage and welfare rates relative to our European competitors is contributing to us staying in the mess then we should reduce it.It wasn't the social welfare receipients that landed us in the mess we are in
Good for him. Maybe that's how he's now able to advertise jobs worth 28k.The letter writer, David Lawlor, gets a nice article today.
This is someone who seems au fait with [broken link removed]in the promotion of his business.
If they do, then saving E40 per member of the housekeeping staff per week isn't gonna make much difference. It'll be poor decisions on a greater scale that will have brought them to this point in the first place.It will turn out to be a pyrrhic victory if the hotels in question go bust.
I agree that it was the bigger decisions that got them to this point but, again, cutting wages may be necessary to get them out of the hole they are in. It’s not just the €40 per week that’s saved, it’s the fact that their wage scale now starts at a lower level so all higher wages can be lowered accordingly for future hires.If they do, then saving E40 per member of the housekeeping staff per week isn't gonna make much difference. It'll be poor decisions on a greater scale that will have brought them to this point in the first place.
I'm not sure what you men by sourness. I called bs on this letter from the first post.Good for him. Maybe that's how he's now able to advertise jobs worth 28k.
I detect a note of sourness in your post, however.
First,the businessman offered the position to a Romanian national who has been living here for a number of years. But he quit after just one day.
"He's married, with kids, and is renting," said Mr Lawlor, adding that the man qualifies for multiple types of social welfare.
"He'd been working for a rival but had been let go two years ago. He started on the Tuesday and on the Wednesday he said he felt he was entitled to more money.
"He said he'd get more money on the dole."
Mr Lawlor had pointed out to the man that he could also earn overtime, at one-and-a-half times the rate, as well as have the use of a company van for incidental personal use.
"A lot of these guys are handy, so they do nixers; they have that on top of their dole."
The following week Mr Lawlor offered the job to a Filipino national, who, he said, had the skills required and had done the "best ever interview". He had been living here for several years, had four children and drove an "06 or 07 car".
I find it bizarre that a lot of Irish people will not take entry level rolls here but are happy to work in a shop in Auz
And in Germany when you get to the Hartz IV stage you also have to work in order to get full entitlements. This creates (a) an incentive to look for and accept any work that pays more and (b) gives unskilled people the chance of some work experience."The most basic rate of welfare payment for the long-term unemployed amounts to €188 weekly in Ireland. That is equivalent to €819monthly.The most basic rate of welfare payment for the long-term unemployed in Germany (Hartz IV) amounts to €359 monthly, less than 45 per cent of the Irish rate."
But isn't a situation where your first pick, who would probably be the best suited, is not working for you because social welfare entitlements are essentially competing with you, rather than your competitors, worth reporting on?I wouldn't spend 1 second worrying about the first person and their reasons. I'd get on with running my business, not sending letters to the Times.
This is a very good point. If there is no job for your skill set then you should do something about your skill set and not look to government to do something about getting you a job.I think part of what's wrong is the belief that it's the function of the State to ensure that jobs are provided to match available skills.
Seanie and his cronies are just one example. There are far more people on high incomes that have that income because of their skills, work ethic, risk taking, entrepreneurial ability, etc. It is far more common for a public call on "taxing the rich" so that they pay their fair share, than for the public to call on bringing social welfare payments to more reasonable levels.Exactly. A lot of people in this country - while they themselves are doing okay - are only too willing to bash those below them, with petty remarks about "oh they have mobile phones" or "they drive a car" or "they smoke" instead of looking at the class above where the real money goes (Seanie Fitzpatrick, etc.)
I would rather ask why were they not kicked off the dole. How can 160,000 claim unemployment when over 200,000 eastern Europeans arrived here and got work?We had something like 160,000 people on the dole during the boom. Why were they left on it? I'm all for helping people off it, but urinating on them isn't going to produce a good outcome. Several people on SW have paid taxes for years, so all they are getting back is a little bit of their own money.
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