Selling and rebuying an ETF which has no profit or loss to reset the 8 years' deemed disposal

And also why were they unable to then classify all etfs as falling under exit tax and deemed disposal, they also were not able to do that, they merely left it up to investors themselves to decide?
My suspicion is that the 1 trillion in etfs domiciled in Ireland mostly from US is the real reason they were not able to bring them all under exit tax.
It's a wonder trump hasn't started on about that yet?
 
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Not sure if I'm reading this right so Joe do you think that it's the ETFs Americans purchased domiciled here in Ireland are the only ETFs that are free from the deemed disposal? It's shocking that we are a tax haven for the world expect for the Irish people themselves.
 
Finance said:
I think the uncertainty is definitely a chess move by the government/revenue.
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False. Uncertainty actually reduces the amount of tax collected, especially in this situation.
This complex and uncertain setup means huge numbers of people avoid investing in ET Funds.
And uncertainty also allows a proportion of people to (knowingly or unknowingly) avoid paying this tax when it is actually due.

It's more an example of the Govt tipping over the board.
 
@AJAM "Not True. Their role is to collect taxes that are actually due.
It's up to the government set tax rates"

I didn't mention tax rates, which aren't the issue here.

Their role is to maximise the collection of taxes that they deem to be due.

If you doubt me, check how the headline items on all their recent annual reports refer to their efforts to maximise tax collection.

Spreading otherwise unnecessary FUD among the taxpaying population is merely a means to that end.
 
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Finance said:
Not sure if I'm reading this right so Joe do you think that it's the ETFs Americans purchased domiciled here in Ireland are the only ETFs that are free from the deemed disposal
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Nobody else has to pay deemed disposal not European or us investors in etfs , it only applies to Irish residents. In fact us residents pay less tax on Irish domiciled etfs than they do on US domiciled ones because of double taxation treaty between Ireland and US, of course only on dividends and disposals.

However even though there is 1 trilion now invested in Irish domiciled etfs they were always European domiciled and taxed under deemed disposal tax (only for Irish residents)
However under the previous clarification, Irish investors were going out of their way to buy us domiciled etfs, because they were still taxed like normal shares , nk deemed disposal malarkey. Then revenue removed this clarification in 2021 but mysteriously were still not able to say that us domiciled etfs were now fully included in deemed disposal taxation, it was left to investors to decide themselves, very strange
 
Are financial advisors offering some kind of sureties to their customers? Also, has anyone on here already been charged the deemed disposal? If so on what ETFs?
 
Finance said:
It's shocking that we are a tax haven for the world expect for the Irish people themselves.
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I'm surprised that you're shocked at this given the amount of corporate financial engineering that we have facilitated over the past few decades!
 
Finance said:
Are financial advisors offering some kind of sureties to their customers? Also, has anyone on here already been charged the deemed disposal? If so on what ETFs?
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Its a self declared tax, so you have to declare at the 8 year anniversary of purchase of the ETF , the deemed disposal tax, basically 41% of the capital gains should be paid as the "deemed disposal" of that ETF .
However I don't believe it has ever been enforced by revenue during an audit.
 
joe sod said:
Its a self declared tax, so you have to declare at the 8 year anniversary of purchase of the ETF , the deemed disposal tax, basically 41% of the capital gains should be paid as the "deemed disposal" of that ETF .
However I don't believe it has ever been enforced by revenue during an audit.
Click to expand...

But the possibility is there due to the ambiguous nature of revenue's view on ETFs.
 
T McGibney said:
Spreading otherwise unnecessary FUD among the taxpaying population is merely a means to that end.
Click to expand...

I think you might be overestimating Revenue here - I don't think the uncertainty is some grand plan. Which is more likely, that the revenue are maliciously making it unclear what tax is owed in order to collect more? or that they are bogged down in years of bureaucratic inertia? I know what I'm going for - for me it's what happens when
  • Legislation gets Frankensteined together: Nobody designed our ETF tax system from scratch. The 8-year deemed disposal rule comes from 1990s life insurance rules. They just kept bolting bits on and tweaking things when ETFs became popular and now we've ended up with this monster of a system.
  • Revenue lacks investment expertise: They're tax experts, not investment pros. Not sure they have enough people who deeply understand how investment products work in practice.
  • No political pressure to fix it: Without pressure from above, Revenue haven't prioritised fixing it. Up until now this has been a niche issue affecting relatively few voters but it does seem to be changing - fingers crossed for Budget 2026!
 
@Shannb1 you might have a point here but the ugly reality is that the tax system is absolutely riddled with similar grey areas and uncertainties. Look for example at the Jesuitical nonsense with which they have periodically tortured us with in relation to directors' motor expenses.

And their repeated u-turns over what expenditures qualified for R&D Tax Credit, some of which they attempted to apply retrospectively.
 
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