Rip Off Republic - Episode #2 - review

[terrysgirl33]

Well, the example of trying to shop around for a pint was funny!!

I did enjoy the show, I just came away feeling like I heard nothing new. I don't like pub prices, and don't go to them any more. I know what you mean about the publicans having their own (very efficiant) organisation, the program just seemed a bit boring with only one side being presented, a good row would have livened it up!

I'm 'working' on solutions myself, but a few suggestions would have been nice... Though I realise that wasn't the point of the show...

 

[daltonr]

I think the confusion about the markup on the bottle of wine is Eddie's Fault (or his fact checkers). I can see where he got his figures from. The selling price of the Wine (Excluding VAT - €19.83) is roughly 3.4 times (340%) the cost.

Brendan's point is that the profit €13.98 is only about 2.4 times (240%) the cost. I.e. if I sell something for twice the price I buy it Eddie would say my Markup is 200% when it's only 100%.

A fairly simple and silly mistake ot make, but not one I'm concerned about. The lobby groups and vested interests are equally capable and willing of bending figures often more intentionally and more misleadingly. I'm more concerned with the overall thrust and effect of the show and I think it's excellent.

For a good description of how *experts* and lobbly groups misread or misrepresent *Facts* check out Freakonomics by Stephen Levitt.

If Eddit is taking certain liberties intentionally or otherwise it's regrettable because there's enough in the facts to be shocking without glossing it. But at least in this instance public opinion is being driven in a good direction by such tactics.

-Rd

 

[jem]

I think the confusion about the markup on the bottle of wine is Eddie's Fault (or his fact checkers). I can see where he got his figures from. The selling price of the Wine (Excluding VAT - €19.83) is roughly 3.4 times (340%) the cost.

Brendan's point is that the profit €13.98 is only about 2.4 times (240%) the cost. I.e. if I sell something for twice the price I buy it Eddie would say my Markup is 200% when it's only 100%.

A fairly simple and silly mistake ot make, but not one I'm concerned about.

but It is a major mistake and majes a major difference say an item costing €100 the sale price with 100% mk up is €200 while @200% it is €300 a dam big difference.

If Eddit is taking certain liberties intentionally or otherwise it's regrettable because there's enough in the facts to be shocking without glossing it. But at least in this instance public opinion is being driven in a good direction by such tactics.

-Rd

How is it good for public opinion being driven my misleading facts. This is simply wrong. The end justifies the means etc etc.
I have said it before and I will say it again there is no such thing as Rip off Ireland, some prices are too high, but the market dictates the price. The only way to reduce prices is to reduce costs, the bigest cost to most business is wages. Hand up how many are willing to take a pay cut to bring down prices. What no hands!!!!

 

[ClubMan]

Brendan's point is that the profit €13.98 is only about 2.4 times (240%) the cost. I.e. if I sell something for twice the price I buy it Eddie would say my Markup is 200% when it's only 100%.

A fairly simple and silly mistake ot make

Surely not a mistake that an [broken link removed] should make though?!

 

[daltonr]

I have said it before and I will say it again there is no such thing as Rip off Ireland, some prices are too high, but the market dictates the price.

you are just plain wrong. the cost of living has increased without an equivalent increase in quality of life. the result is that other countries represent better value. Ireland as a whole is poor value for money. that's what is meant by ripoff ireland.

incidently i think tax and rates etc runs a very close second in terms of costs and provides far less return on investment than salaries.

for what it's worth i've dropped my take home pay in each of the last 2 years and will again this year.

there is very bad cycle of inflation being used to justify wage increases which in turn drives inflation. but i don't think it's fair to lay all the blame for ripoff ireland on wages.

the fact is the government is as guilty or more guilty through their policies.

-rd

 

[soc]

I thought that it was interesting that there were no ad breaks whatsoever in the program... That's the first time I've seen that on an RTE channel.

-soc

 

[jem]

you are just plain wrong. the cost of living has increased without an equivalent increase in quality of life. the result is that other countries represent better value. Ireland as a whole is poor value for money. that's what is meant by ripoff ireland.

Sorry rd , I am not wrong. the standard of living now as opposed to say 1984 for example. Inflation was running at 10.1 %, Single Income tax rates were as follows :
first £4000@35%,
next £2000@45%
next £2000@55%
next £2000@60%
balance@65%

Unemployment stood at 17%
immigration was the order of the day.
hospital closures were on the horison, most people had sfa.
Ireland now is booming, how many family's had 2 cars then as opposed to now, how many went on one holiday out of the country , as opposed to how many go on mulitple holidays.
I could go on an on.
The standard of living in the past 21 years has risen dramatically.
It is time to stop the rants Rd, I for one am geting very tired of it. If Ireland is sooooo bad and the grass is so green elsewheree move. Just lay off the rants.

 

[ClubMan]

immigration was the order of the day.

I presume you mean emigration?

 

[podgerodge]

What really annoys me though (sorry if this is OT, but I think it has some relevance) is when pubs put up their prices for certain events, the most obvious example is for the Six Nations, when Ingerland come to Dublin. Now, I know that pubs can charge whatever they want as long as they display their prices, but this is profiteering at its worst/best. How can you justify raising prices when demand is higher, and you know you are going to have a bumper day as you will sell so much in quantity terms anyway?

But no-one argues when hotels change room rates based on seasonal demand?

 

[Jister]

Or now when I am paying €187 for car insurance, let them keep charging kids €2000 as long as mine stays low forever

 

[Humpback]

But no-one argues when hotels change room rates based on seasonal demand?

Or when Ryanair jack up flights to Liverpool when the local teams play, or to Toulouse when Munster are playing.

Supply and demand!!! There's nothing wrong with that at all. As long as if there are rules to follow with regards to pricing displays, and therefore customers are aware of such things, then fine. We, as customers, then have the choice to pay or not.

 

[Magoo]

The only way to reduce prices is to reduce costs

But if you're operating in a monopoly or any other restricted market, the costs are less relevant. In these cases, your prices are based on the limit to which people will go. Costs plus a reasonable margin would be acceptable.

In country towns, ther are a lot more pubs per head of population and the owners make good, if unspectaclar, profits. This is how it should be.

 

[Noor77]

There are definitely rip-offs out there...but a lot of the time we don't help ourselves by our actions. If you think a pub charges too much for drinks, dont go to it; if your local political representative has vested interests in everything from the supermarket to the golfcourse, don't vote for them - and tell them why you are not going to! People power can achieve an awful lot, sometimes I think we forget this

 

[shnaek]

"I have said it before and I will say it again there is no such thing as Rip off Ireland, some prices are too high, but the market dictates the price."

The market is distorted in Ireland by lack of competition. I think that is one of the things Eddie was trying to highlight. The power to make decisions is in the hands of the small few. Every town has it's three or four controlling businesspoeple/politicians. In the town I am from the main property developer is also one of the big names in politics. Look at the case with the pub in Mountmellick on last nights show.

The market may dictate the proce in Ireland, but it is not a free market. And certainly government have a big hand in dictating some prices (eg cars) so I have to go with my belief that many things in Ireland are indeed a rip off.

 

[elcato]

Or when Ryanair jack up flights to Liverpool when the local teams play, or to Toulouse when Munster are playing.

But no-one argues when hotels change room rates based on seasonal demand?

Sorry but not the same here guys. When you book a hotel or flight you are aware before travel of the deal. On the other hand if you suddenly leave a pub in town or leave Navan and go to Lansdowne road you are not aware of price hiking till its too late to turn back or indeed most tourists/non locals would not even be aware that the prices have just been hicked up for the day anyway.
As an aside I have to laugh at people who represent the tourist industry who say the numbers are down this year and still charge way too much for a room. My heart also bleeds for these guys. Maybe the argument should read rip off Irish .......

 

[legend99]

Lads, all i can say is that the program comes accross as a program for kids who are being talked down to by a lofty school teacher.
Bottom line, the guy isn't a great TV presenter. I felt compelled to switch off the TV last night it got so annoying.


Dumbest moment of the program. The Nun who runs the treatment centre saying that Dublin was the biggest catchment area for people who had drink issues. the greater Dublin area probably has half the population of the country at this stage....its not exactly a shocker to see the biggest population centre by far ,providing the biggest number of people to a treatment program!

i should say, i find him not so bad on say radio programs where he is being controlled by the interviewer(more or less). But I do think hes suffering a bit of pop staritis....next thing he'll be bleaching the hair.

Next, with the public profile and hero status he has for a lot of people now, people will be collecting hankies that he has dabbed his forehead with...

 

[Carpenter]

I think that some of this is very harsh, he has probably done more to heighten the Irish consumer's awareness of consumer issues than, say Dermot Jewell or Mary (Momma!) Harney et al. Surely this is no bad thing? I don't think it is EH intention to be the nominated spokesperson or champion for the consumer; he saw an important issue which wasn't being addressed by the most accessible meda avenue available, TV and he decided to do something about it. It is certainly more worthwhile (even as a TV programme only) than say You're a Star etc! It might border on the pedantic at times but I would like to see how the show develops over the coming weeks.

 

[daltonr]

Sorry rd , I am not wrong. the standard of living now as opposed to say 1984 for example.

Jem

Why do you and Brendan insist on comparing Ireland of today with Ireland of the 80's? Compare Ireland of today with the rest of the world today. Your logic would claim that Ireland has a state of the art Health Service because compared to Healthcare 100 years ago it's great. It's a nonsense.

If your claims of no Rip-off can't stand up to scrutiny in the world we currently live in then going back 20 years to find somewhere worse to compare with really weakens your argument. Why not go back 100 years and the Ireland of today would be Utopia?

You and the Other Mods (in the main) are in a tiny minority of claiming that there is no Rip-Off Ireland. This seems to be because of a very narrow definition of what constitutes a rip-off (I.e. If the prices are in plain view you can't by definition be ripped off).

I've stated my definition of Rip-Off Ireland. Higher Cost of Living with lower quality of life than other comparible countries. I've stated why I believe this to be the case to much intervention and downright stupid intervention by government.

Of course Ireland has a higher standard of Living than Ireland of the 1980's I have never ever even once claimed that Ireland was a better place at any time in it's past.

It is time to stop the rants Rd, I for one am geting very tired of it. If Ireland is sooooo bad and the grass is so green elsewheree move. Just lay off the rants.

It's absolutely not time to stop. I've been consistently saying the same thing for two years and RTE have finally gotten around to airing a show that says pretty much the same thing. Sorry if I bored you by being ahead of the curve.

Just because you don't like your precious government being criticised doesn't mean the criticisms aren't valid.

How about instead of telling me to be quiet you address the substance of the argument instead of dragging us back to 1984 with meaningless comparisons?

Rip-Off Ireland is: Higher Cost of Living, Poor Value for money. Caused by our governments over focus on economy and under focus on society.

-Rd

 

[Noor77]

I felt compelled to switch off the TV last night it got so annoying.

Why didn't you turn it off then?

I think we should try and move away from the format and style of the programme (which I am none too enamoured of either, and I was in the audience for one episode) and concentrate on the message it conveys. I think as a nation we are generally quite happy to complain about being ripped off but not very motivated or mobilised when it comes to doing something about this highly problematic area. We need to start boycotting products and services that we feel are ripping us off. I for one would not drink in a pub that was owned by a political representative, nor would I shop in a shop owned by one.

 

[CCOVICH]

Or when Ryanair jack up flights to Liverpool when the local teams play, or to Toulouse when Munster are playing.

I, for one, avoid flying at peak times to avoid paying over the odds. Ditto for hotels in high season. Why would I pay a higher price for the same service?

Supply and demand!!! There's nothing wrong with that at all. As long as if there are rules to follow with regards to pricing displays, and therefore customers are aware of such things, then fine. We, as customers, then have the choice to pay or not.

I think there is something wrong with it-like I said before it's profiteering. Say you're a tourist, or god forbid, you are one of the few Irish people lucky enough to get a ticket for a Six Nations match. Where would you go before the match-Quinns in Drumcondra or Smyths in Ballsbridge? You would more than likely go to Smyths in Ballsbridge, wouldn't you? So you go to Smyths. You walk in. The price list is clearly displayed (I know, that's a bit of an assumption....), and to your amazement, the price of a pint is 30c higher than it was less than 48 hours ago in the same place. What do you do? For the weekend that's in it, you would really like to have a few pints and a bit of craic with your mates, but don't really feel like a pint today is worth more than a pint last week, or than a pint will cost on Monday morning. You can:
(a) Pay the barman €5.10 for a warm plastic tumbler of beer.
(b) Jump in a taxi, head over to Quinns and get your pint for €4.70. You can then get a taxi back to Landsdowne for the game (p.s. you can't get the DART because of some damn strike). Funny though, there's not much happening in Quinns, nobody in there seems too interested in the game, it's a bit dead really.
(c) Forget the pint. Just go to the ground, take your seat, watch the match, and go straight home. Nobody is going to take advantage of someone as smart as you.

So RDJ (and anyone likeminded), if (c) is your solution, fine. We're not talking about feckin' bottles of Kristal here, just a pint. The same crap the pub sells every other day, but today is different. Today pub owner will make more money than any other day in the year (bar New Years' eve maybe), but why should they not strive to make even more? That's the free market I guess, fair enough.

God help this country if we ever go to war. I dread to think how retailers would react to rationing and shortages. (Of course they would raise their prices, but by how much?)