I simply don't see that happening here. I may be wrong but privatisation of the hospitals for example in say the enxt 10 years...with 2 years more of this ineffectual Govt, then FF getting back in for a few more years. Simply won't happen.
Ratio of administrators to consultants in the HSE is 6.2 to 1
- Thread starter Brendan Burgess
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How can you say Unions are not the problem!!! Why do you think the 'gates' allowance is still in place? What do you think would happen if Mgmt tried to take it away?
Great. Remember this is anonymous. What was your performance vs. corporate targets, 3.5% absences and 100% certification for all sickness. How does your performance compare with the averages in your staff group?
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jjm
Guest
We were promised by the main party in Government Before the 2011 general election Once elected they Would Take control back under the Minister for Health.It was Promised bye the Newly appointed Minister in 2011 .The same party is still the main government Party in power .The have held the Minister for health position All of this time.
I wish you were right Delboy but ask any seasoned campaigner working in the HSE hospital system at the moment and you'll soon know that our government has no interest whatsoever in improving the service and they are pining for the day when they can sell it off.
With respect guys, we are running down a blind alley regarding PPARS. We discussed it at length in previous threads. Forget about Gate Allowances etc which had nothing whatsoever to do with the failure of PPARS. The simple fact is that the project was screwed up and the government had ploughed 240M into it for nil result. They had to pull the plug. I'm not going to get into the blame game because we all have our thoughts and during the whole PPARS project lots of people went to ground within and without the HSE.
PPARS under different titles was installed in several government departments and semi state companies which worked despite allowances, amount grades etc. These are only a smokescreen for what I believe happened.
PPARS under different titles was installed in several government departments and semi state companies which worked despite allowances, amount grades etc. These are only a smokescreen for what I believe happened.
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jjm
Guest
We are not going down a blind alley regrading PPARS.People through there Government Need to get value for there money and see how it is spent.
becky said
I can now go back 12 Years and get all of my sick days in a matter of minutes.She also said there are parts of the Hse who to this day do not use the watered down verson .Why.It was a tool which allowed the Government To see how sections of the health service are ran.The 2 nd cath lab for Waterford would be a good example . Management need to be showing how good there Performance and absences levels along with showing the are getting the best use out of the cath lab they already have since it was installed.
becky said
I can now go back 12 Years and get all of my sick days in a matter of minutes.She also said there are parts of the Hse who to this day do not use the watered down verson .Why.It was a tool which allowed the Government To see how sections of the health service are ran.The 2 nd cath lab for Waterford would be a good example . Management need to be showing how good there Performance and absences levels along with showing the are getting the best use out of the cath lab they already have since it was installed.
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Sophrosyne
Registered User
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Leper,
I don’t I think anyone is trying to run down people who are doing a good job and I am not particularly advocating privatization.
As you say, many government departments and semi-state companies have embraced technology and modernized and streamlined their operations because they realized they had to in order to continue to exist.
If, for whatever reason, certain people in the HSE are clinging to an obsolete and wasteful modus operandi and obstinately resisting any moves to bring about 21st century efficiencies, including technology, then they should not be surprised if there is a decision to privatize.
They will have no one to blame but themselves.
I don’t I think anyone is trying to run down people who are doing a good job and I am not particularly advocating privatization.
As you say, many government departments and semi-state companies have embraced technology and modernized and streamlined their operations because they realized they had to in order to continue to exist.
If, for whatever reason, certain people in the HSE are clinging to an obsolete and wasteful modus operandi and obstinately resisting any moves to bring about 21st century efficiencies, including technology, then they should not be surprised if there is a decision to privatize.
They will have no one to blame but themselves.
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I mean this thread is going down a blind alley. In a previous extensive thread the PPARS debacle was debated extensively mainly by people who knew nothing of the cause of its failure and blatently defended those who were culpable. The whole project resulted in €240M being flushed down the toilet. €240M would build and kit out a huge new hospital from scratch.
No member of staff or management needs to go back 12 years for anybody's sick leave record. Four years is more relevant.
Question:- Was anybody sacked or taken to account for the debacle? And I include the private advisors too.
Under what legislation or authority do you think a minister can interfere with working practices in such a manner?
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jjm
Guest
For a start By highlighting them and requiring there removal before taxpayers money is used or wasted .There are lots of companies and I don't think the HSE is any different where work practices needed to changed and were changed. The people on the ground doing the work seen the need long before Management .They see it will change there life for the better .Becky post no 100 says it all .Looks like the were pushing an open door.The people on the ground are doing a good job the system is letting them down.
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Highlighting them? How does that change anything? Most of the waste is clear to anyone working in the health service, many attempts to date have been shot down by those within the system with vested interests in maintaining the status quo.
The suggestion that the minister could just cut funding to force improvement in efficiency is laughable. It's been tried multiple times, failing every time and when the hospitals start running out of money and deferring procedures or curtailing services, Joe Duffy's phone lines light up and the goverment are forced to write another cheque.
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jjm
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I think most people see through Joe Duffy.
I was highlighting 12 years as that's since we went live.
I agree 4 years is sufficient for the sick leave entitlement but going back further can be useful. I went back 5 years last year to see who got between Christmas and new year off as staff members felt they worked Christmas every year, PPAR's said otherwise.
Going back further is especially useful for superannuation who now can see what salary paid, point of scale, any allowances even the gate one (whatever that is).
I don't see where I referred to a watered down version. The west had to continue to use the old systems as the project was pulled. They had no choice.
I agree 4 years is sufficient for the sick leave entitlement but going back further can be useful. I went back 5 years last year to see who got between Christmas and new year off as staff members felt they worked Christmas every year, PPAR's said otherwise.
Going back further is especially useful for superannuation who now can see what salary paid, point of scale, any allowances even the gate one (whatever that is).
I don't see where I referred to a watered down version. The west had to continue to use the old systems as the project was pulled. They had no choice.
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jjm
Guest
Hi becky
You did not say watered down Version I said that)(.If it worked for most of the country why was the west not included.I would expect as it got rolled out and debugged It should have being easier to Implement in the West.
Trying to hang on to Political power by pulling strings and Parish pump Politics was the reason it was pulled not cost or Unions.There was no other reason to drop the ball .
You did not say watered down Version I said that)(.If it worked for most of the country why was the west not included.I would expect as it got rolled out and debugged It should have being easier to Implement in the West.
Trying to hang on to Political power by pulling strings and Parish pump Politics was the reason it was pulled not cost or Unions.There was no other reason to drop the ball .
So, let's summarise;
It's all the Ministers fault. It's those politicians, they are the problem.
Nurses and Doctors are all great. None of them are wasteful or greedy or dishonest. They are selfless people who would do it for nothing except that if they weren't well paid they couldn't attract and retain the right people. This is in no way contradictory.
The Management of hospitals are all useless, disinterested and wasteful. Unlike "Front Line Staff" they have no interest in patient care. If it wasn't for the Unions keeping an eye on things they would probably shoot babies and old people in order to save money.
The Unions are completely blameless in all of this. If only the government would do what Liam Doran says everything would be fine.
The reason the health service is such a mess is really a Machiavellian plot by the government to sell off the health service in its entirety. This is completely compatible with the concurrent accusation that the government is populist and stuffed with Parish Pump politicians, even though there is no public appetite for this to happen.
None of the people who work in the health service can suggest one thing to improve things except giving themselves a pay increase, reducing their hours and/or employing more of them. This should not surprise or perplex anyone after all, how could the people who work somewhere be able to see better ways of doing things?
It's all the Ministers fault. It's those politicians, they are the problem.
Nurses and Doctors are all great. None of them are wasteful or greedy or dishonest. They are selfless people who would do it for nothing except that if they weren't well paid they couldn't attract and retain the right people. This is in no way contradictory.
The Management of hospitals are all useless, disinterested and wasteful. Unlike "Front Line Staff" they have no interest in patient care. If it wasn't for the Unions keeping an eye on things they would probably shoot babies and old people in order to save money.
The Unions are completely blameless in all of this. If only the government would do what Liam Doran says everything would be fine.
The reason the health service is such a mess is really a Machiavellian plot by the government to sell off the health service in its entirety. This is completely compatible with the concurrent accusation that the government is populist and stuffed with Parish Pump politicians, even though there is no public appetite for this to happen.
None of the people who work in the health service can suggest one thing to improve things except giving themselves a pay increase, reducing their hours and/or employing more of them. This should not surprise or perplex anyone after all, how could the people who work somewhere be able to see better ways of doing things?
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What bit did I get wrong Leper?. . . . just another union membership recruiting post from Purple . . . . Which of the Bearded Brotherhood are you? . . . . Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm!
... and it's Brethren, get it right!
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jjm
Guest
Liam is going through a purple patch.The other is going through a purple haze.