ptsb has sold a tranche of restructured mortgages

These are only NPLs in the technical sense of the word. The Central Bank rules say that split mortgages which do not make 100% provision for their warehouse are NPLs.

I don't think that ptsb wants to sell these. They are forced to sell them. They have plenty of capital, haven't they?

The last thing that they should be doing is selling profitable loans, whose profitability will increase over time.

Brendan
 
They don't. If they had excess capital they could have done what AIB did and fully provide for the warehoused portion and structure it in such a way (two separate loan docs maybe) that they were no longer NPLs.

At of June 2018 PTSB's CET1 (fully loaded) was 13.4% (minimum is 9.825% I think). That seems like they've got loads of headroom but their CET1 (FL) was 16% at Dec 2017. A big 3% fall in only 6 months.
PTSB's RWAs are increasing rapidly now as their risk modeling is being refined due to the ECB’s Targeted Review of Internal Models (TRIM). This added close to €600mm in RWAs in H1 2018 with a further €1.7bn expected to be added as TRIM progresses

So at H1 2018 you've got CET1 (FL) of €1,506mm versus €11,211 in RWAs = CET1(FL) ratio 13.4%.
Add €1,700mm in additional expected TRIM related RWAs brings you to €12,911mm RWAs versus CET1(FL) of €1,506 = CET1(FL) ratio of 11.7%.

Assume they took the €300mm provision on the Warehoused portion of these loans. This reduces RWAs by €300mm but also reduces capital by €300mm.
So you've now got €12,611mm in RWAs versus €1,206mm in CET1(FL) = CET1(FL) ratio of 9.56% which is barely above the minimum threshold. Undershoot on their TRIM expectations and well, there's a possible breach of the minimum threshold.

Edit to clarify - I'm not a professional Bank analyst so the above could be completely wrong
 
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Andy836 said:
Assume they took the €300mm provision on the Warehoused portion of these loans. This reduces RWAs by €300mm but also reduces capital by €300mm.
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Hi Andy

That is my point. They have already provided €400m against €1.3 billion of loans. They should not need to make a further €300m provision which is what the Central Bank wanted them to do. The only way they could avoid this was to sell the mortgages.

Brendan
 
Of course they need to take the extra €300mm (if that's the figure). The warehoused portion needs to be completely written off for the loans not to be considered NPLs.
Otherwise they are attributing a book value to a zero interest home loan to a Borrower with impaired credit.
The house might be worth more than the debt in most cases but that doesn't change the fact the loans are not performing.
 
Andy836 said:
he warehoused portion needs to be completely written off for the loans not to be considered NPLs.
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But that is the point at issue.
Of course a provision should be made. But I thought you and I had agreed that the existing provision is about right.

To write off a further €300m is crazy.

Brendan
 
Andy836 said:
PTSB are keeping 5% interest. The junior notes being issued.
Of course it was done at a discount. Most of these are split mortgages so there's a portion not accruing any cash flows (interest or principal repayments).
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And that 5% allows the newly established fund to avoid paying any tax as Pearse Doherty so excellently pursued the point at the Finance Committee last week. The aeticle includes the relevant clip from the committee

https://www.thejournal.ie/taoiseach...tgage-vehicle-not-to-pay-tax-4389095-Dec2018/
Last week, PTSB bank bosses confirmed that the ‘special purpose vehicle’ which more than 6,000 of its mortgages have been transferred to will be exempt from tax.
Click to expand...
 
Brendan Burgess said:
But that is the point at issue.
Of course a provision should be made. But I thought you and I had agreed that the existing provision is about right.

To write off a further €300m is crazy.

Brendan
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To write off an extra €300mm would be "prudent" in the jesuitical sense. Yes, the requirement is largely driven by accounting practices and regulatory definitions but either a loan is an NPL or it is not.

Just because you think there is hope value in the warehoused portion, does not mean the loan is now somehow performing. It is not performing. The same way part P&I and part interest loans are also not performing.

But the key point is, PTSB needs to reduce its NPLs. Whether you, I or anyone else likes it or not, that is the directive they've been given by the CBI & ECB. It only has two options, write-off the balance or sell the loan. They can't afford to write off the balance.
 
Delboy said:
And that 5% allows the newly established fund to avoid paying any tax as Pearse Doherty so excellently pursued the point at the Finance Committee last week. The article includes the relevant clip from the committee

https://www.thejournal.ie/taoiseach...tgage-vehicle-not-to-pay-tax-4389095-Dec2018/
Click to expand...

Excuse me while I get my financial information from a source other than Pearse Doherty. I like him & generally he means well, but he doesn't know what he's talking about.

The 5% risk retention rule for securitizations has been in place in Europe since 2011. It has nothing to do with tax, it was introduced to insure originators, sponsors etc all had skin in the game.

Come back to me when he explains what "profits" he's talking about. "Gross interest" paid on debt is not "profit".
 
RedOnion said:
Correct, but it this instance it seems to also have allowed a loophole to be exposed.
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Well calling it a "loophole" is debatable. Why would a gross interest payment be taxed? It is not "profit", it is effectively a revenue payment.

If you started taxing interest paid to noteholders in securitizations then they would cease to be viable structures for perfectly reasonable transactions.
 
Andy836 said:
either a loan is an NPL or it is not.
Click to expand...

Hi Andy

No, it is not a binary decision at all.

These are profitable loans and ptsb was forced to sell them because the ECB/CBI has a stupid definition.

Using the term "hope value" underestimates the value of these. They are loans secured on properties. In most cases they are in positive equity. In probably all cases they will be in positive equity in the near to medium term future. And, in most cases, the borrowers' finances will improve and they will be able to move money from the "hope value" warehouse to the main loan.

You are saying that they are worth nothing. I am saying that they are worth at least what they are on the books and that ptsb should not have been forced to sell them.

Brendan
 
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