One vote makes no difference

so-crates said:

What do I get out of it? Hmm, not being one given to bribes I tend to try avoid getting anything out of it at all.

How do I value the right and opportunity to vote? I would concur with shanegl, not only do I have a vote but that vote was gained by the efforts of those who had none, this indicates in the first instance that vote has intrinsic value.
I vote because my relevance is not tied into the herd but is intrinsic in who I am. I vote to express my opinion, irrespective of how many people it aligns with. I vote because my opinion is canvassed. I vote because it is a civic responsibility. I vote because I matter. You don't because you don't matter enough.

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Ok - so in a nutshell what you are saying is that you vote because you get a certain satisfaction out of partaking in teh whole thing.

That's fair enough.

I would be surprised though if everyone that votes also get this overwhelming feeling fo satisfaction of voting because our fporefathers died and all that.

Most peopel i reckon do it because they are sheep.
If they stood back for a second they would quickly realise it will have no impact.

They've been told to ridicule the man who says one vote makes no difference.

qwertyuiop said:

And it has nothing to do with teh importance of my vote like you seem to think.

The point i am making is a general one and about the importance of any one single vote.(WHich obviously does include my one vote as well as any other one vote)

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You refer repeatedly to your own vote, the inference isn't too arduous to draw.

Other votes are immaterial to you, you cannot cast them. The only vote you should be worrying about is that one little vote that you have. On a lighter note, haven't you ever read Terry Pratchett?

so-crates said:

You refer repeatedly to your own vote, the inference isn't too arduous to draw.

Other votes are immaterial to you, you cannot cast them. The only vote you should be worrying about is that one little vote that you have. On a lighter note, haven't you ever read Terry Pratchett?

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No - i've never read terry pratchett. Why ?

Most peopel i reckon do it because they are sheep.
If they stood back for a second they would quickly realise it will have no impact.

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It must keep you awake at night knowing that there's literally hundreds of thousands of incredibly stupid people out there getting incredible kicks from things you will never know, while deciding your fate.

shanegl said:

It must keep you awake at night knowing that there's literally hundreds of thousands of incredibly stupid people out there getting incredible kicks from things you will never know, while deciding your fate.

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I'd say the kicks of having to negotiate traffic etc. to cast a vote that will have no impact are pretty small.

Don't knock till you've tried it.

qwertyuiop said:

Ok - so in a nutshell what you are saying is that you vote because you get a certain satisfaction out of partaking in teh whole thing.

That's fair enough.

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Actually no, that was not what I said at all. Satisfaction is immaterial in voting, why would it be of any relevance? I referred to the evidence of value shown by the campaigns of individuals to obtain voting rights, the necessities of citizenship and the common courtesy of answering a question you are asked. Satisfaction was mentioned nowhere in what I said, you are ascribing to me motives I did not detail.

qwertyuiop said:

I would be surprised though if everyone that votes also get this overwhelming feeling fo satisfaction of voting because our fporefathers died and all that.

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What a silly statement! I never referred to dying forbears, I referred to active, civic forbears who campaigned for the vote to be made available to people without property or were of the wrong colour, or of the wrong religion or the wrong gender, etc. The vast majority of whom are dead but generally as a result of normal means.

qwertyuiop said:

Most peopel i reckon do it because they are sheep.
If they stood back for a second they would quickly realise it will have no impact.

They've been told to ridicule the man who says one vote makes no difference.

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So in other words, you despise those who chose to vote and ridicule the value they place on it? Anyone who votes has to register to vote then haul their arses off the couch, go to the polling station and place their mark for ephemeral posterity. Sheep aren't noted for either that competence or direction. I think you have a little bit of a sulk on there. You have decided your vote only matters if you can influence the outcome directly and visibly (hence the reason you would vote in a triumvirate) so in other words it is importance you seek not relevance.

qwertyuiop said:

No - i've never read terry pratchett. Why ?

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Just your reference to 1 in a million made me smile. As the wizards of the Unseen University are fond of saying 1-in-a-million chances come up nine times out of ten.

shanegl said:

It must keep you awake at night knowing that there's literally hundreds of thousands of incredibly stupid people out there getting incredible kicks from things you will never know, while deciding your fate.

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And he's keeping us awake with him shanegl! I reckon I am going to hit the leaba and leave him to ruminate on the pointlessness of washing cos you only get dirty again

so-crates said:

so in other words it is importance you seek not relevance.

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Quite the opposite in fact - wih a million voters my 1 vote becomes irrelevant and therefore not worth the hassle of hauling my ass down to teh polling station.

Then again - you could say importance and relevance are related in that if my vote was relevant (say in a poll of 3) then my vote would be important.

But teh overriding thing i would be seeking is relevance.

so-crates said:

And he's keeping us awake with him shanegl! I reckon I am going to hit the leaba and leave him to ruminate on the pointlessness of washing cos you only get dirty again

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Sounds good, I think I'll head too, money to be made on the morrow. Probably no point though, I'll only spend it.

Is this guy for real?? "I won't vote because MY 1 vote won't make a difference blah blah blah.....!!" What do you want us to say?? Get a life!

Yoltan said:

Is this guy for real?? "I won't vote because MY 1 vote won't make a difference blah blah blah.....!!" What do you want us to say?? Get a life!

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Well, this is called letting off steam Yoltan! It's ok to have opinions that you or others don't personally agree with, without being told to get a life
Nicola

What a ridiculous thread. qwertyuiop good luck with yerself, hope everything works out for ye and that yer opinion continues to remain unheard if that's what you so wish.

I don't subscribe to his view but Carlin is pretty funny regardless.

qwertyuiop said:

No - i've never read terry pratchett. Why ?

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You'd like the (benevolent) dictator of the main city state - he believes in the "One man, one vote" system. He is the one man, and he has the one vote.

qwertyuiop said:

I think we can all agree that teh difference betrween the winner and loser in an election being 1 vote is very slim - so i'm presuming it's obvioulsy not that.

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I find that having to vote (I view it as a civic responsibility - up there with not littering or obeying traffic laws and the like) concentrates my mind on the issue at hand. Since in the run up to vote I study the issues involved it would seem strange not to vote at the end of it. Like fervently reading the pre-match reports but opting not to bother actually watching the match as "it will make no difference".

If it helps I find that my vote will often carry ten or more "proxy votes" as many friends and family will ask me what way they "should vote" (i.e. what way am I going to vote and why).

As a hypothetical question, if we were to take the most recent Lisbon Treaty referendum, and I told you I would gladly give you €1 million if it passed, would you still opt not to vote on the same basis as you have already outlined?

shanegl said:

One request though: When everyone else makes the decision for you, don't complain if you don't agree with it.

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Agree 100%.

[broken link removed] and a good example would be

On November 8, 1923, members of the then recently -- formed revolutionary political party met to elect a leader in a Munich, Germany beer hall. By a majority of one vote they chose an ex-soldier named Adolph Hitler to become the Nazi Party leader.

or closer to home

In the 2002 General Election in Cork South-Central, Kathy Sinnott(Ind) lost by 6 votes to John Dennehy (FF) on the 10th count.
In the same General Election in Limerick West Dan Neville won by one Vote and Michael Finucane lost by one Vote

Quite the opposite in fact - wih a million voters my 1 vote becomes irrelevant and therefore not worth the hassle of hauling my ass down to teh polling station.

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Yeah, but if say 500,000 people have your attitude it makes a huge difference to the outcome of an election or referendum. So you trying to persuade the populus that they should adopt your attitude does have an impact if people start agreeing with you.