Don't forget all his EU Farm Subsidies payments !
New MD's salary in AIB
- Thread starter Mars39
- Start date
Don't forget all his EU Farm Subsidies payments !
S
sunrock
Guest
It wouldn`t surprise me if this had been staged....o dherty backing down to ONLY 500k to make Lenihan look good
500k is a huge amount of money .I can`t see why we couldn`t get someone to do it for 200 k or less... we have so many qualified graduates on the dole etc.
500k is a huge amount of money .I can`t see why we couldn`t get someone to do it for 200 k or less... we have so many qualified graduates on the dole etc.
P
pjmn
Guest
Must admit I have a grudging admiration for them - as yet again AIB pull the wool over all our eyes...
- what do AIB want ? Ans: their man at the helm.
- what do Government/taxpayer want? - anybody but an insider.
... so what happens....
a) AIB seek to install their 'insider' at a salary greater than the cap...
b) Country goes 'up in arms' - scandal - disgrace - can't be paid that much - Cabinet meet - and no - absolutely not - he can't have that salary...
... so what happens then....
AIB 'back down' and only pay their man E500k per annum....
Question:
Who got what they wanted?
I'd say it'll be a great party......
- what do AIB want ? Ans: their man at the helm.
- what do Government/taxpayer want? - anybody but an insider.
... so what happens....
a) AIB seek to install their 'insider' at a salary greater than the cap...
b) Country goes 'up in arms' - scandal - disgrace - can't be paid that much - Cabinet meet - and no - absolutely not - he can't have that salary...
... so what happens then....
AIB 'back down' and only pay their man E500k per annum....
Question:
Who got what they wanted?
I'd say it'll be a great party......
The 500k is only the cash part of the remuneration - there are other benefits that AIB have "declined to comment" on - shares, bonuses, pension etc.
Apparently no bonuses for 5 years and under strict conditions. If I were Colm Doherty I would have told them to stuff it and kept my 633K salary lower profile job - who would want the publicity, grief plus a lower salary?
Seriously? Qualified at what? Done a few finance modules so now qualified to run an international bank? I'm not surprised there were no suitably qualified (skills and experience) takers for the job - the going rate is a lot more than 500K even for similar jobs without the publicity, scrutiny and inevitable criticism that will come with the territory. A young banker on a good career path with a UK or European bank would be mad to take the job - they probably already get close to that salary on their current packages including bonuses - and have career paths which will lead them to better things in more respected institutions. Bottom line is that the intelligent, street-smart experienced bankers who would be suitable to fill this position aren't interested - and we're better off if we don't make do with a keen amateur who thinks they could give it a lash...
M
mercman
Guest
Orka + 1
WaterSprite
Registered User
- Messages
- 1,309
And another +1
Brendan Burgess
Founder
- Messages
- 53,772
I would love if a competent outsider was recruited to do the job for €500k.
But if one of the guys who turned around the Swedish banks some years ago offered to do the job for €2m a year + a performance bonus, I would be happy to pay that as well.
If the Minister appointed Dick Spring to represent the public interest, he should have listened to Dick Spring. He said that there was no external person available and I would strongly believe this. Many banks worldwide are recruiting and good candidates will be paid a lot more elsewhere. It would have been a disaster to appoint someone just because they were external and were prepared to work for €500k.
So they had to look at internal candidates. Colm Doherty has a great track record of making profits for AIB. He does share joint responsibility as a board member for the problems faced by AIB and every other Irish bank.
He is smart enough to learn from their mistakes. He also knows AIB well.
He is clearly the best candidate for the job and it didn't take Dick Spring long to recognize this.
Brendan
But if one of the guys who turned around the Swedish banks some years ago offered to do the job for €2m a year + a performance bonus, I would be happy to pay that as well.
If the Minister appointed Dick Spring to represent the public interest, he should have listened to Dick Spring. He said that there was no external person available and I would strongly believe this. Many banks worldwide are recruiting and good candidates will be paid a lot more elsewhere. It would have been a disaster to appoint someone just because they were external and were prepared to work for €500k.
So they had to look at internal candidates. Colm Doherty has a great track record of making profits for AIB. He does share joint responsibility as a board member for the problems faced by AIB and every other Irish bank.
He is smart enough to learn from their mistakes. He also knows AIB well.
He is clearly the best candidate for the job and it didn't take Dick Spring long to recognize this.
Brendan
At long last some sense has finally enetered this AAM debate. The priority must be to get AIB back onto a sound footing asap. If that happens then the State/taxpayers benefit (through its shareholding). Whilst €500k is a lot of money, frankly after the media campaign over recent months no sane external banker (of quality) would want the hassle.
Lets get on with the recovery.
Lets get on with the recovery.
Brendan Burgess
Founder
- Messages
- 53,772
Hi Putsch
In all my years, I have never heard of a salary being quoted in terms of per head employed. That really is a first. I have 10 employees, so I am only worth €70 per annum. I must get a job in An Post or the ESB - I think that they are our biggest employer.
There are very few well run banks worldwide. Barclays is one of them. Do you seriously think that anyone at or near the top of Barclays is going to leave a good bank like that and move to Ireland to try to restructure a "bad" bank? They would only consider it if they were given a huge incentive in terms a hugh salary and massive share options.
In all my years, I have never heard of a salary being quoted in terms of per head employed. That really is a first. I have 10 employees, so I am only worth €70 per annum. I must get a job in An Post or the ESB - I think that they are our biggest employer.
There are very few well run banks worldwide. Barclays is one of them. Do you seriously think that anyone at or near the top of Barclays is going to leave a good bank like that and move to Ireland to try to restructure a "bad" bank? They would only consider it if they were given a huge incentive in terms a hugh salary and massive share options.
S
sunrock
Guest
People must remember where the sky high salaries for our top bankers came from. Basically each irish bank owns large amount of shares in the other irish banks. All the top bankers move in the same social circles and get to vote on each others AGMs to make sure the status quo remains in case of disgruntled individual shareholders. Crucially they make up the remuneration committees that decide on their salaries and benefits.I am sure an average worker if in this position would award him/herself a sky high salary also.And these top bankers have been an abysmal failurein running the banks....they have done alright for themselves though!
I would like to ask what qualifications our top bankers had/have and what qualifications are deemed necessary. I know financial instruments can be complex, but these should be avoided.I for one refuse to believe that banking is rocket science and we have to pay 500k to attract a top man.What we need is a conservative ,prudent banker who is risk averse.There are plenty of buisness graduates and accountants here and in europe who could do a good job.
I would like to ask what qualifications our top bankers had/have and what qualifications are deemed necessary. I know financial instruments can be complex, but these should be avoided.I for one refuse to believe that banking is rocket science and we have to pay 500k to attract a top man.What we need is a conservative ,prudent banker who is risk averse.There are plenty of buisness graduates and accountants here and in europe who could do a good job.
€500k is a very good salary but as Brendan pointed out, it is not enough to attract someone from abroad to come in especially with regard to the amount of work required with AIB. The €500k cap only makes sense if the Government were willing to accept an internal candidate or someone within Ireland.
People are also saying that they could get someone without banking experience. Maybe in normal times you could but AIB are going to be doing a global roadshow sometime soon looking for capital. They do not want to be doing that with a banking novice as the head. The candidate chosen by AIB is actually well respected in Capital Markets and this increases the hopes that AIB will be able to raise private capital rether than rely on the taxpayer.
People are also saying that they could get someone without banking experience. Maybe in normal times you could but AIB are going to be doing a global roadshow sometime soon looking for capital. They do not want to be doing that with a banking novice as the head. The candidate chosen by AIB is actually well respected in Capital Markets and this increases the hopes that AIB will be able to raise private capital rether than rely on the taxpayer.
I agree with most of what you say with regard to banking circles in Ireland but banks function to to take risk so you can't have a risk averse bank. Its all about managing that risk and that is where the failures have been. There is no evidence that a non-banker would do any better
I'm not seriously suggesting that anyone should be paid strictly per employee.....its only one of many factors that go to make up a comparison but at least its less easily manipulated and it certainly does impact on the scale of responsibility.
It was just an effort to demonstrate that comparatively the 500K compares favorably with some international norms. The Barclays etc figures are $ rather than euro so when you convert them to euro and take into account the relatively much greater size the 500K is not at all bad for a small Bank operating in a few markets.
It was just an effort to demonstrate that comparatively the 500K compares favorably with some international norms. The Barclays etc figures are $ rather than euro so when you convert them to euro and take into account the relatively much greater size the 500K is not at all bad for a small Bank operating in a few markets.
Bob Diamond of Barclays earned something like €20 million in 2007. And he wasn't the highest paid. There was a guy called Jenkins or something who apparently put that figure to shame.
You can't compare BOI and AIB to banks like Barclays. Exectutive pay in Irish Banks was way too high for years but €500k is probably too low. Most Countries are now moving away from the idea of salary caps.
S
sunrock
Guest
Just seen on the news about the directors fees..Dick Spring and Alan Dukes....about100k each not bad money one would have to agree.Of course they have the difficult task of getting someone to be the M.D.of the bank for 500 k.
The sad bit is that it is we the taxpayers that are footing the bill.
The sad bit is that it is we the taxpayers that are footing the bill.
A bit OT, but genuinely curious - can I ask - why do you say this?
What I mean is, is there a specific reason or just a 'balance sheet' type observation?
(Take your time, I know you mightn't feel the best
)
Brendan Burgess
Founder
- Messages
- 53,772
Hi Caveat
I am equating "well run" with not having to be bailed out.
Most of the banks in Ireland and the UK had to be bailed out.
Most of the banks in America had to be bailed out.
I understand that Barclays didn't have to be bailed out.
Barclays and a few other banks stuck to very conservative lending.
Is this factually incorrect?
I am equating "well run" with not having to be bailed out.
Most of the banks in Ireland and the UK had to be bailed out.
Most of the banks in America had to be bailed out.
I understand that Barclays didn't have to be bailed out.
Barclays and a few other banks stuck to very conservative lending.
Is this factually incorrect?