My experience with installing SEAI grant aided solar PV

I like the posts above by Zenith et al. Great to reduce fossil dependency and if this also means less fumbling in the greasy til of the Saudi regime, so much the better...
But....
Can anyone comment on the detrimental aspect of lithium battery manufacture in terms of environmental damage in poor regions of the world viz. Congo and reports of child labour etc. Similar issue with EVs, are we exporting our problems to countries with less developed laws and protections.

This is a big drawback for me and allows greenwashing of the issues. Its a pity selling to grid isn't allowed which would remove need for batteries.

Perhaps Leo is right. If we are concerned about the environment, getting off our a*ses to reduce car dependency and proper building regs with improved insulation, eating local produce would be a good start.
 
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NR1028 said:
Hello, many thanks for the great information in this post. I'm currently gathering quotes for solar pv, a battery and an inverter. The roof can hold 18x340w panels and 1 quote includes a battery of 8.2wh. However as the battery is an expensive component does anyone have real world experience on how much of the battery gets charged during the winter months?

As both my wife and I work from home we can manage an even usage of electricity by sequential usage of appliances etc.during the day. In addition we have electric underfloor heating (downstairs) which is charged overnight using the night meter and night rate; this night meter could be an option to top up the battery during the winter months.
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Do you need planning for such an extensive array?
 
NR1028 said:
Hello, many thanks for the great information in this post. I'm currently gathering quotes for solar pv, a battery and an inverter. The roof can hold 18x340w panels and 1 quote includes a battery of 8.2wh. However as the battery is an expensive component does anyone have real world experience on how much of the battery gets charged during the winter months?

As both my wife and I work from home we can manage an even usage of electricity by sequential usage of appliances etc.during the day. In addition we have electric underfloor heating (downstairs) which is charged overnight using the night meter and night rate; this night meter could be an option to top up the battery during the winter months.
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From my experience the battery will get charged very little at all during the winter, few percent at best. FWIW I went with a 5kWh battery which is enough during the summer to get me through the night. From a purely financial perspective it only makes sense to get the smallest possible battery so you get the bigger grant. Personally I think the battery is great from a green/techy point of view and if I was doing it again I would go for the same 5kWh.

If you have an electric car the need for the battery is further reduced as you can charge it when there is excess generation.

Doing it again I would have put up more panels, I installed 14 but probably could have got 18 up there similar to you. The panels are so cheap it makes sense to put them up while you have somebody on the roof.
 
fidelcastro said:
I like the posts above by Zenith et al. Great to reduce fossil dependency and if this also means less fumbling in the greasy til of the Saudi regime, so much the better...
But....
Can anyone comment on the detrimental aspect of lithium battery manufacture in terms of environmental damage in poor regions of the world viz. Congo and reports of child labour etc. Similar issue with EVs, are we exporting our problems to countries with less developed laws and protections.

This is a big drawback for me and allows greenwashing of the issues. Its a pity selling to grid isn't allowed which would remove need for batteries.

Perhaps Leo is right. If we are concerned about the environment, getting off our a*ses to reduce car dependency and proper building regs with improved insulation, eating local produce would be a good start.
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There are a number of threads already on AAM where the topic of cobalt mining has been discussed. I think it would be better to keep the discussion there, as it has tended to destroy previous threads, taking them way off topic into frankly conspiracy theory territory.

Example here, a 13 page thread that spends little time discussing the actual topic of the thread :) - https://www.askaboutmoney.com/threads/electric-vehicles.212626
 
fidelcastro said:
Do you need planning for such an extensive array?
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This article covers some of the key points on planning permission for solar arrays - https://greennews.ie/landmark-planning-rooftop-solar/

The current planning rules say "The size of any such panel together with any other such panel previously placed on or within the said curtilage, shall not exceed 12 sq m or 50 per cent of the total roof area, whichever is the lesser;". However the above article refers to a case where a lady was allowed to keep her 21 panel array and this case is now generally quoted as the landmark/precedent on this question. My SEAI approved solar installer recommended well over the 12sqm and 50% and there were no questions asked when the solar grant was approved with this size listed. It is also widely believe that this limit will be increased under the new government.

So strictly speaking the 18 panels mentioned here may not be exempt from planning permission, but it is unlikely to be challenged by anybody and if it is precedent is on your side. If in doubt you can always just apply for permission.

Note there is also a limit to be classed as a microgenerator by the ESB of a 6kW system, worth watching out for. I'm not sure how this limit is considered if for example you put in a 5kW inverter but overprovision say 7/8kW of panels to try and get more production during the winter. Your system would be unable to generate more than 5kW of useable electricity, but not sure how it is assessed.
 
Thank you Zenith for the information & for the link to the article. It really would be great if a REFIT was brought in.
Fair dues to the plaintiff involved. She has done the the State some service to quote someone, unlike the half-wits employed by the same State!!
 
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Zenith63 said:
From my experience the battery will get charged very little at all during the winter, few percent at best. FWIW I went with a 5kWh battery which is enough during the summer to get me through the night. From a purely financial perspective it only makes sense to get the smallest possible battery so you get the bigger grant. Personally I think the battery is great from a green/techy point of view and if I was doing it again I would go for the same 5kWh.

If you have an electric car the need for the battery is further reduced as you can charge it when there is excess generation.

Doing it again I would have put up more panels, I installed 14 but probably could have got 18 up there similar to you. The panels are so cheap it makes sense to put them up while you have somebody on the roof.
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Many thanks Zenith63, really helps with the decision.
 
In my case this would definitely be financial investment, the Co2 reduction stuff is just a lovely bonus.

I spoke to someone who used to work in solar panel installation this week (no longer there so not trying to sell anything).

He suggested many companies abuse the grant, and in many cases one is better off ignoring the grant.

A number of people on the thread suggest installing as many panels as possible, he was more of the view to install what you need, pumping electricity into the grid for free is a total waste of investment, and still batteries drive up the costs and destroy the ROI.
 
presidenttttt said:
A number of people on the thread suggest installing as many panels as possible, he was more of the view to install what you need, pumping electricity into the grid for free is a total waste of investment
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The reason we say as many as possible is that in the middle of summer you’ll find say 7-8 panels would cover most of your usage for the day, but in the depths of winter you’d need maybe 30 to cover your usage. 14-15 tends to be about the max most people can fit on their roof, so we say put up the max you can (meaning that 14-15).

Yes large batteries and EDDI do not make purely financial sense right now.
 
Makes sense Zenith, I saw on boards many have suggested a smaller panel setup initially but then DIY adding of panels later, but I guess any saving in doing so is minimal and just hassle?
 
presidenttttt said:
Makes sense Zenith, I saw on boards many have suggested a smaller panel setup initially but then DIY adding of panels later, but I guess any saving in doing so is minimal and just hassle?
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I guess it depends on where you're installing the panels and how into DIY or managing contractors you are. I'm quite big into DIY but I definitely would not be heading onto my roof. I do a bit of electrical work as well, but I wouldn't dream of messing around with the solar side of things, it can be pumping through 3-4kW during the summer, not something I want to take chances with.

So my view is find a solar company who are good to work with and negotiate the price down as hard as you can. I cannot see the saving of doing it yourself offsetting the risk or hassle as you say, unless you're an electrician yourself...
 
If a property has a heat pump does it warrant more kW?

Initial comment from one installer prior to survey was "with a heat pump installed we would be looking at installing a 6.08kW solar PV array which is 16 x 380W Q-Cells solar PV panels. This accompanied with either 8.2kWh or 10.4kWh of battery storage depending on your overall requirements."
 
presidenttttt said:
If a property has a heat pump does it warrant more kW?

Initial comment from one installer prior to survey was "with a heat pump installed we would be looking at installing a 6.08kW solar PV array which is 16 x 380W Q-Cells solar PV panels. This accompanied with either 8.2kWh or 10.4kWh of battery storage depending on your overall requirements."
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Do you have a breakdown or estimate of heat pump use annualy? I think though, that you'll find the heatpump will be in operation when the sun tends not to be providing much energy
 
yildun said:
hi here is a solar PV quote i receive It seems ok but what do you think

2kW Solar PV + hot water starts at about €3,500 after the grant.
4kW Solar PV + 2.4kWh Battery storage at about €4,500 after the grant.
6kW Solar PV + 4.8kWh Battery storage at about €6,500 after the grant.

This include VAT and Instalation

thanks
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Hi,
Can i get details for someone doing solar panel 4kw system
 
Just FYI - Recently got a quote for 5.13kW, 13 panels roof installation, Inverter and 2x2.4kWh (4.8kWh) battery pack coming in at just over €12K.
 
We have had our South facing 3.5 KW solar array for a little over 1 year now.
10 Panels, plus the Hot Water Diverter cost us 6,432 less the 1800 grant so a total of 4,632 euro.

I'm really really happy with the system. Last year we actually produced more electricity than we used. Panels produced 3517 KWh over the course of the year, but the house actually used 571 KWh less than that. I've also found the hot water diverter great. Last week was the first time since May that the gas had to kick in to heat the water.

Like others I've calculated that the payback period is 10-12 years depending on use. The more you use the lower the payback time, so if you had an electric car, or if prices continue to rise the payback period is shorter. And payback period ignores the fact that your house is worth more after you add solar panels.

There is a university of Limerick study that show that property prices increase with better BER ratings. https://www.rte.ie/brainstorm/2021/...ices-postcodes-size-description-features-ber/
Our BER went from C1 to B1 with the addition of the panels. If I'm reading the study correctly that could translate into 4-5% increase in the value of the house, which would be more than the cost of the panels.
There are also quite a few US based studies that show the price of your house goes up when you add solar panels.
 
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