Mortgage broker fee

[leroy67]

Agree Palerider.

OP has used the brokers services and taken up time and effort and in my opinion should be paid for this.

Broker also should have explained that he is going to charge x amount for this which will be paid by product provider, if for some reason client doesn't proceed then client should make fair recompense to the broker for his time which should be an hourly rate set out in terms of business.

 

[mercman]

For a long time I have suggested a legal requirement for a simple, one-page document to be issued to every client

Liam, this is all very fine, but by your hoping does not place any further clarity on the issues mentioned. The problem is that all the Providers are getting away with pure fraud at its very best. We all thought when the new Financial Regulator was appointed, all of this would have been cleaned up. SFA has been done and they still get away with it.

So frankly the only suggestion, advice or opinion, I am able to offer is to any person wishing to invest in an Irish based fund or Pension in this country, that is run and controlled by Irish and Irish based providers, is to stop and think.

One would be better off going and spending the money rather than going through what I have had to for over six years. You are dealing with the Scum of society that are dealing with creating misfortune of others. And before somebody wishes to correct me, I will happily prove clear strong evidence in writing, where I have been forced to take huge losses by the greed of Irish Financial providers.

 

[Dr.Debt]

Liam, I wouldn't get too irritated about this. There are good guys out there and I'm pretty sure you are one of those.

What really brings your "industry" down is the vast armies of unqualified, unprofessional and dishonest people that are dispatched each weak by the large financial services houses, selling "products" that they neither understand or know about or have any real education or training in. This has been going on for years. The financial institutions hire "low cost" people to sell products to their own families or friends and are typically out of the job again within a couple of months. You may not like it but this is the face that the industry is putting out. People can only judge it by what they see and what they experience.

I came across a guy a few years ago who had previously worked all his life as a labourer on building sites. He had a cheap suit on and was selling financial products on behalf of a big name company. He didnt have one iota of a clue what he was doing. You cannot call this a professional approach and you cannot call it a Profession. These guys are motivated by money alone. Commission is what keeps food on the table for them. The whole thing smelled and smelled badly.

Sure, there are bad Solicitors and Accountants out there but at least they have all undergone a professional training, have all earned a recognised degree and are all heavily regulated by their own professional bodies.

The Financial Services Industry in Ireland is like a 1960s bungalow.No longer fit for purpose in the modern society. The good guys in that industry need to knock it down and put it back together again brick by brick. It is not a profession, Its an industry, no more than second hand car sales is not a profession. It could be but its not. It could be turned into a profession but it hasn't been done so far.

Eddie Hobbs took on the industry a number of years ago on the same issues that I'm speaking about above. He also was uncomfortable about what was going on beneath the surface.From top to bottom in that industry, they closed ranks on him and forced him out.

The minimum competency code issued by the Central bank a few years ago was a 1st step in the right direction but it seems that nothing "real" has changed so far, apart from some cosmetics.

 

[mercman]

The minimum competency code issued by the Central bank a few years ago was a 1st step in the right direction but it seems that nothing "real" has changed so far, apart from some cosmetics.

And do you honestly believe the Central Bank bods are competent ?? As I have written on another thread, I've seen a case where the CB revoked licenses for selling Financial product, and in one of the cases the person concerned is selling the same products for the same company under a different guise. In the other case the person concerned is working for a much more professional company as a 'New Business Manager'. The company did not know about the licence been revoked but when advised, they did nothing about it.

And when the CB are asked about it and why, they simply state that there's nothing they can do. So the powers who make the rules allow them to be broken by persons in which they have all the information about.

The lunatics are running the asylum.

 

[LDFerguson]

What really brings your "industry" down is the vast armies of unqualified, unprofessional and dishonest people that are dispatched each weak by the large financial services houses, selling "products" that they neither understand or know about or have any real education or training in. This has been going on for years. The financial institutions hire "low cost" people to sell products to their own families or friends and are typically out of the job again within a couple of months. You may not like it but this is the face that the industry is putting out. People can only judge it by what they see and what they experience.

I came across a guy a few years ago who had previously worked all his life as a labourer on building sites. He had a cheap suit on and was selling financial products on behalf of a big name company. He didnt have one iota of a clue what he was doing. You cannot call this a professional approach and you cannot call it a Profession. These guys are motivated by money alone. Commission is what keeps food on the table for them. The whole thing smelled and smelled badly.

I'd agree that there is a legacy issue that the industry recruited unsuitable people in the past when entry was virtually unregulated. But progress is being made. Ever-tightening regulation in recent years has forced many of the cowboys out of the business as they chose to move on to something less regulated. The most recent iteration of the Consumer Protection Code now makes it harder than ever to enter this area - as an employer if I want to take on anyone client-facing I have to go through a fair amount of due diligence - Garda checks, references, credit checks and professional qualifications (or progress towards them within a prescribed timeframe) are now mandatory.

I think we're slowly getting there.

Sure, there are bad Solicitors and Accountants out there but at least they have all undergone a professional training, have all earned a recognised degree and are all heavily regulated by their own professional bodies.

Although I agree that having relevant qualifications is necessary, I don't think that solicitors or accountants are any better as a group because they have a degree. Some of the most heinous rip-offs have been perpetrated by solicitors and accountants, all of whom had degrees and qualifications. I'd also argue that being regulated by one's own professional body is a bit too cosy. Brokers are regulated by a third party and, whatever has gone on in the past, in 2013 I'd be interested to see which of solicitors, accountants or brokers are the more heavily regulated.

Eddie Hobbs took on the industry a number of years ago on the same issues that I'm speaking about above. He also was uncomfortable about what was going on beneath the surface.From top to bottom in that industry, they closed ranks on him and forced him out.

You may know more about Eddie Hobbs than I do, but in what way did the industry force him out? I'm only going on public domain information but didn't he choose to pursue all his various other writing, journalist, fund promoter, TV show projects? A quick look at [broken link removed] suggests that his company FDM still acts as a broker, although apparently he also refers clients to another broker.

 

[Dr.Debt]

Its not for me to tell the Eddie Hobbs story except to say that he took on the whole industry some ten years ago when he wrote a very pragmatic account of how endowment mortgages were sold in this country. In fairness to him, the outcome was such that endowment mortgages came to a very sudden end after that report was released. I have heard several accounts after that how he was treated by the senior members of the Industry at that time and it wasn't very encouraging to say the least.

Eddie Hobbs has since been a regular and constant advocate of fee based financial advise and If I'm not mistaken he is not a fan of commission based products at all.

I believe the industry needs a lot more Eddie Hobbs.People who will stand up for change and improvement to legacy rip offs.

 

[Brendan Burgess]

Folks

I have deleted the ranting and abusive posts.

In future, please do not respond to these posts. Report such posts and they will be deleted.

Thanks

 

[ryaner]

I agree fully. For a long time I have suggested a legal requirement for a simple, one-page document to be issued to every client before they commit to any financial product that says: "If you invest €1.2 million in this product...

• the sales agent will receive €105,000 in commission in year one
• (if applicable) the sales agent will receive €A in ongoing commission in future years - table of renewal / trailer commission based on an assumed growth rate
• the product provider will receive €B in product charges in year one
• the product provider will receive €C in product charges in future years - table again
• the fund manager will receive €D for fund management in year one
• the fund manager will receive €E for fund management in future years - table again
• the Government will receive €F in levies, taxes etc.

There should be nothing else permitted to be on this page to keep it clear. All the charges must be listed in Euro. The client and the sales agent should be required to sign it.

One thing I'd add is two line box detailing the project growth after 10 years with, and without fees. Most people (including those who try to sell you these products) tend to be really shocked when the actual figures are pointed out.
1% a year might sound small but it makes a HUGE difference over the timeframe.