Live in landlord renting multiple rooms and tax/rtb implications

T McGibney said:
Really?

Does the average person know

1. how to properly craft a licence agreement?

2. what to do, and particularly what not to do, to ensure that their current or future licensees don't end up with tenancy rights?

If a solicitor is sufficiently incompetent not to "have one clue" about these questions, they won't last long in business.
Click to expand...
I think the vast majority of home owners are capable of renting a room. No need for a document, just a set of house rules and an email of how much rent, what is included, when due, and how it's to be paid.

Landlords in Ireland have no need of a lease either.
 
DK123 said:
Just one wee question.With regard to ["so dont be adding on esb bills etc"]does anyone know if the licensee has an option not to add on the esb bills,utility bills.etc.and thus the 14k refers to chargeing rent only without chargeing the licensee for esb utilities etc..Thanks.
Click to expand...
I think your question is can you charge 14K rent, and then change ESB. No is the answer.

You can charge 14K including ESB
You can charge 13K rent plus 1K ESB, but not a penny more.

So instead of being stupid about it, you charge rent including bills. So 14K gives you rent, bins, electric, gas.

Like this could not be simpler. Poster Gordanus above explained it. Also the revenue link I did explained it.
 
Bronte said:
I think the vast majority of home owners are capable of renting a room. No need for a document, just a set of house rules and an email of how much rent, what is included, when due, and how it's to be paid.

Landlords in Ireland have no need of a lease either.
Click to expand...
That doesn't address the the two-part question I posed.
 
Bronte said:
I think your question is can you charge 14K rent, and then change ESB. No is the answer.

You can charge 14K including ESB
You can charge 13K rent plus 1K ESB, but not a penny more.

So instead of being stupid about it, you charge rent including bills. So 14K gives you rent, bins, electric, gas.

Like this could not be simpler. Poster Gordanus above explained it. Also the revenue link I did explained it.
Click to expand...
ok. thanks Bronte
 
T McGibney said:
That doesn't address the the two-part question I posed.
Click to expand...
As far as I know this website is addressed to the average person. For general monetary advice, based on other ordinary peoples experiences. Including ordinary people giving advice who have been or are landlords/accountants/tenants/executors/solicitors/revenue employees.

If this website were otherwise then the answer to all question would be:

1) Pay a lawyer, pay an accountant pay an expert for legal and taxation advice.
2) Don't waste time on AAM looking for advise.

Now if I've got the point of this website wrong, then that needs to be made clear to users.
 
Bronte said:
As far as I know this website is addressed to the average person. For general monetary advice, based on other ordinary peoples experiences. Including ordinary people giving advice who have been or are landlords/accountants/tenants/executors/solicitors/revenue employees.

If this website were otherwise then the answer to all question would be:

1) Pay a lawyer, pay an accountant pay an expert for legal and taxation advice.
2) Don't waste time on AAM looking for advise.

Now if I've got the point of this website wrong, then that needs to be made clear to users.
Click to expand...
None of this is relevant to the proper crafting of a licence agreement.
It's been AAM policy for over 20 years that the site is not a substitute for professional advice.

That said, if someone want to expose themselves to possibly losing out on a valuable tax & RTB compliance exemption by skimping on paying €150 to a solicitor, that's their problem, but I'm genuinely mystified by your apparent objection to my recommendation that the OP should forearm themselves.

Also, your own claim that

Bronte said:
Landlords in Ireland have no need of a lease either.
Click to expand...
is borderline reckless, in my opinion.
 
Last edited:
DannyBoyD said:
Not needed (and in fact probably better without) where property owner is resident.

Sharers are guests and can be asked to leave at any time.
Click to expand...
Hasn't there been disagreement on this point here in the past?

Were I considering admitting paying sharers into my home, I think I'd prefer to know the actual legal position.
 
DannyBoyD said:
Anyone you invite into your home is a guest and can only remain with your permission. Once you withdraw that permission, they must leave.
Click to expand...
You've said that already and I'm not going to reheat an old argument, except to say again that anyone who's considering admitting guests to their home or financial gain should on balance benefit from legal advice, rather than rely on anonymous Internet hearsay.
 
T McGibney said:
None of this is relevant to the proper crafting of a licence agreement.
It's been AAM policy for over 20 years that the site is not a substitute for professional advice.

That said, if someone want to expose themselves to possibly losing out on a valuable tax & RTB compliance exemption by skimping on paying €150 to a solicitor, that's their problem, but I'm genuinely mystified by your apparent objection to my recommendation that the OP should forearm themselves.

Also, your own claim that


is borderline reckless, in my opinion.
Click to expand...
It's really not reckless, the Rent a Room scheme couldn't be more straight forward -
  1. Rent room/s in your home
  2. Stick to earning rental income under 14k and it's tax exempt
  3. The RTB remit does not extend to the Rent a Room Scheme where the landlord and the tenant share the same self-contained property (that text is taken directly from the RTB website)
  4. Calling a lodger that's renting a room in your home a tenent and yourself a landlord is not going to get you into trouble unless you are doing something criminal. People use those terms all the time for the sake of ease and they're terms used by the RTB, see point 3.

I've rented rooms in my home over the past 6 years and know that you don't even need a written agreement although I prefer one as you can put in writing rental payment/dates/house rules. I just googled "licensee agreement template ireland" downloaded it and edited to suit my own rules. As others have said, a tenent renting a room within your home really have no rights unfortunately and are only equal to paying guests who can be asked to leave at any time. Most of this informaton is available in the links provided already or you can check out citizens advice or the RTB websites.

The most important thing is choosing the right tenent for you. I would advise you to interview and get references, also make your house rules very clear and let them know if they are broken you will ask them to leave which you are well within your right to do.

Goodluck, it's really a great way to earn extra money if don't mind sharing lol (they call it house hacking in the states!)
 
Nicki Mac said:
It's really not reckless, the Rent a Room scheme couldn't be more straight forward -
  1. Rent room/s in your home
  2. Stick to earning rental income under 14k and it's tax exempt
  3. The RTB remit does not extend to the Rent a Room Scheme where the landlord and the tenant share the same self-contained property (that text is taken directly from the RTB website)
  4. Calling a lodger that's renting a room in your home a tenent and yourself a landlord is not going to get you into trouble unless you are doing something criminal. People use those terms all the time for the sake of ease and they're terms used by the RTB, see point 3.

I've rented rooms in my home over the past 6 years and know that you don't even need a written agreement although I prefer one as you can put in writing rental payment/dates/house rules. I just googled "licensee agreement template ireland" downloaded it and edited to suit my own rules. As others have said, a tenent renting a room within your home really have no rights unfortunately and are only equal to paying guests who can be asked to leave at any time. Most of this informaton is available in the links provided already or you can check out citizens advice or the RTB websites.

The most important thing is choosing the right tenent for you. I would advise you to interview and get references, also make your house rules very clear and let them know if they are broken you will ask them to leave which you are well within your right to do.

Goodluck, it's really a great way to earn extra money if don't mind sharing lol (they call it house hacking in the states!)
Click to expand...
Thank you but again we kind of know all that.

I can only repeat my own advice that

...anyone who's considering admitting guests to their home or financial gain should on balance benefit from legal advice, rather than rely on anonymous Internet hearsay.
Click to expand...

Forewarned is forearmed.
 
I really think it's a waste of money to seek legal advice on this as all the information is available online on citizens advice, RTB, and even Revenue's own website which are all official and great sources of information. However, if reassurance is still needed and to save you paying for it, contact FLAC (Free Legal Advice Centre) who can advise you further. Good luck
 
T McGibney said:
You've said that already and I'm not going to reheat an old argument, except to say again that anyone who's considering admitting guests to their home or financial gain should on balance benefit from legal advice, rather than rely on anonymous Internet hearsay.
Click to expand...
I can't think of any possible legal advise could you get that is not already outlined on this thread.
 
DannyBoyD said:
Indeed, but as a property owner involved in letting you are obliged to provide a lease or rent book.

Edit to add: above reference is to properties which are let out in full & not 'rent a room"
Click to expand...
I've never used a lease for any of my tenants. The rent book rule is a requirement but it's never been an issue in any RTB case I ever read about. It's a handy record for tenants who pay in cash. And then it's all clear what has been paid.
 
Bronte said:
I can't think of any possible legal advise could you get that is not already outlined on this thread.
Click to expand...
How to protect yourself against the possibility of a lodger
- refusing to leave
- engaging in difficult or antisocial behaviour
- claiming tenancy rights
- creating other unforeseen difficulty for the householder.

There are probably other potential issues. IANAL.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top