Key Post: car insurance - cheaper if female is a named driver?

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rainyday

Guest
Re: car insurance - cheaper for male/female as named driver

this is the only way some people can afford to have a car on the road
And by the same logic, if the only way I can afford to have a car on the road is drive with no insurance and baldy tyres, that is OK too?
 
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tracy

Guest
re

i have a commercial policy in my own name I had a small accident with a claim for €2500 so have lost most of my no claim bonus, when my policy becomes due for renewal I intend to let it lapse and just use husbands car when required on which I am a name driver, mu question is will my husbands policy increase due to my accident bearing in mind the claim was against my own policy
 
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DOBBER22

Guest
Re: car insurance - cheaper for male/female as named driver

Careful now I didn't say anything about driving without insurance I do not agree with that.
I admit that is a problem but the insurance companies have left people with very little choice it's either pay thousands for twelve months cover in your own name or pay much much less as a named driver on a relatives policy at the end of the day most people just want to get to and from work and maybe an odd day trip as long as they respect the persons policy they are using then whats the harm :\
 
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rainyday

Guest
Re: car insurance - cheaper for male/female as named driver

So lying to the insurance company in order to get a quote that does not match your real risk profile is OK - but driving without insurance is not OK. I guess that a 'little bit' of tax evasion is probably OK too? And maybe a 'little bit' of shoplifting?

This insurance companies have left people with the choice of being honest, but this seems to be a non-viable option in your book?
 
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Ceist Beag

Guest
Re: car insurance - cheaper for male/female as named driver

"This insurance companies have left people with the choice of being honest"

In fairness Rainyday, I think this is not true for a lot of people. Say for example the best quote a young lad can get to insure his €1000 valued opel corsa is for €2500 for a policy in his own name, for a lot of people this is not a choice (unless you think not being able to drive his car is a choice!). In this case no insurance company is giving the driver a choice if he wants to drive his own car. Now I'm not condoning what Dobber22 says as I don't agree with his views but at the same time insurance companies are by no means whiter than white when it comes to being honest and fair! Do you really think that grouping all individuals according to an age bracket and sex is honest?
 
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rainyday

Guest
Re: car insurance - cheaper for male/female as named driver

Whether the insurance companies are whiter than white is irrelevant. If we as a society go down the road of letting people talk the law into their own hands through this kind of white-collar vigilante-ism, then we might as well just break down society and make it every man for himself. Let's not bother with insurance at all - if somebody crashes into you, it will be your problem to chase him through the courts.

The key point is that those who lie to their insurance companies in order to get cheaper insurance aren't really ripping off the insurance companies, they are ripping off the other customers of the insurance companies - By providing cover to a risky driver at a rate that does not reflect that risk, the remaining customers (you & me) are left to top up the difference when the claims come through.

If you can't afford to insure a car honestly, then you can't afford to insure a car. I could afford a nice car with insurance if I lied to the taxman or social welfare - Would that be OK in your book.
 
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Ceist Beag

Guest
Re: car insurance - cheaper for male/female as named driver

Like I said Rainyday, I don't agree with what has been said but the nub of the problem is that people simply cannot afford to insure a car under their own name so they bend the rules to suit their situation. I don't think this is right but it happens! If the insurance companies were to reduce their premiums for young drivers to a sensible level then this might not be such a problem. Your statement that the remaining customers are left to top up the difference when claims come through also applies to young drivers - why should they pay such ridiculously high premiums when they might actually be good drivers, it's hardly fair just to say they are in the wrong age category or gender so have to fork out!
And don't be trying to make out that I condone being dishonest rainyday - where in my reply did I state that? I'm simply trying to show how insurance companies themselves are partly to blame for the problem.
 
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rainyday

Guest
Re: car insurance - cheaper for male/female as named driver

why should they pay such ridiculously high premiums when they might actually be good drivers, it's hardly fair just to say they are in the wrong age category or gender so have to fork out!
So if you were running your Ceist Beag Insurance Ltd, how would you assess the risk of drivers?
 
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DOBBER22

Guest
Re: > Re: car insurance - cheaper for male/female as name

Tax evasion, shop lifting....I thought this was a discussion about motor insurance :\ I do pay my taxes and have no need to shoplift your way off the mark Rainyday I'm not telling anybody to break the law I just don't see any harm in bending a rule when left with little choice as some people really do need the use of a car it sucks that we live in a country that lets companies get away with ripoffs but what are we to do just lie back and take it? Anybody I know who is a named driver is so because they couldn't afford the premium on their own and needed the use of a car for work ect..
And what about people on provisional licences without the supervision of a fully licenced driver are they all tax evaders and shop lifters too? Ah comon now :\
 
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Ceist Beag

Guest
Re: > Re: car insurance - cheaper for male/female as name

Not for me to figure out Rainyday but that doesn't mean I can't point out the weaknesses in the system. But if you think its a fair system then you must be double jointed to get your head up there! :rolleyes
 
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rainyday

Guest
Re: > Re: car insurance - cheaper for male/female as name

So I assume that Dobber & Ceist Beag aren't bothered by the fact that their insurance bill are 20 euro higher (my wild estimate) than they would otherwise be if a significant number of other customers weren't 'bending the rules'? You are quite happy to subsidise these other lying customers - right?
 
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DOBBER22

Guest
Re: > Re: car insurance - cheaper for male/female as name

Oh poor you being charged an extra few euros :\ young drivers are quoted a few extra thousand euros for motor insurance and for no other reason than their age or in some cases gender that is why they have to bend the rules and for the record I had to sell my car as the premium was way above my means 2400 pounds not euros and glad to see the back of it got great pleasure telling the insurance company that I no longer needed their services and why not that they cared anyway, I didn't have the option of using a relatives policy so I waved goodbye to a bad debt.
 
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rainyday

Guest
Re: > Re: car insurance - cheaper for male/female as name

for no other reason than their age or in some cases gender
This is sheer rubbish. The reason they pay extra is because all the data shows they will cost extra in claims.
 
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DOBBER22

Guest
Re: > Re: car insurance - cheaper for male/female as name

Rubbish....I think not tell me after 3 years of claims free driving how an insurance company have the cheek to quote you 2,400 pounds? The answer is they do it because they can get away with it not because the "data" says I want to go out and crash my car, look at the profits they have made over the last few years and you will get a clearer picture of how much they have ripped people off.
Surely you can see that they do charge an exorbitant amount for young drivers especially young men :\
 
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rainyday

Guest
Re: > Re: car insurance - cheaper for male/female as name

Read the MIAB report Dobber - and you will see exactly how wrong you are.
 
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DOBBER22

Guest
Re: car insurance - cheaper for male/female as named driver

Fact File on Car Insurance.


Only 6% of those who drive regularly are under the age of 24, as compared with the European average of 14%. (Source: Government's "Road to Safety" 1998 - 2002 report).


Average Car Insurance in 1998 was €609 (IR£480). Some young drivers are paying over ten times that amount. (Source: Automobile Association )


The Irish Insurance Federation says the relative claims cost for young drivers (17 to 24) are less than twice what they are for the 36 to 40 age group. ( Source: Irish Insurance Federation Factfile, 1998 )


42% of insurance premium is spent on legal and administration costs in Ireland. Across Europe the average is 10%. In Sweden where very few cases go to the courts, it costs 2%. ( Source: Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment (DETE) Working Group Report on Personal Injury Compensation )


Irish accident rates are half what they are in Portugal and equal to the European average, yet drivers in no other EU country pay more for motor insurance than Irish drivers. (Source: National Roads Authority - Young Drivers Accidents Report 1997 )


The motor insurance fund in Ireland in 2001 was €1.2billion. Sweden with 10 million people and a higher density of cars had a fund of €520million in 1996. (Source: Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment (DETE) Working Group Report on Personal Injury Compensation )


The following are a few examples of how much young people are paying for car insurance
21 year old David Green is paying €4,430 to insure a Honda Civic despite never having a crash and a one year no claims bonus.
A fully qualified 21 year old Aer Lingus Airline Pilot is paying €6,602 to insure his Audi A3 1.6l. He is trusted to fly an Airbus jet aircraft but not to drive a car!
A 22 year old driver with a full driving licence from Rathfarnham was paying €2,831 (IR£2,230) to insure a 1300 cc Mazda 323. He had a crash and was re-quoted £4,300 to re-new his policy.
A 24 year old driver is paying €2,400 to insure a Fiat Punto. Despite having four years no claims driving experience, his insurance increased by €630 this year.
Total Premium income for all Car Insurance Companies trading in Ireland during 1997 was €902 million. €780 million was paid out in claims (Source: Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment (DETE) Report, 1997)


British drivers lodge more claims than Irish drivers, but on average the Irish claims are over four times higher (Source: Deloitte & Touche Economic Evaluation of Insurance Costs in Ireland, 1996)


Only three motor insurance companies based in Ireland will insure young drivers (Usually under 27) (Source: MIJAG )


The average age of the workforce at Irelands largest factory (Intel) is 23 and most must drive to get to work (Source: Intel Ireland)

MIAB Report attached: Recommendation number 17 is a good one!

www.entemp.ie/cr/miab.pdf
 
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rainyday

Guest
Re: car insurance - cheaper for male/female as named driver

Try reading behind the headlines, Dobber.

The MIAB report clearly demonstrated that the insurance companies were NOT ripping off consumers. In bad years, they were losing money. In decent years, they were making modest returns on investment, by comparison to other businesses.

The real rip-off was the legal costs which make up such a huge part of the claims costs - but I know it's much easier for you just to rant about the insurance companies to justify the rip-off by consumers. That's the underbelly of rip-off Ireland that doesn't get too much publicity because it is just a bit unpalatable for the general public.
 
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DOBBER22

Guest
Re: car insurance - cheaper for male/female as named driver

I can bet if your insurance premium was a couple of thousand euros you'd be shouting ripoff too or are you far too civilised for that kinda carry on ;)
 
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rainyday

Guest
Re: car insurance - cheaper for male/female as named driver

You can shout all you like, Dobber, if it makes you feel better. But if you actually want to solve the problem, you would really be better off doing a little research and looking at the facts of the issue.
 
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