Jogger taking a private criminal prosecution against an eBike who knocked him down on a footpath

Brendan Burgess

Brendan Burgess

Founder
Messages
54,410
The Gardai did not prosecute so the victim is taking a criminal case.

www.irishtimes.com

Jogger whose leg was broken in alleged collision with e-bike on footpath takes prosecution

Action has potentially significant implications for users of E-bikes and insurers
www.irishtimes.com www.irishtimes.com

Mr Leonard claims gardaí failed to properly investigate the incident, with the effect his only option was to issue a summons for a private summary criminal prosecution in the District Court on a complaint of alleged dangerous driving.

A core issue is whether or not the e-bike – described as a ENGWE EP-2 Pro Folding e-bike – is a mechanically propelled vehicle (MPV) notwithstanding the introduction, via the Road Traffic and Transport Act 2023, of the concept of a “powered personal transporter”.
 
I don’t know if that type of bike is legally a bike here or a motor vehicle

They vary so much. I have an old ebike which basically gives me a bit of a boost on a hill, if I stop pedalling it stops. I’ve seen uber eats guys racing around on bikes without a single push on their part.
 
I live in an area with lots of E bikes and scooters. The software is very easily hacked and I regularly see them doing speeds of close to 40 km/h.

I have literally seen this hundreds of times, I might be in four figures now and have never once seen a law enforcement intervention. AGS have zero interest in preventing or prosecuting this kind of crime.
 
Regular occurrence to see these scooter users bombing along on paths at what looks like 30 -40 mph while looking at their phones.
At night very difficult to see them when they're in ninja mode ( dressed head to toe in black) with no lights on their scooters.

Dangerous to drivers and pedestrians. They are a scourge.
 
James399 said:
this is what happens when you've poor enforcement by the Gardai.
Click to expand...

Agree that there is poor enforcement, but in this case apparently the law is unclear.

The Garda probably did send a file to the DPP who would have made the call on whether or not to prosecute.

Can I not be done for dangerous cycling if I am on the footpath? Maybe it's not a criminal offence.
 
Brendan Burgess said:
The Garda probably did send a file to the DPP who would have made the call on whether or not to prosecute.
Click to expand...
This suggests that they didn't?
A Garda attended the scene and took details but it appeared there was significant delay progressing the matter and recording it on the Pulse system to such an extent he considered no proper investigation of the incident was conducted, Mr Leonard said.

It was later confirmed to him gardaí were not taking a prosecution in relation to the incident, he said. When he sought a review from the Director of Public Prosecutions (DPP), that office had not received a file from gardaí about the incident.
Click to expand...
 
Unfortunately the legislation and accordingly any attempt by enforcement by the Gardai is so ambiguous or convoluted as to make it a huge challenge. The legislation absolved the definition of MPV to any vehicle with a maximum speed of 25kmph or which requires pedalling or scooting to make it go (supplementing the electric motor). Such defined or classified vehicles are also exempt from the requirement for tax and insurance (or driver licence).

Of course, confronted by one of these machines involved in an accident, it is quite difficult for a Garda to determine on the spot whether or not it meets the definition of an MPV without seizure and determination by Garda technical bureau. However, the reality is that even whilst such restrictions are enshrined in the legislation the reality is that most e-bikes and many e-scooters are well capable of exceeding this 25kmph limit even while being pedalled or scooted. This has led to considerable lack of consistency by both Gardai and other legislators in interpreting legislation.

Equally traffic enforcement with limited available resources was already a challenge even before this legislation, just evidence the scourge of unregistered scrambler motorbikes being ridden without tax or insurance (or helmets in most cases) in many urban estates.

This is by no means an attempt to absolve AGS but they are unfortunately operating somewhat with one hand behind their backs on this one.
 
Mayo1969 said:
Unfortunately the legislation and accordingly any attempt by enforcement by the Gardai is so ambiguous or convoluted as to make it a huge challenge. The legislation absolved the definition of MPV to any vehicle with a maximum speed of 25kmph or which requires pedalling or scooting to make it go (supplementing the electric motor). Such defined or classified vehicles are also exempt from the requirement for tax and insurance (or driver licence).

Of course, confronted by one of these machines involved in an accident, it is quite difficult for a Garda to determine on the spot whether or not it meets the definition of an MPV without seizure and determination by Garda technical bureau. However, the reality is that even whilst such restrictions are enshrined in the legislation the reality is that most e-bikes and many e-scooters are well capable of exceeding this 25kmph limit even while being pedalled or scooted. This has led to considerable lack of consistency by both Gardai and other legislators in interpreting legislation
Click to expand...

But in a situation like this, surely the Gardaí should have referred the case file to the DPP so that Office could have decided whether or not to prosecute and under what legislation?

The significant delay in inputting the incident to the Pulse system seems difficult to defend, but that's one for the GSOC to investigate.

Best wishes to Mr. Leonard whose quality of life has probably been ruined by this accident.
 
Mayo1969 said:
Equally traffic enforcement with limited available resources was already a challenge even before this legislation,
Click to expand...
That’s just a cope.

AGS has more members than ever.

It just has zero AGS management priority.

Hopefully the promised transport police has jurisdiction over this stuff and enforces the law.
 
No idea why people are confused.

1) it's on a pavement illegally
2) it's over the power limit
3) it's not a scooter
4) law not being enforced

In addition to the fines and such they should confiscate the bikes and scooters and destroy them. They should also change the law so they can't sell them. Daft they can sell them.
 
AlbacoreA said:
No idea why people are confused.

1) it's on a pavement illegally
2) it's over the power limit
3) it's not a scooter
4) law not being enforced
Click to expand...
Someone is going to be killed one day and perhaps then there will be political priority around enforcement.


I say this as an enthusiast for E-bikes and E-scooters. I’ve seen them make a huge difference for commuters, but a large minority of riders are brazenly breaking the law and it should be stopped.
 
mathepac said:
People on escooters have already died in RTIs, 4 up to the end of Dec 2024.
Click to expand...
Thanks. I mean that a political head of steam will build up when a pedestrian is killed by someone on an e-scooter or e-bike which has been hacked to go above the legal speed limits.

I think a pedestrian fatality is highly likely in the next five years if the growth in usage continues.
 
Brendan Burgess said:
ENGWE EP-2 Pro Folding e-bike
Click to expand...
That's very definitely an e-bike, not a scooter. Specs here - its fairly powerful
Its a straightforward case of cyclist illegally cycling on footpath, I can't see why Gardai are not prosecuting as they shouldn't have been there.

As someone who cycles extensively myself as transport, it really frustrates me when these gombeens give us all such a bad name. I was walking down a footpath only last week when I heard a bell ringing behind me. I refused to budge and eventually one of these bikes cycled around me, as if somehow they had every right to be there and I had to get out of their way. Used to see it a lot on a narrow one way street I lived on. I I just stopped still and refused to budge if an e-biker came at me going the wrong way on a one way street up the narrow footpath.

Years ago I ended up in court for my road tax being 3 months out (yeah I know, it should have been an on the spot fine, and ended up being exactly the same fine in court), and the guy before me was a 18 year old student who had been caught cycling the wrong way down Kildare st with his hands in his pockets and his headphones on. Gardai are gone soft.
 
Mayo1969 said:
most e-bikes and many e-scooters are well capable of exceeding this 25kmph limit even while being pedalled or scooted
Click to expand...
Every single bike is capable of exceeding this limit. That's why ALL bikes are banned from footpaths, not just e-bikes or scooters.

This kind of behaviour gives all cyclists and scooters a bad name.
The only excuse I can ever make is if a cyclist or scooter user mounts a footpath to get to a parking stand, other than that there is no excuse for being on a footpath that hasn't got a cycle path on it or a shared cycling space (and increasingly a lot of gombeen are going the wrong direction on these, making them very unsafe).

I took my e-scooter on an extended ride from the city before the ban on public transport carrying came in - its really quite hard on the city roads, which are pock marked with potholes and broken sections. But its no better on footpaths either. These are fine for short trips but not great for anything more.

The secondary issue is that even a lot of "road legal" ebikes esp those coming from China are extremely heavy - that bike is 38kg compared to my 22kg Raleigh folding e-bike. Add an 80k person to that and the victim was effectively hit by over 100kg of weight doing probably around 15-20km per hour.
 
Brendan Burgess said:
Can I not be done for dangerous cycling if I am on the footpath? Maybe it's not a criminal offence.
Click to expand...
It is a criminal offence. The only ambiguity is what kind of "vehicle" it is. But it is still considered an offence if its me on my 11kg road bike as it would be with a 38kg ebike like the one the rider crashed into the victim.

Reading the article though, it doesn't make it clear, but he's saying that the actual power of the motor is 750kw and not the advertised 250kw from the Engwe website. A lot of Chinese e-bike makers clock bigger motors in Europe to make them "road legal", but users can just set the location to USA to bypass this. The US version of this model suggests a motor of 960kw, so question there is if the motor is indeed simply being limited in software only, or a EU only version limited to a slower speed. Its very hard to tell - some Chinese makers do have EU grade motors in them that are indeed compliant with the 250kw max motor definition of an e-bike. But we technically do allow higher powered electric mopeds under the new law. So it could either be a "L1e-A" if the motor is bigger or "L1e-B" if it does up to 45kmph.
The law is simple -
  • no bicycle or e-scooter of any kind can be ridden on a normal footpath
  • only bikes, scooters and ebikes with less than 1kw of power and no throttle can be ridden on cycle lanes
  • bikes with a throttle & a weight above 25kg or throttle powered mopeds capable of doing more than 25kmph and up to 45kmph require insurance
  • All bikes with a throttle and bikes with more than 250kw motors are required to register and pay motor tax
I know that road by the way, there is a cycle lane on the footpath on a lot of it but not continuous & it sounds like the biker came off the cycleway that abruptly ends in the photo below and hit the jogger somewhere near the bus stop. So Fingal Co Co might need to be consulted also if there was originally a bike lane there, or if they have created a pertinently dangerous cycle lane that leads cyclists straight into the path of passengers waiting at the bus stop. They will argue that they cannot cross safely as its a slip to a motorway full of speeding motorists with motorway brain switched on.
That will be an interesting case, but the cyclist is absolutely in the wrong and Gardai should have investigated further to see if the bike was a modified high power vehicle and thus liable for road tax and registration.
Its basket case level of insanity that a motor dealer has to register an imported vehicle and yet a retailer, many of whom are bricks and mortar here, can evade doing so and leave buyers with an impression that their "road legal" vehicle needs to be taxed and potentially insured also.
1741623964782.png
 
Last edited by a moderator:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top