Is Bertie Delusional?

cork said:
But many factors were outside his control.

It was turned into a politicalfootball by Labour & FG.

Bertie had only the advice of the public sector to rely on.

This is my major gripe.

The ESRI gave out very timid warnings.
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This an extreme spin on the facts.

Bertie and co had lots of warnings. Check out the chip on Youtube of John Fitzgerald from ESRI giving a very non-timid warning on Govt policy. I saw Charlie McCreevy on Reeling in the Years explaining how ALL the other 14 European finance ministers were wrong and he was right. The external report into the Dept Finance showed all the warnings that Bertie and Brian chose to ignore.

Bertie's last straw was to suggest that anyone who was 'talking down the economy' should kill themselves, because he didn't want to hear their message.
 
Complainer said:
Bertie's last straw was to suggest that anyone who was 'talking down the economy' should kill themselves, because he didn't want to hear their message.
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This was ideed an unfortunate comment.

What politician likes negative comment on the economy?

When an economy needs growth - politicians worldwide rally aganist negative comment.

The ESRI predicted a "soft landing".

THe ESRI were surposed to be pretty clued in.
 
cork said:
But many factors were outside his control.

It was turned into a politicalfootball by Labour & FG.

Bertie had only the advice of the public sector to rely on.

This is my major gripe.

The ESRI gave out very timid warnings.
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He consistently ignored advice from the Dept of Finance, who warned him of the dangers of his fiscal policies.
 
Advice on the soft landing came came the ESRI.

The ERSI did give some qualifying remarks but they remained pretty positive with regards the frenzy.

We also had the regulator + central bank who saw no danger.

WE had a media that were more pre-occupied producing property supplements.
 
Complainer said:
Not true. Here's what the ESRI said as far back as 2000, and here's Bertie, Harney and McCreevey dumping on their advice;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=THWbrFy5NWM
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Thank you for posting this.

2000 was a busy year for us and I honestly don't remember this newscast.

However the stone-throwers seem to be operating solely with the benefit of hindsight.

There was a general feeling around at the time that supported Bertie's stated position on returning emigrants.
 
onq said:
However the stone-throwers seem to be operating solely with the benefit of hindsight.

There was a general feeling around at the time that supported Bertie's stated position on returning emigrants.
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Some of us had more than hindsight. Some of us had a track record of attacking FF's over generous supports for property developers for many, many years. Some others didn't want to listen.
 
onq said:
Thank you for posting this.

2000 was a busy year for us and I honestly don't remember this newscast.

However the stone-throwers seem to be operating solely with the benefit of hindsight.

There was a general feeling around at the time that supported Bertie's stated position on returning emigrants.
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But he was in charge and he was getting expert advice and he refused to listen to it.
 
Great clip

Should also be noted that thousands upon thousands of Irish people ignored the fact that Bertie & Co ignored the warnings and voted them all back into power in both 2002 & 2007
 
Complainer said:
Bertie and co had lots of warnings.
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Its the "and co" bit that I think cork is getting at and I am inclined to agree with him. I have been reflecting on this and it's too easy to blame Bertie for everything. For a start he had a cabinet full of strong individuals who seem to have kept the head down.

I was talking to a banker recently and he said the pressure to grow business (mainly through mortgages) was intense after 2000. He said he was constantly shown how rival banks were doing in terms of new loans etc. But he rarely heard anything about a potential bubble and risk went out the window.
 
I would vote for Bertie for president over any of the current idiots running.
 
DB74 said:
Great clip

Should also be noted that thousands upon thousands of Irish people ignored the fact that Bertie & Co ignored the warnings and voted them all back into power in both 2002 & 2007
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I think that had as much to do with the dunderheads running FG and Labour rather than a ringing endorsement of Bertie and co.
 
Teatime said:
Its the "and co" bit that I think cork is getting at and I am inclined to agree with him. I have been reflecting on this and it's too easy to blame Bertie for everything. For a start he had a cabinet full of strong individuals who seem to have kept the head down.
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Strong individuals? Strong as in thick-headed strike politicians I’ll go with but strong as in understanding their brief and standing up to pressures in order to do the right thing; no, not a chance.
The only FF person of substance who stood up to Bertie (and also stood up to CJH), was Seamus Brennan. He was left out in the cold by both of them because of that.
 
Purple said:
I think that had as much to do with the dunderheads running FG and Labour rather than a ringing endorsement of Bertie and co.
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Come on now, I think we've heard the old 'it was the fault of the opposition' line far too often at this stage.

And, regardless of your political persuasion, it is plainly ridiculous to describe Michael Noonan, Ruairi Quinn, Pat Rabbitte or Enda Kenny as 'dunderheads'.

The bottom line is that Bertie Ahern devised and executed a brilliant but unsustainable strategy of tricking the people by bribing them with their own money. And when the people's money ran out, he kept this up by borrowing until the economy collapsed.The politicians who didn't participate in this charade were ridiculed as 'dunderheads' (and worse), and the 'cribbers and moaners' who pointed out the fallacy of all of this were told to 'go off and commit suicide'.
 
T McGibney said:
And, regardless of your political persuasion, it is plainly ridiculous to describe Michael Noonan, Ruairi Quinn, Pat Rabbitte or Enda Kenny as 'dunderheads'.
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The 07 manifestos of both FG and Labour in he 07 election were vote grabbing.

In the election prior to that FG wanted to compansate Eircom shareholders.

This was the bubble mindset.

FG wanted to cut stamp dut to re-start the property bubble in the 07 election.
 
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