Okay, so it grossly understates the levels of wealth because it excludes wealth that cannot be made liquid. Strange since it is absolutely real wealth and easy to put a value on.
Okay, so it grossly understates the levels of wealth because it excludes wealth that cannot be made liquid. Strange since it is absolutely real wealth and easy to put a value on.I googled the 60 page credit suisse report. Copy paste of a section below. Private pension assets are included. State entitlement are not. It's Not explicit on db pensions but the implication is they are not included, and that an annuity would not be included either.
Notes on concepts and methods
Net worth, or “wealth,” is defined as the value
of financial assets plus real assets (principally
housing) owned by households, minus their
debts. This corresponds to the balance sheet
that a household might draw up, listing the items
which are owned, and their net value if sold.
Private pension fund assets are included, but not
entitlements to state pensions. Human capital is
excluded altogether, along with assets and debts
owned by the state (which cannot easily be
assigned to individuals).
That would be down to the other word in the discussion.If we are the 17th wealthiest country in the world and wealthier than even UK and Germany, why are left wing parties like sinn fein so popular here?
Because there's more to life than one metric (money / wealth).If we are the 17th wealthiest country in the world and wealthier than even UK and Germany, why are left wing parties like sinn fein so popular here?
Correct - data with varying degrees of reliability.They are trying to report across every country, so they might be somewhat limited by data sources that they can easily get for each country.
And the definition of "fair" is yet another.That would be down to the other word in the discussion.
Wealth is one thing, fair distribution is another.
Surely "socialism and hunger" would be more correct, stalinist socialism along maoist socialism in China caused more starvation than anything else in the twentieth century. Oh and how can we forget Cambodia , the kmher rouge and its year zero ideology trying to obtain the most pure form of socialism.We also have a strong left-wing lean in third level institutions. My son did a college project on "Capitalism and Hunger" and had to ignore most of the data so that he didn't upset his Lecturer.
That's the stuff he had to ignore.Surely "socialism and hunger" would be more correct, stalinist socialism along maoist socialism in China caused more starvation than anything else in the twentieth century. Oh and how can we forget Cambodia , the kmher rouge and its year zero ideology trying to obtain the most pure form of socialism.
Even in eastern Europe in the best food producing countries in the world there were food shortages during communism in the 80s. Now we have putin trying to resurrect the Soviet Union causing global food shortage again
| Table 2.1 Summary of results | ||
| Households with asset/debt | Median value 1 | |
| % | € | |
| Real assets | ||
| Household Main Residence (HMR) | 69.6 | 260,000 |
| Land | 8.9 | 300,000 |
| Other Real Estate Property | 12.5 | 236,600 |
| Self Employment Business Wealth | 15.2 | 19,700 |
| Vehicles | 79.1 | 10,000 |
| Valuables | 78.3 | 4,100 |
| Any Real Asset | 95.3 | 253,100 |
| Financial assets | ||
| Savings | 96.6 | 8,700 |
| Bond or Mutual funds | 13.6 | 5,000 |
| Shares | 10.5 | 5,800 |
| Voluntary Pension | 16.3 | 37,600 |
| Other Financial Asset | 7.2 | 10,000 |
| Any Financial Asset | 97.1 | 13,300 |
| Debt | ||
| Mortgage on HMR | 30.4 | 124,400 |
| Mortgage on Other Property | 7.2 | 104,800 |
| Non-mortgage loan | 45.5 | 7,300 |
| Overdraft | 6.7 | 600 |
| Credit Card debt | 26.8 | 700 |
| Any Debt | 68.1 | 25,000 |
| 1 Conditional on participation. |
Does the wealth originate in Ireland? No. Does he live in Ireland? Not clear, but likely no. Does he pay much tax in Ireland? Likely very little.The Republic’s richest person remains construction magnate Pallonji Mistry (92). The Indian-born Irish citizen controls engineering business, Shapoorji Pallonji Group, and holds a stake in Tata Sons, one of India’s biggest businesses.
Patrick Collison (33) and John Collison (31), whose wealth shot up to $9.5 billion each after a fundraising round that saw the valuation of Stripe almost triple in less than a year.
John Grayken (65), founder of Dallas, Texas-based private equity business Lone Star Funds, an active investor in the Republic, is in 386th place with an estimated fortune of $6.5 billion, down from $7.6 billion a year earlier.
Digicel founder and owner Denis O’Brien (63) is at 778th in the list with wealth of $3.8 billion, down from $4.6 billion and 622nd place a year ago.
John Armitage (62), the British-born founder and investment manager of who became an Irish citizen four years ago,
https://www.irishtimes.com/topics/topics-7.1213540?article=true&tag_company=Kingspan (Kingspan) founder Eugene Murtagh (79) was close behind with $2.8 billion, Forbes said, up $500 million on a year ago, putting him in 1,096th place.
John Dorrance (78), an heir to the Campbell’s Soup fortune, is at 1,163rd with $2.7 billion, up $100 million.
Finally, Dermot Desmond (71) appears on the list in 1,445th place with a $2.1 billion estimated fortune, down from $2.2 billion.
So DB pensions are not included. That greatly skews the data and misrepresents the facts. It’s hard to believe that a bunch of people with DB pensions in the CSO would ignore them when calculating household wealth. Go figure…
Table 2.1 Summary of results Households with asset/debt Median value 1 % € Real assets Household Main Residence (HMR) 69.6 260,000 Land 8.9 300,000 Other Real Estate Property 12.5 236,600 Self Employment Business Wealth 15.2 19,700 Vehicles 79.1 10,000 Valuables 78.3 4,100 Any Real Asset 95.3 253,100 Financial assets Savings 96.6 8,700 Bond or Mutual funds 13.6 5,000 Shares 10.5 5,800 Voluntary Pension 16.3 37,600 Other Financial Asset 7.2 10,000 Any Financial Asset 97.1 13,300 Debt Mortgage on HMR 30.4 124,400 Mortgage on Other Property 7.2 104,800 Non-mortgage loan 45.5 7,300 Overdraft 6.7 600 Credit Card debt 26.8 700 Any Debt 68.1 25,000 1 Conditional on participation.
The capital value of a DB pension - is that an asset? Can it be traded? Can it be turned into cash and spent?
Does it meet the criteria for an asset to be included in wealth?
Only certain assets and liabilities are included. In particular, the present value of all future, expected defined benefit pensions is excluded, which can be a sizable portion of the wealth of many households. The present value of future, voluntary, expected defined contribution pensions is included.
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