Yes Direct Devil - you are right! I belong to the second category. After about 25 years driving, without a single claim on my insurance policy, having never driven uninsured etc. I was stopped at a garda checkpoint recently and was absolutely stunned to discover that I had unknowingly let my insurance policy lapse by about 2 months. I really couldn't believe it and went home convinced I would find the insurance disc and certificate there somewhere. In fact I have no recollection of receiving renewal notification in the post, as I have done every year so far, but apparently it was sent out. I am now 'facing the music'. My insurer has refused to insure me. My broker has advised me to send them 3 letters of refusal from other insurers, assuming they won't insure me either, which has turned out to be the case. My most recent insurer will then be obliged to give me a quote, but I dread to think how high it might be. As it stands, I may well get a summons, have to appear in court for the first time in my life and be fined up to €5000 and get 5 penalty points.
How can there be so many uninsured motorists ?
- Thread starter MrEarl
- Start date
Yes Direct Devil - you are right! I belong to the second category. After about 25 years driving, without a single claim on my insurance policy, having never driven uninsured etc. I was stopped at a garda checkpoint recently and was absolutely stunned to discover that I had unknowingly let my insurance policy lapse by about 2 months. I really couldn't believe it and went home convinced I would find the insurance disc and certificate there somewhere. In fact I have no recollection of receiving renewal notification in the post, as I have done every year so far, but apparently it was sent out. I am now 'facing the music'. My insurer has refused to insure me. My broker has advised me to send them 3 letters of refusal from other insurers, assuming they won't insure me either, which has turned out to be the case. My most recent insurer will then be obliged to give me a quote, but I dread to think how high it might be. As it stands, I may well get a summons, have to appear in court for the first time in my life and be fined up to €5000 and get 5 penalty points.
That is a very unusual thing to have had happen - with brokers earning on renewals, insurance companies trying to secure your repeat custom etc. I would have expected you to not only receive the written quote to renew, but also a few follow up phone calls, text messages and emails over the course of the 4 week period running up to the expiry date (and possibly even a few days past that date). I know I certainly get plenty of reminders every year and to the best of my knowledge, so does everyone that I know who has various forms of insurance.
Out of interest, did your (former) insurance company or your broker indicate that they tried to contact you, to remind you to renew ?
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I get my renewal by post each year but have never got phone calls/texts/emails from the company running up to the renewal date and I always leave it until the last minute to renew or move.
I look after my father's car insurance with a different company and they send the renewal and one reminder a few days before the date, again no calls/texts/emails etc.
I'm not sure every company works like that, I have never come across it. In fact I often think my car insurer couldn't care less whether I renew with them or not, very much a take it or leave it attitude I find.
I look after my father's car insurance with a different company and they send the renewal and one reminder a few days before the date, again no calls/texts/emails etc.
I'm not sure every company works like that, I have never come across it. In fact I often think my car insurer couldn't care less whether I renew with them or not, very much a take it or leave it attitude I find.
Yes MrEarl - my broker said that renewal notices had been posted out approx. 4 weeks before the renewal date and a week or so after it. There was also an email sent approx 1 week after the renewal date - but as I had never received such reminders by email before, and did not have the renewal date in my mind, I did not go looking for that email and didn't see it until I went searching back through all emails after being stopped at the checkpoint. I know it may seem far fetched, but there are still some people out there who have limited or sporadic internet access and who may not actually use email etc on a regular basis. As for the renewal notices sent by post, I still have had no success at all in finding either of them, despite having such notices from earlier years still in my files (I mean the kind of files that are kept in a filing cabinet!!).
What may have happened, at least in relation to the first renewal notice, is that at around the time it was sent out, one of my dogs suddenly developed an extreme behaviour problem called 'separation anxiety', which I know probably sounds laughable to those of you not familiar with it, but it is actually quite serious, as it essentially means the dog can no longer be left unattended in the house. Basically when I went back at work after the Christmas holidays, she started to literally go berserk and really tear the place asunder.
On one such occasion, a person who had dropped in to check on things while I was at work discovered two whole shelves of books pulled out and several books, including a very large encyclopedia, shredded and spread all over the floor etc. along with a lot of other paperwork that had been in the room. It was an unbelievable mess. On that occasion or possibly on a subsequent similar occasion, some tidying up took place while I was still at work, which, now that I look back, may have resulted in an unopened envelope being put up 'out of harm's way', where, to date, I haven't been able to find it. As to the second letter, I really do not have any recollection of ever seeing it, and as it would have been telling me my insurance had expired, I would definitely have paid attention to it and acted on it immediately.
While all of this is true, I am slightly worried that if I mention it to the judge in a court, he/she may think I am treating him/her like an idiot, with an excuse similar to the classic 'the dog ate my homework'!!
When/if I get a quote from my most recent insurance company, I will post that information here for general interest. I also would hope to let participants on this thread know what the outcome of my court appearance is, whenever that happens. If nothing else, perhaps I will succeed in terrifying anyone who might potentially commit the same oversight that I did into taking precautions such as posting notices all over their house (out of reach of dogs) with the renewal date written out in very large print, putting stickers on the steering wheel of the car, tying knots in handkerchiefs (remember those??), putting their watch (things people used to use to tell the time in the 'olden days') on the other wrist etc.
Thank you to those who responded to my post, and particularly those of you who expressed some sympathy with me and my plight. With the best will in the world, people do sometimes make genuine mistakes and forget things and even though the consequences must be faced, a bit of humanity along the way does help!
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"The dog ate my homework" A diary, a desk calendar, a wall calendar with anote in red capitals "GET CAR INSURANCE QUOTE" two weeks prior to renewal might be a more practical and useful reminder than knots in hankies.
For important matters like this I have long ago ceased to rely on prompts from others to take action.
For important matters like this I have long ago ceased to rely on prompts from others to take action.
Everyone has their own system for remembering things, very hard these days to keep track of everything, emails, text messages, smart phone alerts, I look at them and I say I must remember to do that and that then it goes straight out of my mind while dealing with the next distraction. I missed my house insurance renewal a few years back for a whole month due to being preoccupied with other stuff going on. Nothing is easy anymore even though there is no excuse for it.
DirectDevil
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Just an additional observation.
Motor insurance policies are annual contracts. Unless there have been recent changes I have always understood that insurers are not required to invite renewal of a policy or to even issue a renewal notice. That being the case it is easy enough for a person to overlook the matter. Not everybody has all singing and all dancing reminder gizmos
I rather fear that OP may be the victim of a systems blip and that he may well not have received his renewal notice (i.e. not actually sent out). It is surprising to realise how highly systemised operators can fail in basic paperwork.
Motor insurance policies are annual contracts. Unless there have been recent changes I have always understood that insurers are not required to invite renewal of a policy or to even issue a renewal notice. That being the case it is easy enough for a person to overlook the matter. Not everybody has all singing and all dancing reminder gizmos
I rather fear that OP may be the victim of a systems blip and that he may well not have received his renewal notice (i.e. not actually sent out). It is surprising to realise how highly systemised operators can fail in basic paperwork.
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dereko1969
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Yes but they all do have the little paper disc in the window of their car with the end-date on it.......Just an additional observation.
Motor insurance policies are annual contracts. Unless there have been recent changes I have always understood that insurers are not required to invite renewal of a policy or to even issue a renewal notice. That being the case it is easy enough for a person to overlook the matter. Not everybody has all singing and all dancing reminder gizmos
I rather fear that OP may be the victim of a systems blip and that he may well not have received his renewal notice (i.e. not actually sent out). It is surprising to realise how highly systemised operators can fail in basic paperwork.
@DirectDevil, Incorrect. Some insurers offer biennial contracts and, according to this source, http://www.citizensinformation.ie/e.../motor_tax_and_insurance/motor_insurance.html
"Renewing your motor insurance
Under Non-Life Insurance (Provision of Information) (Renewal of Policy of Insurance) Regulations 2007 (SI No. 74/2007) your motor insurance company must issue your insurance renewal notice not less than 15 working days before the date of expiry of your insurance policy. It is also required to include with the notice your no claims discount certificate. You will need this certificate if you want to renew your motor insurance with a different insurance company."
The OP is not a victim, just a person who relies on others for reminders of important events.
"Renewing your motor insurance
Under Non-Life Insurance (Provision of Information) (Renewal of Policy of Insurance) Regulations 2007 (SI No. 74/2007) your motor insurance company must issue your insurance renewal notice not less than 15 working days before the date of expiry of your insurance policy. It is also required to include with the notice your no claims discount certificate. You will need this certificate if you want to renew your motor insurance with a different insurance company."
The OP is not a victim, just a person who relies on others for reminders of important events.
DirectDevil
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Thanks for that.
Link http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2007/si/74/made/en/print
Is that requirement mandatory for every possible renewal scenario ?
A further update on the renewal notice situation. Having been given the very clear impression from my insurance broker that a renewal notice had been sent out a month before my renewal date, and following on at least one or more phone conversations with them in which I clearly referred to having looked all over the house for that renewal notice but having found no sign of it and repeated my home address more than once to make absolutely sure they had sent it to the right address etc. it has now turned out that they never sent me any renewal notice in the post.
This only became clear when I asked them to send me a copy of all renewal notices sent to me, and was told that they had sent nothing by post, but only sent me a single renewal reminder by email, a month before the renewal date, and a second one a week after my insurance had expired. I didn't see the second email until after I had been stopped at the garda checkpoint, when I went searching for any sign of any communication from my broker around the time renewal was due. I still have found no sign at all of the first email they say they sent me.
I have looked in the Junk mail box etc. and while I found no sign of it there either, interestingly I did find two emails from other insurance companies I had contacted after being stopped at the checkpoint, and both of these messages (one from Quote Devil and one from coverinaclick.ie) had been treated as spam and were due to be deleted, without my ever having seen them, were it not for the fact that I was looking for any emails from my insurance broker. The brokers say that I must have opted to receive renewal notices by email rather than in the post, but I find this really hard to believe as I sometimes have great difficulty getting an internet connection at home and do not at all necessarily check all emails on a regular basis (hence my discovery of the email that was sent a week after my insurance had expired). How can it be proven one way or the other that I would have made such a request?
Anyway - that's the situation as it stands at the moment. My last insurance premium before all of this was €355. By last Wednesday, after many inquiries to various insurance companies over more than a week, the only quote I could get was €2950, which I have now paid, having been advised that the only other quote I was going to be offered, if I produced three letters of refusal for my last insurer, was likely to be between €5000 and €10000. I have written the renewal date for next year up on my wall chart. Better start saving now!!
This only became clear when I asked them to send me a copy of all renewal notices sent to me, and was told that they had sent nothing by post, but only sent me a single renewal reminder by email, a month before the renewal date, and a second one a week after my insurance had expired. I didn't see the second email until after I had been stopped at the garda checkpoint, when I went searching for any sign of any communication from my broker around the time renewal was due. I still have found no sign at all of the first email they say they sent me.
I have looked in the Junk mail box etc. and while I found no sign of it there either, interestingly I did find two emails from other insurance companies I had contacted after being stopped at the checkpoint, and both of these messages (one from Quote Devil and one from coverinaclick.ie) had been treated as spam and were due to be deleted, without my ever having seen them, were it not for the fact that I was looking for any emails from my insurance broker. The brokers say that I must have opted to receive renewal notices by email rather than in the post, but I find this really hard to believe as I sometimes have great difficulty getting an internet connection at home and do not at all necessarily check all emails on a regular basis (hence my discovery of the email that was sent a week after my insurance had expired). How can it be proven one way or the other that I would have made such a request?
Anyway - that's the situation as it stands at the moment. My last insurance premium before all of this was €355. By last Wednesday, after many inquiries to various insurance companies over more than a week, the only quote I could get was €2950, which I have now paid, having been advised that the only other quote I was going to be offered, if I produced three letters of refusal for my last insurer, was likely to be between €5000 and €10000. I have written the renewal date for next year up on my wall chart. Better start saving now!!
losttheplot
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Would it be worth contacting the insurance ombudsman about not receiving the notice.
I can remember a report in the Examiner where a young undercover member of the Gardaí went under-cover to investigate boy-racers (+girl racers) in Cork about 20+ years ago.
1. Meeting Points were discovered.
2. Actual "racers" were identified.
3. Some Registration Plates were interfered with to show wrong Registration Numbers.
4. Some had no insurance whatsoever.
5. Most "racers" were not of poor origin and some had expensive cars which had been suped up with additional expense.
6. Some members were there without the knowledge of their parents.
7. Fake printed Insurance Forms were rife in the group.
I can't remember many prosecutions being reported which means some of these likely had contacts who could have the charges waived or withdrawn. What's new?
1. Meeting Points were discovered.
2. Actual "racers" were identified.
3. Some Registration Plates were interfered with to show wrong Registration Numbers.
4. Some had no insurance whatsoever.
5. Most "racers" were not of poor origin and some had expensive cars which had been suped up with additional expense.
6. Some members were there without the knowledge of their parents.
7. Fake printed Insurance Forms were rife in the group.
I can't remember many prosecutions being reported which means some of these likely had contacts who could have the charges waived or withdrawn. What's new?
Brendan Burgess
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A massive Lep in logic there Leper.
There are many other possible reasons apart from your conspiracy theory
1) You say you can't remember. It was 20 years ago, so you may have forgotten.
2) You may not have seen them at the time
3) They may not have been reported
4) As they were young, the Gardai may have exercised discretion
5) The report you read may have been exaggerated and most of the cars were probably insured properly.
And of course, there might be a great conspiracy between the Gardai and the well-off families in Cork to not charge their little dears but to throw the book at the bad working class boys and girls.
I'm not from Cork, but where I am from most of the boy racers didn't come from the well-off families!
They do make the effort to prosecute the little dears too. About 3 years ago my young adult daughter and 2 friends were pelted with eggs from a car with occupants who were circling around Douglas in Cork. One was hit very close to her eye and was very distressed so the trio called the guards who arrived promptly and could see the injury. They said leave it to them, and later the guards took witness statements, and asked the trio to show up in court as witnesses, fully summoned and all. The guard met them in court, sat with them and explained the background.
They had a good idea who the guys were in the “dark car”, got CCTV footage from a local garage, identified all 3 occupants and called them in. 2 agreed it was them, apologised and was cautioned etc. 3rd guy said it was the Dads car and it never happened. So they brought him to court, he showed up with his Dad and a solicitor. The guard went to talk to them, pointed out the three witness and apparently my daughter said he went very white when he discovered the guards had all their ducks in a row and were ready to prosecute there and then. The guard had gone to a lot of trouble to ensure the trio of witnesses showed up, they were reluctant enough, so the driver was hoping the guards would not be able to progress.
The amount of effort the guards put into the prosecution was impressive, so I am guessing they had come to the attention of the guards previously and the guards felt they had evidence to prosecute in this case.