I think you vastly over estimate the number of people who would agree with your point of view. Nowhere near 99% of the worlds population would agree with you, thats clear even from the sampling on this thread, not to mention the well known estimate that 10% of the worlds population is gay.
Do you really believe this post, [quoteYoltan] Good point. I actually have gay friends in longer relationships than most straight people's marriages!.
"Most peoples"....I doubt that very much.
Yes I do actually. Most of my gay friends are in long term relationships. I would class long term as being over 5 years.
I'm Christian (I associate the word 'religious' with a lot of hypocritical behaviour and attitudes so I'm reluctant to use it, but I go to Mass every week).
I'm married (10 years next week - and still haven't killed each other!). I got married in a church, with a priest, the whole thing.
I also got married knowing (and being fully open about it) that I didn't want to have kids.
Friends of mine, a couple (both women), are also married and have recently had a baby. I'm very happy for them and am glad the baby will grow up in a happy, stable home.
I'm definitely for same-sex marriage. And not just the legal bit. I got married in a church because it meant a lot to me to have my union blessed by God and my community. I'm guessing that for spiritual gay and lesbian couples such a blessing would be important to them too. The only difference between their marriage and mine is plumbing - I chose not to put mine to the purpose that nature intended, just as a couple without the necessary combination of 'plumbing' can choose to get around that problem - with the medical science or by adopting.
To be honest, I've more of a problem with hetrosexual people too careless with their ability to make babies, making unplanned babies outside of the support and security of a permanent, commited relationship, which is difficult for everyone involved. Or those who choose to marry in a church for whom the ceremony has no spiritual meaning - why not have your wedding ceremony reflect your beliefs and values?
Anything that supports promotes stable, secure relationships (regardless of the plumbing of the people involved!) and allows people to celebrate their relationships is a good thing by my book.
should dominatrix and the such not be allowed adopt? if there are loving people out there that can raise children in a happy home then let them. if they want to take the final step in showing commitment even to just eachother and not for any other reasons then let them be.
Most parents I know would like their kids to grow up with the same social mores as themselves.
And would like them to be as genetically close as possible.
Where does this leave homosexuals who adapt.
Not necessarily a good thing though, who's to say those social mores are right/shared with the general population. If we say that this point is irrelevant, then the same applies to gay parents.
Ask any heterosexual parents that you know. Why say the point is irrlevant?
Sounding very close to eugenics there, not sure what circles you hang out with. But in all honesty, a child of the human variety is as close to "genetically close" as you can expect to get. It also goes against the simple aspect of increased adoptions from China and African nations. Seems like a lot of parent don't care for the "genetics" of a child, they just want to give a child a home and support.
That may be so. But we are talking about what most people think/do. I had an idea that someone would mention eugenics. While we're on topic here, just as homosexual pairings were frowned upon thirty or forty years ago ......... eugenics may come of age. If and when it does happen there may be a discussion like the present one on the AAM of the day.
Your logic is flawed I'm afraid. Firslty, your assumption of "most parents you know" being either correct and not just thought up on the spot and that it applies across all parents.
Yes, across all parents ......... that I know.
I assume what you're basically saying is that gay couples will only want gay babies, which is of course a complete load of nonsense.
If they were completely at ease with their selves then they would. Tell me why they wouldn't?
Though if you do have any data or reports to back up these assumptions, please do tell. Happy?
Yes I do actually. Most of my gay friends are in long term relationships. I would class long term as being over 5 years.
Just to clarify yoltan you said you know gay people who are in long term relationships and then went on to say that they have been together longer than most straight peoples marriages.
Just to clue you in to reality...
Most people go out for a couple of years before they get married have you taken this into account in your thought process or are you just comparing going out with someone to going out with someone and then getting married.
Compare like with like.
You can't compare like with like, as gay people can't get married. I think thats the point!
Just to clue YOU in to reality....which as you may realise depends entirely on your perspective, out of all the couples I know, of different ages, the two happiest couples I know are gay couples. My uncle married his partner of 25 years a few years ago as soon as it was legalised in their home country, and I can't think of any couple who would have made better parents. They are long term committed, rich, educated, have a fabulous home, a strong social network, and are some of the most loving, caring people I have ever known. The fact that they couldn't have children (if that was what they wanted) is a crime, in my opinion. Any child who got them as parents would have been a lucky kid. Hell, I'm in my 30's and would like them to adopt me!!!
But some people just don't realise that!!
A close friend (since school) and my uncle are the two gay people I know best. My uncle is a bit nuts (nothing to do with being gay) so he’d make a brutal parent but my friend is one of the most balanced people I know. The issue is not if gay people make good parents, to me that’s like asking if people with freckles make good parents as the sexual orientation of the parent is completely irrelevant. How could it possible affect the ability of a person to love a child? The only reservation I have is the bias of others toward an adopted child of a gay couple.
I have been thinking about this a bit over the last few days and I suppose the best solution is to allow gay couples to adopt but retain the criteria that the best interests of the child should be taken into account when selecting adoptive parents. In other words age, marital status, income, mental state, stability of the relationship etc should all be allowed to be taken into account when assessing the suitability of prospective adoptive parents.
I am not saying that I don’t have reservations about the whole issue of gay adoption (and I admit that my reservations may be nothing more than my own subtle bias) but if we are all equal under the law (and I see this as a basic right) then it is logical that the same rights should extend to all. Therefore if I, as a heterosexual man, have the right to marry and/or adopt children then so should a homosexual man or woman. Otherwise we are not all equal and that is not acceptable.
The problem here with your post is that you are thinking singular whereas children need both sexes to have a balanced life.
...if we are all equal under the law (and I see this as a basic right) then it is logical that the same rights should extend to all. Therefore if I, as a heterosexual man, have the right to marry and/or adopt children then so should a homosexual man or woman. Otherwise we are not all equal and that is not acceptable.
Excellent post, and very articulately made point.
SLF - This balance you keep 'yackking' on about (sorry couldnt resist). Do you not accept that children will see both male and female role models in ordinary life, at school, through friendships, family etc...
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