Gay Marraige For or Against
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Just to be clear, I have never had the desire to marry or have children. I don't believe it's to do with being gay, it's just who I am. My partner and I are both very happy in our relationship and right know don't feel the need to marry (even if we could). We certainly wouldn't run out tomorrow and get married if it became legal today. Maybe that will change, who knows? But I certainly do not feel that I have any right to stop people from having that entitlement. I support it in any way I can.
Excellent post coolaboola. Sorry I'm only getting to read it all now. You have a fantastic approach to this issue.
hi, when i said my friend was unhappy, it seems to have come from the fact that he cant have a 'normal' life like others, he woudl love to marry and to raise a family. but as it stands he cant. that is why he isnt happy. he is happy in himself but in his circle, not generalising, he finds it more difficult to find a lasting realtionship and for the other reasons mentioned here, he will have to see all his other friends marry and have children, something he wishes in his life but cant happen until people get over it. unless peoples actions or choices in life cause harm to others, they should be left do as they wish! its a lifestyle choice, a sexual preference something that shouldnt be judged because its not the norm. should dominatrix and the such not be allowed adopt? if there are loving people out there that can raise children in a happy home then let them. if they want to take the final step in showing commitment even to just eachother and not for any other reasons then let them be.
Not sure how that example will go down (pardon the pun). But to me this is the point. In my second sweeping generalisation in as many minutes, the very people opposed to such things as same sex adoption are against "nanny state" tactics and excessive interference from the state. Yet it is fine to ignore that belief and condone what is in effect the state having a say in who can and can't adopt.
The problem is where does their support for state intereference end? What if they state say your political beliefs should prohibit you from adoption? After all, could it be said that fascist tendencies and beliefs could result in a less than balanced child? Why not step in there then?
If you can't apply the policy across other "abhorent" lifestyles that can also affect the stability of a child, then we're only left with sexuality being the issue. To say in that case you're not homophobic, in that case, flies in the face of logic.
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Simeon
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Most parents I know would like their kids to grow up with the same social mores as themselves. And would like them to be as genetically close as possible. Where does this leave homosexuals who adapt.
Not necessarily a good thing though, who's to say those social mores are right/shared with the general population. If we say that this point is irrelevant, then the same applies to gay parents.
Sounding very close to eugenics there, not sure what circles you hang out with. But in all honesty, a child of the human variety is as close to "genetically close" as you can expect to get. It also goes against the simple aspect of increased adoptions from China and African nations. Seems like a lot of parent don't care for the "genetics" of a child, they just want to give a child a home and support.
Your logic is flawed I'm afraid. Firslty, your assumption of "most parents you know" being either correct and not just thought up on the spot and that it applies across all parents.
I assume what you're basically saying is that gay couples will only want gay babies, which is of course a complete load of nonsense.
Though if you do have any data or reports to back up these assumptions, please do tell.
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Simeon
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Not necessarily a good thing though, who's to say those social mores are right/shared with the general population. If we say that this point is irrelevant, then the same applies to gay parents.
Ask any heterosexual parents that you know. Why say the point is irrlevant?
Sounding very close to eugenics there, not sure what circles you hang out with. But in all honesty, a child of the human variety is as close to "genetically close" as you can expect to get. It also goes against the simple aspect of increased adoptions from China and African nations. Seems like a lot of parent don't care for the "genetics" of a child, they just want to give a child a home and support.
That may be so. But we are talking about what most people think/do. I had an idea that someone would mention eugenics. While we're on topic here, just as homosexual pairings were frowned upon thirty or forty years ago ......... eugenics may come of age. If and when it does happen there may be a discussion like the present one on the AAM of the day.
Your logic is flawed I'm afraid. Firslty, your assumption of "most parents you know" being either correct and not just thought up on the spot and that it applies across all parents.
Yes, across all parents ......... that I know.
I assume what you're basically saying is that gay couples will only want gay babies, which is of course a complete load of nonsense.
If they were completely at ease with their selves then they would. Tell me why they wouldn't?
Though if you do have any data or reports to back up these assumptions, please do tell. Happy?
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S.L.F
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Just to clarify yoltan you said you know gay people who are in long term relationships and then went on to say that they have been together longer than most straight peoples marriages.
Just to clue you in to reality...
Most people go out for a couple of years before they get married have you taken this into account in your thought process or are you just comparing going out with someone to going out with someone and then getting married.
Compare like with like.
Zzzzzzzzzzz.......
Thank you Jaybird. And there are many, MANY couples out there just like them. But some people just don't realise that!!
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S.L.F
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But some people just don't realise that!!
I'm glad you put a sarcastic smiley beside your last statement
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S.L.F
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Any chance of locking this thread?
A close friend (since school) and my uncle are the two gay people I know best. My uncle is a bit nuts (nothing to do with being gay) so he’d make a brutal parent but my friend is one of the most balanced people I know. The issue is not if gay people make good parents, to me that’s like asking if people with freckles make good parents as the sexual orientation of the parent is completely irrelevant. How could it possible affect the ability of a person to love a child? The only reservation I have is the bias of others toward an adopted child of a gay couple.
I have been thinking about this a bit over the last few days and I suppose the best solution is to allow gay couples to adopt but retain the criteria that the best interests of the child should be taken into account when selecting adoptive parents. In other words age, marital status, income, mental state, stability of the relationship etc should all be allowed to be taken into account when assessing the suitability of prospective adoptive parents.
I am not saying that I don’t have reservations about the whole issue of gay adoption (and I admit that my reservations may be nothing more than my own subtle bias) but if we are all equal under the law (and I see this as a basic right) then it is logical that the same rights should extend to all. Therefore if I, as a heterosexual man, have the right to marry and/or adopt children then so should a homosexual man or woman. Otherwise we are not all equal and that is not acceptable.
I have been thinking about this a bit over the last few days and I suppose the best solution is to allow gay couples to adopt but retain the criteria that the best interests of the child should be taken into account when selecting adoptive parents. In other words age, marital status, income, mental state, stability of the relationship etc should all be allowed to be taken into account when assessing the suitability of prospective adoptive parents.
I am not saying that I don’t have reservations about the whole issue of gay adoption (and I admit that my reservations may be nothing more than my own subtle bias) but if we are all equal under the law (and I see this as a basic right) then it is logical that the same rights should extend to all. Therefore if I, as a heterosexual man, have the right to marry and/or adopt children then so should a homosexual man or woman. Otherwise we are not all equal and that is not acceptable.
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S.L.F
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The problem here with your post is that you are thinking singular whereas children need both sexes to have a balanced upbringing.
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So if I dropped dead tomorrow my kids would all be screwed up?
There are plenty of children raised by their mothers (and grandmothers) because the father has buggered off. I don't think it is essential but I do think it's desirable. That said children of gay men are not kept away from women (the men in question may even have mothers or sisters!) so it doesn't mean that they will have no female role models. The same is true for gay women.
As I said I have reservations but that should not override basic equality.
truthseeker
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Excellent post, and very articulately made point.
SLF - This balance you keep 'yackking' on about (sorry couldnt resist
). Do you not accept that children will see both male and female role models in ordinary life, at school, through friendships, family etc...
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S.L.F
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Excellent post, and very articulately made point.
SLF - This balance you keep 'yackking' on about (sorry couldnt resist
It's not yackking it's yacking
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